Predict: The Next Generation Console Tech
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The stuff I was reading yesterday was talking about A15s going up to 2.5gHz. A couple of years, a few tens of millions of dollars and a big heatsink may well be able to extend that.
Very interesting... if sony doing this,Apple maybe doing the same:
http://www.overclockersclub.com/news/28250/
ARM growing fast... and ARM on NGP and ARM on ps4 could be very interesting (PSN in some kind of cloud computing?).
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Fake.
BTW I've read that Sony's new notebook computers will use CELL2 and run Windows under emulation...
Isn't it funny that all of a sudden the Sony goons are slowly starting to come out of the woodwork when PS4 and CELL is the topic of discussion?
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Do you think that Microsoft will switch to ARM in order to have a standardized architecture over all their embedded lines between smartphones, tablets, consoles and desktop PCs? They could cut a killer deal if only because whomsoever would make the ARM architecture for the Xbox 3 would also find they have the reference design for Windows 8 ARM coming out in 2012.
Do you think ARM will have a performance competitive option for a 200+ watt box in 2013-14? Or do you think MS will forgo efforts at a significant performance jump?
Really fake, click bait.
First and foremost they claim that the 360 uses Cell
and also claim that it has been used for nearly ten years!Second, they claim that the factory they got back off Toshiba is going to be used for Cells when all reports have pointed to it being used for camera sensors.
Third, Sony would be stupid to try and stuff Cells into laptops, remember SPURS and how well that went?
I can see no use what so ever for SPURS or something like it on PC with only one company putting them in systems, just like SPURS they will have just about no software support.
The thing is we won't be seeing a 200W box. The Xbox 360 S is currently around what I expect a next generation console to be, depending on release dates.
It seems to make sense to me to have a lower power CPU which can be used for most basic generic functions such as music/movies etc and keep the overall power consumption low for non game related functionality and on the other extreme having a massive GPU which takes up a large proportion of the die/heat budget when games are being played.
I don't think they'd get away with having obscene idle power consumption in the next few years especially as people become more aware of climate change.
I disagree. If there isn't a significant performance jump, people won't buy it. You're not going to get that huge performance jump without significant power use.
I don't think people care about these things as much as you think, certainly not where it impacts quality. Look at how many people on these forums choose plasma over LCD for their HDTV over the last few years. However you can certainly manage that with much better system power management if they care to implement it.
Who is saying there won't be? If they release on 28nm in 2013 or 22nm in 2014 they'll almost certainly have quite good performance per watt to play with. Remember 2012 is 7 years after the launch of the Xbox 360 and 2014 is a whopping 9 years!
They might pick a quieter system over a noisier system for instance? When you're playing a movie all you need is a good fixed function decoder and a few basic ARM cores and you're able to do 1080P decode. Also with game developers wanting to scale games over multiple different architectures in the future it would be best to fall in line with CPU performance and make the difference up with a scalable GPU.
I really think they will need other stuff than raw power,I mean that UE demo from GDC didnt seems like a good reason to update just from visuals and it used 3 top of the line nvidea GPUs, probably as powerful as next gen and with more RAM. Personally it didnt impressed me ormade me want a next gen at all.
Given what we already see today I dont think that performance will be that much important.
But you're using a 2010 system as your power target. So that's a whopping 4 years, all assuming they wait until 2014. The current consoles came out as competitive with PC performance when they were released, I expect them to approach that again. They might not come out as loss leaders, but I think they'll want to "WOW" the market nonetheless. You do that with performance.
People won't be dropping $400 on a new box just to play movies, my current box already does that just fine. As long as it doesn't sound like your vacuum I don't think sound and low power are really big concerns for most consumers. There have been a lot of advancements on powering down portions of systems not in use in the last 5 years, all of which make more sense than hamstringing your performance for the "green" crowd.
Megadrive1988
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However if you were to compare a modern CGPU which has been designed for a particular process node and with the latest technology to a console you'll find that the console is the one which falls woefully short in efficiency and performance per watt.
I don't really see how a console is going to beat the PC platform when that platform can bring multiple 300W graphics cards to play. So I don't think they're really going to bother with that.
I'd love to see that study, how did it look in 2005?
Can't beat a bleeding edge PC (not that fixed hardware doesn't offer significant advantages), might as well not bother being competitive? I don't see the logic.
Well beuing competitive depends on the competition, if it's simply about beating the Wi2. It's depressing but it's an option.
Thanks
the SGX is really is suited for mobile devices, not next gen console I am afraid.Err, looking at the way PowerVR progresses with each generation, I am very doubtful Series 6 will reach 1 TFLOPs even in MP16 config @ 800 MHz. And the core is tiny, in 200 mm^2 you'll likely can fit more than 16.
Sony need to pay them to design something for PS4, I don't think Series 6 will have enough grunt. Maybe Sony can ask them to build their TBDR around the SPUs. That would be something.
SGX 6 isn't going to be DX12, but with suitable programmable compute power, that may not be an issue. Like Cell running compute-shader code in Frostbite 2. If SGX cores were the Visualiser units of a graphics Cell...that's quite a good idea actually! Cell's with SPUs and SGX cores...Thanks
The main 'problem' with SGX's peak performance is that it's always in low-power devices. If it scales linearly, there's nothing to stop someone putting loads of cores into a larger, hotter chip. Given that SGX offers the best performance per watt and per degree temperature, all things being equal (which they're not), given the same power and thermal parameters of an nVidia or ATi part, SGX should be competitive. However there are features and all sorts to worry about. I wouldn't write SGX off entirely though. It may not offer the best performance for a PS4, say, but the end result would be useable and if in a unified multidevice architecture, I dare say the added value and development advantages would afford the platform more consumer interest that more raw graphics power would. Sony would ahve more to gain from this than MS. MS can use whatever hardware and their DX software layer to enable cross-device compatibility.
Shifty Excellent post!
Let me dream a little more ...
Visualizer cell gpu ... maybe could solve problems with PS3 backwards putting an ARM for cpu for "universe PS4 and NGP" * as GPU :Cell + and SGX as pixel engine ...just a (extremely crazy) thought.
* (some kind boot like "mode 1" = ARM cpu work with SGX and "Mode 2"= cell gpu visualizer with SGX)
Let me dream a little more ...
Visualizer cell gpu ... maybe could solve problems with PS3 backwards putting an ARM for cpu for "universe PS4 and NGP" * as GPU :Cell + and SGX as pixel engine ...just a (extremely crazy) thought.
* (some kind boot like "mode 1" = ARM cpu work with SGX and "Mode 2"= cell gpu visualizer with SGX)
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Svensk Viking
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If Sony were to continue with an improved Cell and allow backwards compatibility, is it then reasonable to expect PS3 games to have better performance on the PS4 than when played on the PS3?
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