Pachter: Apple 2013 Console

[Shifty Geezer]

This concept of breaking down everything to be acceptable and pleasing to everyone sickens me...

But on the flip side, if you worked damned hard and poured your heart and soul into an artistic creation only to have it flop and you struggle to make a living, you'd be feeling a damned sight sicker than any consumer wanting art ever would. If people want diveristy (or whatever else), they need to be willing to pay for it. Game devs have a hard enough life as is without some people expecting them to sacrifice even more.

Actually being on topic, and reading what Nakajima actually said,

"If we do go down that path, it's not going to be what you see on the market today, [which are] more watered down, less 'core' experiences," he continued. "We like to make games for core gamers, so if we take that approach, it's going to be a core experience on a tablet, something that gamers are going to love."

This is another major dev looking at targeting iOS and Android, taking the console experience to a much larger install base. 'Proper' games are going to be appearing on those platforms, and they will grow to take more from the console-market dollars, making the prospect of an iOS box ever stronger. Will we see a sudden iBox announcement next year as Pachter predicted. Hard to say, but if the core games are available then the chance is definitely there.

 

[Prophecy2k]

...

If the titles sold 1m each and the studio is having problems making ends meet, the problem isn't in the game, the problem is in the process of making the game.
...

FromSoftware is a pretty large developer, and whilst Demon/Dark Souls were successful and profitable projects in isolation, they likely aren't enough in terms of generating sales revenue to carry the entire company. I imagine that just like Epic games, they're looking at tablet/smartphone developement in order to diversify their gaming portfolio with smaller investment/reasonable return iOS/android projects.

Can't blame them, but i do hope they don't bastardise the Demon/Dark Souls IP for touchscreen portables. Make a new IP if you want to make iOS/Android games.

 

[patsu]

I'm not convinced that touch screens can't offer better control schemes.

I think touchscreen is alright for most purposes. It is better than dual sticks for some games or genre. Super quick action will be faster with a h/w button click no doubt.

Here's Microsoft's answer...

Microsoft cuts touchscreen lag to 1ms, makes other panels look silly (video)
http://www.engadget.com/2012/03/10/microsoft-cuts-touchscreen-lag-to-1ms/

Looks like we will have quick touchscreen action in future pads and phones in the near future.

 

[wco81]

I don't think latency has been the complaint about touch screen controls, though lower latency is always welcome.

People want to be able to use the controls without having to look at them. So the D-pads and buttons at the bottom part of a screen is hard to get used to, because they're trying to translate the physical control paradigm to touchscreen.

Developers have to come up with a new way. Like I said, directly tapping on the area of the screen in some games may offer you advantages, including not dealing with the control by feel issue.

 

[patsu]

In general, I don't feel the lag in touch display say... compared to motion gaming. The bigger problem is the developers misusing the technology. The "Draw Something" game we play now has good enough response time. OTOH, the touch screen QTEs in the last Uncharted fight was somewhat buggy. I died 20+ times. Hope Bend patch it.

 

[AntShaw]

People want to be able to use the controls without having to look at them. So the D-pads and buttons at the bottom part of a screen is hard to get used to, because they're trying to translate the physical control paradigm to touchscreen.

Developers have to come up with a new way. Like I said, directly tapping on the area of the screen in some games may offer you advantages, including not dealing with the control by feel issue.

Haptic screens could go a long way in solving this problem.

 

[TheChefO]

But on the flip side, if you worked damned hard and poured your heart and soul into an artistic creation only to have it flop and you struggle to make a living, you'd be feeling a damned sight sicker than any consumer wanting art ever would. If people want diveristy (or whatever else), they need to be willing to pay for it. Game devs have a hard enough life as is without some people expecting them to sacrifice even more.

Agreed,
That's why I said if they're having a problem after selling 1m+ copies then the issue isn't the game, the issue is the development process.

No developer should feel the need to start pushing titles on ipad just to make ends meet.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Agreed,
That's why I said if they're having a problem after selling 1m+ copies then the issue isn't the game, the issue is the development process.

No developer should feel the need to start pushing titles on ipad just to make ends meet.

That's not what they said, that they were having trouble making ends meet with million sellers.

