Star Wars Battlefront [PS4, XO]

[Shifty Geezer]

Nothing about the snow really stands out to me.

The lighting in that scene was perfect. Like a photograph. Of course, it's only snow, but the shading was completely convincing.

Back to the vaunted forest bit. I'm seeing very little vegetative motion there for a forest. It's not very noticeable because of the camera pan which is keeping everything in motion but if you want to sense of the vegetive fakery focus on the two bushes that get hit by the laser blast around 1:43 and the way both bushes rock back and forth like pots.

Yep, plant physics is limited in this early build. I don't think people talking about how pretty the forest looks were focussing on the movements. Dancing flowers aren't that common on Endor.

The lack of movement is jarring for me. Trees and plants should move. Shadows cast from the leafy canopy above should be casting shifting shadows on the ground but.. there is nothing.

The clips are (fractions of) seconds long. Compare the in game footage to the real life footage of those forests. The only real life motion I see is when the guy brushes past the bush. The rest of the forest is static. In real life!

 

[Karamazov]

Since vegetation is moving in bf4 its obvious it won't be static in this game. But then in real dense forests like that, winds are stopped by trees so ground végétation does not move much.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

The clips are (fractions of) seconds long. Compare the in game footage to the real life footage of those forests. The only real life motion I see is when the guy brushes past the bush. The rest of the forest is static. In real life!

I think you maybe looking at scenes that were shot on the sound stage in London, or where they used composites or one of the many matte pictures they were so fond of for backgrounds. If you look at scenes of Luke and Leia on the speeder, you'll notice it doesn't affect most of the scenery because it's not real

2Mb GIF that shows plants moving in Return of the Jedi.I can post more, there are lots of scenes where the forest behaves like a forest.

Spoiler

Note that there is motion before actors start moving through the frame.

Since vegetation is moving in bf4 its obvious it won't be static in this game. But then in real dense forests like that, winds are stopped by trees so ground végétation does not move much.

It's also dangerous to assume that something we had in a previous engine will make it to the next game, particularly with DICE. Like destructive environments that were in Battlefield 2 and 3 and not 4. With regard to ground foliage the above suggests otherwise but even if we ignore the video, why are the shadows on the ground not dancing with the tree canopies above?

The reason it looks so weird is because this is what we've had in Crysis, Uncharted, Far Cry, Tomb Raider, The Last of Us, The Forest - even Minecraft with shader packs. There is vegetative uncanny valley Particularly the way those two plants rock like rigid structures when hit with the blast.

 

[Karamazov]

it'll move accordingly, and shadows too, they can't make such a good looking endor forest and let it static.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

it'll move accordingly, and shadows too, they can't make such a good looking endor forest and let it static.

Of course they can. As has been discussed in these forums literally hundreds of times, everything about the presentation of games is a result of decisions and compromises.

If the most of the time, when you're in a forest, you are moving fast then dynamic plants and shadows may be a sacrifice that's willing to be made.

If it was something that was easy and without effort those effects would already be in that build and visible.

 

[Karamazov]

sacrifices will be made for consoles versions of course !

 

[Deleted member 11852]

That's really weird because I can hear sound effects; the incoming blast, the guy jumping on the speeder, the speeder accelerating away.

edit: ok I see you edited your post to remove that comment.

 

[Karamazov]

i should not watch videos without sound

 

[fehu]

maybe we must merge this thread with those about the best light and the gap between cg and games

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I think you maybe looking at scenes that were shot on the sound stage in London...

I'm talking about the shots in that YT video. It shows the production crew in the forest from 1:05 to 1:09, and it's static. That's the real forest, not moving. Hence, a scene of a forest where the plants aren't moving is perfectly natural.

The reason it looks so weird is because this is what we've had in Crysis, Uncharted, Far Cry, Tomb Raider, The Last of Us, The Forest - even Minecraft with shader packs. There is vegetative uncanny valley Particularly the way those two plants rock like rigid structures when hit with the blast.

