How do you know that? Is this about "most if not all games will support neo" statement?
PS4 Pro Speculation (PS4K NEO Kaio-Ken-Kutaragi-Kaz Neo-san)
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Neo sounds much less threatening based on House's comments. Not coming for longer, not at E3, sold alongside PS4 with total back compatibility on all titles...more expensive
I heard a guy on a podcast talk about how MS doing an iterative console made sense to him, and he likened it to MS's Elite controller. It would just be a Elite console. Something sold just for those who want the best. Not really something to supplant the status quo. Just only an additive, minority kind of thing.
That sounds exactly like how Sony is (PLANNING ON, hint) treating the Neo.
Scorpio OTOH sounds almost really like a new gen, and if rumors are true it wont release until XBO is four years old anyway, so only a year ahead of normal.
I heard a guy on a podcast talk about how MS doing an iterative console made sense to him, and he likened it to MS's Elite controller. It would just be a Elite console. Something sold just for those who want the best. Not really something to supplant the status quo. Just only an additive, minority kind of thing.
That sounds exactly like how Sony is (PLANNING ON, hint) treating the Neo.
Scorpio OTOH sounds almost really like a new gen, and if rumors are true it wont release until XBO is four years old anyway, so only a year ahead of normal.
trainplane
Newcomer
Neo very much seems like Sony's grand experiment into the mainstream-premium model. Many companies do this. The mainstream part sells in larger numbers (think GTX 950, 960) with less profit and the high end is where they rack up huge profits for the smaller segment willing to pay more (Titan X). The ones who don't care about bang for buck, but care about the big bang whatever the cost. That's why I think it will be at least $100 difference.
Cars do this, iPhones do this, TVs do this, etc.
So it's less about iterative consoles and more about segmentation. It's an interesting approach and I'm excited to see if this will work or fail in the console space.
RancidLunchmeat
Veteran
Yep, that's pretty much my thoughts exactly. Sony is the one experimenting with incrementally upgraded consoles. MS is doing a refresh (typical) and then starting the next generation.
Michellstar
Regular
Yep, also this "Developers should also see a “seamless” experience between the two versions, he said, requiring a “small but manageable” amount of extra work when creating a game for both."
So, I believe using defective Neo socs as the regular PS4 model wont´t work, It would introduce another hurdle for devs, assuming that it'll be polaris, and an upgraded jaguar cpu (puma whatever)
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Michellstar
Regular
Sure, they can.
But, is it worth the effort??
I mean, one of the main reasons presented here for Neo, is that Orbis won´t give an optimal shrink, especially its memory controller, hence Neo could be even smaller than Orbis at 28nm, doubling up CUs.
Time will tell.
Update from one of the original leaker of Neo (the untrustworthy retailer):
Lower end plan A could have a 499$ price (maybe the rumored 4.2tflops GPU)
Plan b is (always was apparently) ~5.5 tflops with a steep (unrealistic) price, specs still slightly under Scorpio, but better CPU (and obviously GPU) than plan A:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=207050836&postcount=339
Lower end plan A could have a 499$ price (maybe the rumored 4.2tflops GPU)
Plan b is (always was apparently) ~5.5 tflops with a steep (unrealistic) price, specs still slightly under Scorpio, but better CPU (and obviously GPU) than plan A:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=207050836&postcount=339
Because Sony already have a signed agreement with AMD and have paid the money already.
I'm not seeing why NEO needs to compete with Scorpio at this moment in time.... IMO NEO seems like a solution to getting a better VR experience on PS4 whereas Scorpio seems like a solution to spec battle AND a solution to allow for VR experience on Xbox.
Slightly different needs by the platform holders so I'm not sure direct comparisons make much sense, to put it another way if you are not into VR I'm not sold on the idea NEO will offer much. We probably need to see how Scorpio is able to gain market-share over a quarter or two to see how it might change things for MS.
I'd also like to hear developers comment on the impact of development cost and time for these new machines, for example will they pass on the cost of NEO/Scorpio versions of future games onto the consumer?
Slightly different needs by the platform holders so I'm not sure direct comparisons make much sense, to put it another way if you are not into VR I'm not sold on the idea NEO will offer much. We probably need to see how Scorpio is able to gain market-share over a quarter or two to see how it might change things for MS.
I'd also like to hear developers comment on the impact of development cost and time for these new machines, for example will they pass on the cost of NEO/Scorpio versions of future games onto the consumer?
Apples to oranges? Neo will be over 3x the power at less than double the price.
Does anyone have data on 4k TV adoption rates anyways? Most people I know have 1080P TVs with more and more 4K ready sets being bought but many people I know still have 1080P/720P televisions. Of course as these older TVs wear out new ones bought will be 4k so replacement and the seemingly high deflation in television set cost will likely accelerate the adoption but it would probably be helpful to know the percentages of who owns what as that might help us better understand the relative demand/market for 4k output based on market size today and the overall growth trend.
This whole thing might go over as well as the 3D TVs and BR disk did a few years ago.....
My personal hunch again is there may turn out to be a stronger correlation between PSVR and NEO than anything else.
This whole thing might go over as well as the 3D TVs and BR disk did a few years ago.....
My personal hunch again is there may turn out to be a stronger correlation between PSVR and NEO than anything else.
With current hw being quite mainstream it really doesn't make sense to start new console cycles from 0 again. How many people would buy new iphone, android, desktop/laptop if it meant you loose all the content and apps? Add to that a 2-3 year wait for the good versions of the app coming available that you used to have.
It makes a lot of sense to keep things backwards compatible and build incremental business model instead of disrupting yourself every so often.
It makes a lot of sense to keep things backwards compatible and build incremental business model instead of disrupting yourself every so often.
AMD RX 480 review has shown that it only consumes about 100W（I don't know why TDP is 150W but 100W makes sense considering RX480 uses 14nm FinFet process).
I am curious that if the 4.1 TF performance in the first development kit is final spec. If RX 480 really consumes 100W , which is close to GPU of PS4-1000 model, than GPU of PS4 neo can increase its performance more than 5TF under 100W power consumption.
I am curious that if the 4.1 TF performance in the first development kit is final spec. If RX 480 really consumes 100W , which is close to GPU of PS4-1000 model, than GPU of PS4 neo can increase its performance more than 5TF under 100W power consumption.
AMD could be leaving room for power increases and for product simplification. The specification allows for 75 or 150 as the choices, and it is unlikely there's going to be a case for a cooling solution with fractional dissipation between them.
Another factor is that AMD probably isn't determining TDP by running a few benchmarks on one chip and calling it a day.
It is a design specification that needs to apply for all chips in a batch of hundreds of thousands or more and across various workloads not reviewed. Then some margin could be left in to play it safe.
Agreements can be amended and I doubt AMD would be all that against a delay in return for a Sony sourcing a part requiring more silicon and providing more revenue to AMD.
I rather see Sony just transition to a console, it can market as a next generation part rather then create a something most regard as a mid-gen upgrade.
I don't see the benefits of mid-gen console parts. You are simply creating more work and making manufacturing more expensive.
I understand that VR and 4K are influencing Sony and others to produce hardware that can meet those needs. I just think console makers would be better off accelerating their next gen plans versus trying to sell mid-gen parts.
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Umm, more than likely there are a boat load of clauses on amending or terminating such contracts, especially organizations of their respective sizes and standings within the business world. I wouldn't be surprise either if Nvidia isn't still buzzing around on mucking things up further.
Wasn't there talk about the PS4 Neo console cases already being manufactured and having their production being ramped up? If so, that's a possible sunk cost if they're going to change the internal specs of the box it likely means they will need to redesign and recreate the cases.
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