"We've always been about making games for the core gamer," Nakajima explained. "And they weren't necessarily games that did well financially, which is too bad.

That is, lot of their previous, Japan-o-centric games (a lot of Armoured Core titles), weren't commercial big hitters.

The success of both Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, which have each sold over a million [copies] per title worldwide, has made us shift our thinking internally to not just core gamers, but to globalize our products, that they can be successful on a worldwide scale.

The Souls games reached a wider core-gamer audience, which is how they managed to sell lots. So From Software is looking to create games with wider appeal among the core gamers.

He then goes on to talk about targeting tablet and phone as a new area, but by bringing core games to those devices and not watered down games. Heck, he even says he doesn't look to tablets+phones as where to get their money from.

"We know what butters our bread, obviously it's consumer games," Takeuchi explained. "That's where we see some of our key strengths. That being said, as developers, we like to do new things and new challenges will help us mature and grow as a developer. Smart phones and tablets are an interesting challenge for us."

"We get money from consumer games, but we want to give tablets+phones a shot as we like a challenge." There's no expectations of making a killing from dumbing down their games to iOS level. Instead, they want to branch out and try the core experience on iOS, as other devs are doing.

 

[TheChefO]

That's not what they said, that they were having trouble making ends meet with million sellers.

That is, lot of their previous, Japan-o-centric games (a lot of Armoured Core titles), weren't commercial big hitters.
The Souls games reached a wider core-gamer audience, which is how they managed to sell lots. So From Software is looking to create games with wider appeal among the core gamers.

He then goes on to talk about targeting tablet and phone as a new area, but by bringing core games to those devices and not watered down games. Heck, he even says he doesn't look to tablets+phones as where to get their money from.

"We get money from consumer games, but we want to give tablets+phones a shot as we like a challenge." There's no expectations of making a killing from dumbing down their games to iOS level. Instead, they want to branch out and try the core experience on iOS, as other devs are doing.

I see what you're saying and I hope your interpretation is correct ...

I still think a serious effort needs to be invested in making game development a more efficient venture which allows more focus on creative aspects.

 

[patsu]

Epic Games thinks Apple could take on game consoles with iPad, Apple TV & controller
http://www.appleinsider.com/article...e_consoles_with_ipad_apple_tv_controller.html

...

Capps said the unveiling of the new iPad last week shows that Apple cares about the game market that has flourished on iOS devices thanks to the App Store. He said Apple is interested in bringing "triple-A," high-quality games to its mobile devices.

Epic Games isn't alone in seeing Apple potentially entering the home console game market with the iPad and a Bluetooth controller accessory. Executives at Electronic Arts also told Reuters that they are closely watching Apple's moves.

"When the iPad gets to the processing power that's equal to an Xbox 360 and it connects to a television, that's no big deal to us — we'll put the game through the iPad and have it display through the television," said Frank Gibeau, president of Electronic Arts' Labels.

...

One survey of game developers conducted last year found most believe Apple and its late co-founder, Steve Jobs, have had the greatest impact on the gaming industry of late. A survey of 1,000 people at the London Games Conference found that 26 percent of respondents said Jobs was the most influential person in the industry, while 46 percent included Jobs in their top five.

Meanwhile...

Intel Says Fiber Optic Thunderbolt Cables Coming Later This Year
http://www.macrumors.com/2012/03/12...ic-thunderbolt-cables-coming-later-this-year/

One of the promises of Intel's Thunderbolt technology was the possibility for fiber optic cables, offering greater cable lengths and setting the stage for faster connectivity once the standard matures. But Thunderbolt launched using only traditional copper wire cables, and there has been some dispute about just how soon fiber optic cables will become available.

IDG News now reports that Intel as issued a statement indicating that it will be launching fiber optic Thunderbolt cables "later this year".

Intel has said copper cables are adequate for data transfers over short distances of up to six meters. Optical cables will be good for data transfers over longer distances of tens of meters.

The upside to optical is that it allows for longer cable runs, and as the technology develops, more bandwidth, [Intel spokesman Dave] Salvator said in email.

The downside to fiber optic cables, however, is that devices connected using the longer fiber optic cables will require separate power cables, as running power over the cables at those distances is not currently practical. Fiber optic cables are also likely to be significantly more expensive than their copper counterparts, although Intel has not offered any guidance on pricing.