Yes, those plants do look awkward. If the final game looks like that, it'll be an issue. Looking at the pretties though, and not the physics, the forest looks lush and convincing. I dunno about better than any other forest in a game, but it does look good.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I'm talking about the shots in that YT video. It shows the production crew in the forest from 1:05 to 1:09, and it's static. That's the real forest, not moving. Hence, a scene of a forest where the plants aren't moving is perfectly natural.

I know real forests do have calm and still moments, the tree outside my window is pretty still right now.

The dilemma is that in games it now just looks weird and broken. If you look at the PSX demo of Uncharted 4 ,the plant movement is exaggerated but it adds life to the environment. The same is true of Assassin's Creed IV, Crysis, Tomb Raider and the other games I've mentioned. If you want an environment to feel alive, it's an easier sell if it acts alive, i.e. moving.

I think this is particularly an issue in games because folks who've been playing games a while will remember when solid unmoving trees and vegetation was a limit of the technology, which we've since been liberated from. A return to unmoving forests looks terrible to me. Subjective I know.

edit: typos/grammar.

 

[Davros]

folks who've been playing games a while will remember when solid unmoving trees and vegetation was a limit of the technology,

Derek Smart created a fps with forests the tress were not solid and unmoving, in fact you could walk right through them. He was not pleased when people criticized the game for that.
"Are you people stupid cant you work out the trees are just there for decoration it doesnt matter if you can walk through them"

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Derek Smart created a fps with forests the tress were not solid and unmoving, in fact you could walk right through them.

Does he work at DICE now?

 

[Cjail]

I know real forests do have calm and still moments, the tree outside my window is pretty still right now.

The dilemma is that in games it now just looks weird and broken. If you look at the PSX demo of Uncharted 4 ,the plant movement is exaggerated but it adds life to the environment. The same is true of Assassin's Creed IV, Crysis, Tomb Raider and the other games I've mentioned. If you want an environment to feel alive, it's an easier sell if it acts alive, i.e. moving.

I agree.
We don't "question" a still forest when we see one but we do question it in a video games because the stillness is anyway an artifice.
In Dragon's Dogma the ever moving grass and trees IMO helped tremendously to make the land look alive and believable but of course in nature the wind doesn't always shake the barely

BTW if memory serves me in The Return of The Jedi the forest was very still..aside for the explosion I mean

 

[Malo]

Derek Smart created a fps with forests the tress were not solid and unmoving, in fact you could walk right through them. He was not pleased when people criticized the game for that.
"Are you people stupid cant you work out the trees are just there for decoration it doesnt matter if you can walk through them"

I always loved Derek Smart quotes.

 

[Newguy]

http://starwars.ea.com/news/battlefront-to-debut-at-celebration

Star Wars™ Battlefront™ to Debut at Star Wars™ Celebration (April 16-19)

It seems like such a long time ago (at an E3 press conference far, far away) since we announced we were working on Star Wars™ Battlefront™. Last year, we promised you would “See More in Spring 2015”. Spring is coming.

We’re thrilled to share that Star Wars Battlefront will be taking part in Star Wars™ Celebration next month in Anaheim, CA from April 16-19. We could not think of a better or more appropriate place to debut the game officially for the first time than the premier event that celebrates the Star Wars universe and the legions of fans who have fallen in love with it. For more information on Star Wars Celebration and ways to attend, please visit http://starwarscelebration.com.

 

[Newguy]

Tweet from the lead level designer:

https://twitter.com/DICE_FireWall/status/583634600733310976

"I'm going to answer a question in advance: Yes, that is actually what the game looks like."

So I guess all aboard the hype train?

 

[Laa-Yosh]

I certainly am.

 

[Malo]

He didn't say on console.

 

[L. Scofield]

The vegetation didn't move in the reference shots. Looks so unrealistic... lol. You guys should pay more attention before making a fuss. If you look at the bottom right during this shot you can see moving shadows: