NGGP: NextGen Garbage Pile (aka: No one reads the topics or stays on topic) *spawn*
- Thread starter Barso
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You shouldn't. Everything is rumors until MS and Sony came out with figures themselves.
Btw, I am no where in a position to get info about the next Xbox even if I did work at MS.
Cool, that is what I was saying. You just hear of the different rumors and go by them.
I know some of the things that we know are true, we just don't which ones and we don't know the real info on the chips themselves, just the basics.
No, dedicated units use fixed point math.
Albofighter
Newcomer
I don't really care which one is more powerful as long as they both can handle Samaritan/agnis philosophy at 1080p 60 frames per second with good AA, lots of physics, AI, big environments, etc.
Epic games said they wanted 2+TF for Samaritan at 30 FPS so I'm already disappointed at the rumoured specs. I know people will say wait for the secret sauce but all I expect is compromises to be made whether it's frame rates, resolution, game design...
I hope Orbis has 3D stacking, fast ram, lots of bandwidth, Full HSA, good enough processor and over 2 TF custom GPU. I'd be content with that and it's not even as expensive as it sounds.
Epic games said they wanted 2+TF for Samaritan at 30 FPS so I'm already disappointed at the rumoured specs. I know people will say wait for the secret sauce but all I expect is compromises to be made whether it's frame rates, resolution, game design...
I hope Orbis has 3D stacking, fast ram, lots of bandwidth, Full HSA, good enough processor and over 2 TF custom GPU. I'd be content with that and it's not even as expensive as it sounds.
Inuhanyou
Veteran
^ How do you know what they are able to accomplish with their resources? Unless of course you work for those companies.
Tradeoffs and compromises happen and TDP as well as costs have to be considered for them no matter what kind of set ups they go with.
If your setting yourself up for a super high base standard off the bat, your not doing it right and are going to be disappointed regardless of what happens.
For example,
Agni's philosophy was a much less demanding target according to Square Enix's notes than Samaritan. Agni was running at full 1080p at 60fps with 8xMSAA PLUS FXAA even when unoptimized.
In comparison to Samaritian which was only using FXAA, 30FPS and 1080p and needed 2.5 tflop GPU right off the bat.
How can you expect similar targets for both of them if we know they require different abilities?
And we also know that devs aren't going to be mandating 1080p 60fps across every game, probably not even a majority of them, and that will become even more common as the gen goes on as games become more ambitious and technically complex than they already will be.
I don't understand how people don't see common sense when they are so close to tech every day. We would not have half the technically impressive games we have today if we did like Microsoft tried to do at the beginning of this gen and mandate even 720p for all games, let alone framerates. They just would not have been possible.
Tradeoffs and compromises happen and TDP as well as costs have to be considered for them no matter what kind of set ups they go with.
If your setting yourself up for a super high base standard off the bat, your not doing it right and are going to be disappointed regardless of what happens.
For example,
Agni's philosophy was a much less demanding target according to Square Enix's notes than Samaritan. Agni was running at full 1080p at 60fps with 8xMSAA PLUS FXAA even when unoptimized.
In comparison to Samaritian which was only using FXAA, 30FPS and 1080p and needed 2.5 tflop GPU right off the bat.
How can you expect similar targets for both of them if we know they require different abilities?
And we also know that devs aren't going to be mandating 1080p 60fps across every game, probably not even a majority of them, and that will become even more common as the gen goes on as games become more ambitious and technically complex than they already will be.
I don't understand how people don't see common sense when they are so close to tech every day. We would not have half the technically impressive games we have today if we did like Microsoft tried to do at the beginning of this gen and mandate even 720p for all games, let alone framerates. They just would not have been possible.
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Damn right!!
One day my dream of a MCGA 320x200 game using a next gen console will become true!
Resolution is for suckers, just think of the AA!
One was made by ~20 programers in 2-3 months, and the other one was made with the might of large video game developer who has excellent sense for design and atmosphere.
I never liked demos that were made by Epic....
I'd love a demo crew or some enterprising developer to have a go at a low-res demo just to see what's actually possible. But I suppose advanced techniques (realtime lighting engine) would need a lot of development and not really be worth it if it can't be used in real games.Damn right!!
One day my dream of a MCGA 320x200 game using a next gen console will become true!
Resolution is for suckers, just think of the AA!
Inuhanyou
Veteran
Which dev applies to what circumstance?
We know SE was working on Agni for a little bit. But developing the Luminous engine tools in parallel which took about a year from what i heard.
I thought Samaritan looked cool, but i thought Elemental in particular looked bland, not a good show for the first unveiling of UE4. But you know what? A lot of people were erroneously putting it down as "diminishing returns" because they were not impressed with Elemental, when that simply isn't the case. The art style plays a big part in the visual fidelity, it doesn't mean that you can't be impressed by the graphics anymore.
Albofighter
Newcomer
I don't think my standards are that high for next gen specs. They probably wouldn't lose that much money compared to last gen but we still need to get more details I guess. You're right that engines are not optimized yet for the consoles since hardware is not 100% finalized so I suppose we can still be surprised. All I'm asking for is a strong baseline for next gen with good framerates and a little bit of future proofing.
Remember, this will last a decade and it's not the same as ps360 where they were better then high end pcs at the time. X86 architecture is involved now which means PC advancements will happen much quicker and AMD will apply what they've learned from next gen consoles into future GPU and CPU products right away.
Inuhanyou
Veteran
I think when people say this, they also keep forgetting why devs want powerful console hardware...its because they will be targeting those specs. The PC gamers will get the icing on top from being able to upgrade their hardware with better AA, resolutions, frame rates and whatnot, but by and large everybody will be getting the same experiences.
So it really matters much less than even last generation when consoles were so weak they could not even get the same games as PC because they were just so far behind, that will not happen again.
So it really matters much less than even last generation when consoles were so weak they could not even get the same games as PC because they were just so far behind, that will not happen again.
Inuhanyou
Veteran
We only have general information even for the most consistent rumors.
We have Durango with 8 gigs of ram, DDR3 or 4 is up in the air.
A 1.2 TFLOP level GCN2 GPU
8 jaguar CPU cores clocked at 1.6ghz.
"Secret heavy customizations" which make the whole unit's real world performance more significant than it would be otherwise.
Not much is known about PS4
For Orbis we have 4 gigs of fast ram or 8 gigs of slow ram, and an APU and GPU set up.
We have Durango with 8 gigs of ram, DDR3 or 4 is up in the air.
A 1.2 TFLOP level GCN2 GPU
8 jaguar CPU cores clocked at 1.6ghz.
"Secret heavy customizations" which make the whole unit's real world performance more significant than it would be otherwise.
Not much is known about PS4
For Orbis we have 4 gigs of fast ram or 8 gigs of slow ram, and an APU and GPU set up.
Blazkowicz
Legend
Damn right!!
One day my dream of a MCGA 320x200 game using a next gen console will become true!
Resolution is for suckers, just think of the AA!
I ran Quake 3 at 320x240 with 16xS, for the fun.
It does look better than we'd think
AA really brings you detail that isn't there without AA, too.
Of course, a 17" CRT was forgiving and ran native res everything (and not at thay crappy 60Hz).
LightHeaven
Regular
But even with the same series if the difference is all down to only "floppage" count, the final performance delta (meaning the framerate) wouldn't be anywhere close to 50%.
No, its not right. They looked at forums (b3d and GAF) and practically copied specs posted by couple of people who seems to enjoy thinking they have sources, even though they don't really have any.
1.23TF...Interesting number. Sounds alot like the one I mentioned yesterday and asked where did people get that (exactly the same number). Turns out someone on GAF said it. The people there ran with it and VG247 picked it up. The same persona also mentioned "4GB GDDR5 for PS4 confirmed", even though just couple days ago he was "cloaked fanboy" who desperately cried for system with ~4TF and never really gave any impression of someone mature who may have sources.
This is gibberish. People have certain dreams and they will believe in their own lie just to feel better, pathetic really.
As far as I know, only person who is trusthworthy is Sweetvar26 (Bkilian and Iherre too, but they are zipped), everybody else are people who would should have proof behind their posts or get banned. Gaming "journalists" just got two meaty articles just by looking at couple of posts made by imaginary insiders on forums.
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