Bah... probably next-next-gen console or a PC/Mac ? ^_^

 

[wco81]

Epic is kind of talking out of the both sides , isn't it? OTOH, it sells console games and licenses the engine/toolchain to make console games.

But it obviously stands to benefit if the engine and tools are used for more mobile games too. I guess they're making some showcase games for iOS, to promote the engine. Bet Apple didn't give them a publishing deal like MS did with Gears of War.

 

[Arwin]

Obviously it is in Epic's best interest to have many platforms running the UE3 engine, as one of the biggest advantages of using UE3 is that it facilitates multi-platform development. Any new platform UE3 can run on should therefore be in their advantage normally. Obviously, when they make an investment in porting their engine to a new platform, there has to be a prospect of people wanting to use the UE3 engine on that platform, otherwise that investment of porting is wasted (though I have no idea how big of an investment that really is).

 

[patsu]

May want to try "Draw Something". It's the latest hit among my circle of friends and families. Yes, it's free. Think they started with $1.99, then $0.99, and then released an advertisement driven version. You can buy/pay to turn off the ads (I believe).

OMG: 5-Week-Old App Draw Something Hits 20 Million Downloads And Generates 6-Figures Per Day
http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-03-12/tech/31146651_1_mobile-app-instagram-users

Three weeks ago, we wrote about OMGPOP's mobile app, Draw Something. The ten-day-old social game had been downloaded more than 1.2 million times.

Now the company has shared even more staggering numbers with us. In just five weeks, the pictionary-like game has been downloaded 20 million times.

...

*Hic* 3,000 drawings per second...

 

[upnorthsox]

My wife was playing that yesterday

 

[Prophecy2k]

OMG: 5-Week-Old App Draw Something Hits 20 Million Downloads And Generates 6-Figures Per Day
http://articles.businessinsider.com/2012-03-12/tech/31146651_1_mobile-app-instagram-users



*Hic* 3,000 drawings per second...

Some of those comparison stats are stupid :-S

I also don't think they understand the point of a pie-chart with the one that's one there

 

[Platon]

I don't know. This makes the believes in mobiles/tablets taking over the consoles, at least in the foreseeable future, crumble even further. So you have a game that sells for 1.99, then .99 and then free and then becomes a huge hit and those are the ones you want to target to sell AAA games, really?...

 

[patsu]

They are probably different people.

Those who are willing to shell out $60 for a game are the minority. They co-exist with the casuals on iOS devices.

You won't be able to sell my wife on these $60 games, but I may bite if there's a good one.

For "Draw Something", yes, I do enjoy the game with my family and friends.

 

[Platon]

They are probably different people.

Those who are willing to shell out $60 for a game are the minority. They co-exist with the casuals on iOS devices.

You won't be able to sell my wife on these $60 games, but I may bite if there's a good one.

For "Draw Something", yes, I do enjoy the game with my family and friends.

Completely agree. I had a reply that turned into a mega rant in another thread but basically yes, two different target groups and thus I don't see why the "core" gaming/consoles will disappear or be taken over, unless that "core" moves to the mobile scene, which I have a hard time seeing...

 

[ERP]

IMO If we're looking 10 years in the future (possibly sooner) I think hardware A vs hardware B is an irrelevancy. It'll be about services and play anywhere.
Experience it on your tablet, your TV, your phone. When you move to a service based model it's all about keeping users engaged on your service regardless of where they are or what they are doing.
To get there IMO you have to give up ownership of the hardware platform, and even parts of the service where established entities exist already. No one is going to compete successfully directly with twitter or facebook at this point, no one wants to rebuild their social network, the cost of change is too high.
I actually think that Amazon, Facebook and Google (to a lesser extent) are in a better position to compete in this space than Apple, though IOS dominance may give them an edge in the short term.

 

[Arwin]

I think if we're going to get proper VR in 10 years we may not actually care that we can't also walk on Mars on our phones. Of course that's just an example but just saying that there will likely just be more of everything for an ever expanding and differentiating audience. The difficult thing for developers/publishers will be figuring out what platform will give the best roi given their capacity, experience and marketing/reputation. And that answer is likely to be different for everyone.