Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [post E3 2019]

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by DavidGraham, Jun 9, 2019.

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  1. PSman1700

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    I think this time around it's not so much about the specs, that with diminishing returns and all that. I mean ballpark GTX 1080, a early 2016 GPU from nvidia, and a 8 core ~3ghz cpu as opposed to the 12 and 16 cores, and consoles seeming to go for virtual ram instead of a large memory jump. Let's hope ray-tracing in those boxes matches atleast RTX 2060/70 RT performance atleast. Digital Foundry doesn't seem to be that positive about AMD's ray tracing. Wonder what and how MS got to hardware ray-tracing?
     
  2. PSman1700

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    True, but i think it depends on the game and workload. Star Citizen likes massive amounts of fast ram, ultra high res textures come at a cost.
     
  3. BRiT

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    That's because it doesn't have a solid game engine and is extremely sloppy with resources.
     
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  4. DieH@rd

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    Richard Leadbetter has said in his latest Digital Foundry video [about Zen2 and Navi news from E3] that devs are "pretty happy with PS5".
     
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  5. Silent_Buddha

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    It's entirely possible that MS are working closely with AMD on the GPU with RT that will launch next year. Hence, console launching next year. Sony could possibly be doing the same thing as well.

    Although (and I can't remember where I might have seen this), Sony are starting to release final dev kits to developers while MS still haven't. I could be completely wrong on that, of course, as I can't recall where I saw that mentioned. If true that would possibly make it less likely that Sony are using AMDs RT hardware, assuming they have hardware support for RT. Or that they are just using pieces and parts of what will eventually be AMDs RT hardware.

    Who knows? We're still over a year away from the hardware release of each console. So while features have been locked down, implementation is still a big question mark.

    Regards,
    SB
     
  6. Johnglen

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    Yep, the truth will be revealed eventually and then we will have to deal with facts. Until then it is literally people fighting over nothing.
     
  7. rokkerkory

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    Wild prediction:
    - Both PS5 and Ana will use 5700 XT variant for around 10.7 to 11.5 "vega" TFs
     
  8. Silent_Buddha

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    It depends. How much of the total console cost would you want to spend on cooling versus other components? 10 USD? 50 USD? More? Cost of more exotic cooling solutions can rapidly balloon. Would it be better to engineer a cooler operating SOC? Sacrifice perf/mm^2 in order to get greater perf/watt? Spend a little more on the SOC and a bit less on the cooling solution? Only Sony and MS will know the numbers and where the sweet spot lies, but I wouldn't expect any overly exotic cooling in either of the next gen consoles.

    But who knows, maybe one of them will surprise me with some form of liquid cooling. :p

    More TF does not necessarily mean faster. And even if the reporter said more TF rather than more performance, it's entirely possible he misheard or miswrote. GPUs are complex architectures and narrowing it down to just the TF count misses out on a whole host of architectural design blocks that directly impact the performance of a GPU much less the entire system.

    Regards,
    SB
     
    #268 Silent_Buddha, Jun 16, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
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  9. AbsoluteBeginner

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    I think Gonzalo leak with Navi10 Lite is what we are getting in next gen consoles. 30 something CUs at high clock, or dozen more at slightly lower clocks so around 9TF.
     
  10. Barrabas

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    Maybe we will see AMD's Chill in next gen consoles? If so, then it could make a good impact on reducing GPU heat when games are developed with
    this in mind or maybe even a standard tool in the development SW.

    https://www.amd.com/en/technologies/radeon-software-chill
     
    #270 Barrabas, Jun 16, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
  11. Shortbread

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    IIRC, both should receive the final silicone after July (sometime in mid-August). Sony's first SDK went out in early 2018, and the latest ones (closer to final spec) going out sometime this past March. Hence, Mark Cerny's Wired interview in April on getting out certain details about PS5/SDK before they leaked.
     
  12. AbsoluteBeginner

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    I seriously doubt they had silicon back in 2018.

    My personal opinion is :

    - Sony is further ahead with their console
    - We know for fact that they sent dev kits in January, but there is also rumor of dev kits being sent in 2018
    - Dev kits sent in Jan 19' or half a year before would not have SOC containing Navi
    - January (let alone 18') was too early for 7nm and too early for production silicon
    - January SDK contains Vega 56 GPU running at 1.8GHz equaling 12.9TF
    - Gonzalo chip, noticed back in Jan running at 1.1GHz and then 4 months later at 1.8GHZ is Navi GPU found in retail PS5 unit
    - PS5 GPU will be around 8.5-9.5TF + RT hardware instead of dev kits with Vega56

    This is, IMO (knowing TDP, die sizes of Navi and when chips are taped out) only possible explanation.
     
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  13. Shortbread

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    Who said anything about silicone in 2018? It was rumored that the first PS5 SDKs went out in 2018, which of course would have been AMD based PCs around a given target spec.
     
  14. borntosoul

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    Stadia has 56 CUs . and 10.7 tf.
    The others should be around about this number as well. Wonder if using a super quick SSD will help out the memory when used for loading hi super res textures?
     
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  15. Proelite

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    I just want to add the Matt, the mod at Resetera who has Sony connections, said the PS5 was delayed from Fall 2019 to H1/H2 2020. Very likely in that case for Sony to be getting silicon earlier and also ship out dev kits earlier.

    The GPU in PS5 is most likely Navi 10 derivative considering the Gonzalo leak. I am guessing that they'll have some sort of customized HW RT, different from RDNA 2.0 and MS's implementation since they're 6 months to 1 year ahead.

    I am thinking 36 at 1.8ghz is what'll end up the in Fall 2019/ Spring 2020 PS5,.

    If they have a plan B console that was engineered from the start for H2 2020, we'll probably see something similar to Anaconda.
     
  16. temesgen

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    Wasn't much of the info last time from vgleaks and some guy who hacked into MS and had a development system shipped to his house? I'm not sure we'll see anything like that level of reveal anytime soon....
     
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  17. Proelite

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    Last time we got concrete info about next generation consoles in Winter 2012. We're a few months away from information.
     
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  18. AbsoluteBeginner

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    Delaying it from Fall 19 to 20' would tie in with a fact that Navi wasnt ready for Fall 19'.

    I still maintain they didnt have silicon in January 19' and that is why 12.9TF number has been collaborated by few solid sources. Because it was Vega clocked at 1.8GHz emulating Gonzalo chip that will be in retail console by Fall 2020.
     
  19. HBRU

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    yes... I guess also PS5 has much similar (if not the same) numbers & GPU structure... why make an extra powerfull, extra noisy & hot, extra expensive Console ? To let PS4 owners behind ? Crazy... To let people buy the cheap & silent Stadia ? Crazy... Better lead people to stay on PS4 as long as possible by giving them new way of play... Also by online services that gives PS4 players TF as much as Stadia... And give to whom has not proper online connection the PS5 ASAP... A well dimensioned PS5... Not too expensive. Not too powerfull.... Around 10.5 TF.... ;)

    Stadia prices are CRAZY low... Till 69 dollars. Than 10 dollars each month. For a 10,7 TF remote machine... Silent. Not power hungry.... Online services included.... Next Year 1080p online gaming for free... You just have to buy the game you want..... Then play forever online for free....
     
    #279 HBRU, Jun 17, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 17, 2019
  20. Globalisateur

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    I think the first 12.9 tflops rumor hasn't come from dev and their tests with dev-kits but from the croissant leak and that was supposed to be the final tflops of the PS5 console, not the dev-kits.
     
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