mckmas8808
Legend
How big is 32km by 32 km? How long did it take to fly around Rogue Squadan? It's 16 km by 16 km.
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mckmas8808
Legend
Thanks. Now can we get a comparision of this size to another game? Like how big was GTA 3, Vice City, and San Andreas?
I'm trying to get a mental image of the size of Lair.
It's almost the exact same size as Just Cause.
It's about 2/3rds the size of GTA:SA.
mckmas8808
Legend
Holy crap that's huge. I didn't know Just Cause was that big either. Lair will rock.
Thats not really that big considering my Dragon does well over 200 MPH. That's not too much ground to cover :smile:
Correct me if i am wrong but 32km X 32km isnt ditto of 32 square kilometres ?
1square mile = 2.58 squarekilometres => 32square kilometres = 12.5 square milles
You confuse the draw distance of just cause with the distance of its world.
The total size of just cause is 1024 square kilometres of free roaming world!
1square mile = 2.58 squarekilometres => 32square kilometres = 12.5 square milles
Powderkeg said:
You confuse the draw distance of just cause with the distance of its world.
The total size of just cause is 1024 square kilometres of free roaming world!
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32km = 19.882 miles
19.882 X 19.882 = 395.3 sq miles. (Rounded)
You are confused.
1024 sq kilometers is 395.264 square miles. See above.
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mckmas8808
Legend
So it take 4 hours to drive across the whole map if I could drive a car from one end of the map to the other at 100 mph?
No.
The map is only 19.882 miles across. 19.882 miles wide, 19.882 miles long. You multiply length by width to get the square milage.
If you were driving at 100MPH, it would take just under 12 minutes to cross the entire map.
mckmas8808
Legend
Eagle-Vision
Regular
Well, the ground seems to be parallaxed mapped, so it's not a big deal.
http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/733/733921/lair-20060921042446115.jpg
Ok i see , but then why you said that "It's about 2/3rds the size of GTA:SA"
According to Wikipedia:
That means that Lair and Just Cause are about 23 times bigger than GT:SA. Are they wrong or what
The terrain mesh is a regular grid. The distance between vertex pairs is 2 virtual meters.
The problem is that this requires a 16000*16000 grid, or 256 million polygons. Not going to happen.
Even if they'd use an adaptively subdivided mesh (at render time, ignore vertices further away then, say, 2km) they'd still need a 16K*16K texture to store the displacement for it. So either they've implemented Carmack's megatexture stuff, or there's some trickery here.
Eagle-Vision
Regular
Obviously there's LOD for the terrain too.
no trickery invovled ive as well as others have implemented a nonrepetitive terrain of over a billion x billion vertices (well it was some high number
)all u need is some fractal to generate height data, maybe taking erosion into consideration.
iirc mine was easily running ~50fps on amd64 2.0ghz even regenerating the whole terrain every frame (worse case senerio), this wouldnt even tax one of the cells SPE.
combine this with another file specifying where buildings trees etc are + viola one huge terrain
Eagle: sure you can use LOD, but you just cannot store 256 million vertices' worth of data in the PS3's memory. You'd need a few gigabytes of memory for that. Without compression it wouldn't even fit on a BR disc.
What you could do is to store the data in a displacement map, but even that would neet a lot of space: a 16K*16K 8 bit texture requires 256 MB of memory if I'm correct; and you can probably compress it a little more. But that would give you 256 levels of elevation, so even with 1 meter high changes you could still not use mountains.
There are solutions to overcome the problems though, you can use two or even three layers of detail in the terrain; say a 2K or 4K individual texture for the large scale forms, and a smaller tiled 'detail' texture to add some noise. Or they could be doing the megatexture stuff, just to displace terrain. Or whatever.
And the problem with procedural terrain is that you can't educate a fractal to act as a game designer or an artist. Sure it can work and maybe even look nice, but random terrain in itself won't work. You need to edit it, and this means you need to store the extra information. There are ways to do that, though, they've obviously had it working for Rouge Squadron on a smaller scale with less resources.
What you could do is to store the data in a displacement map, but even that would neet a lot of space: a 16K*16K 8 bit texture requires 256 MB of memory if I'm correct; and you can probably compress it a little more. But that would give you 256 levels of elevation, so even with 1 meter high changes you could still not use mountains.
There are solutions to overcome the problems though, you can use two or even three layers of detail in the terrain; say a 2K or 4K individual texture for the large scale forms, and a smaller tiled 'detail' texture to add some noise. Or they could be doing the megatexture stuff, just to displace terrain. Or whatever.
And the problem with procedural terrain is that you can't educate a fractal to act as a game designer or an artist. Sure it can work and maybe even look nice, but random terrain in itself won't work. You need to edit it, and this means you need to store the extra information. There are ways to do that, though, they've obviously had it working for Rouge Squadron on a smaller scale with less resources.
Eagle-Vision
Regular
Well, they don't have to load everything on the memory at once. If I recall, they are streaming content all the time (they actually did so in Rebel Strike too).
That's like saying the problem with a subdivision surface is that you can't educate it to act as a modeler. Yes, procedural generation which can only be guided by some abstract seeds is useles most of the time ... I don't see the relevance though, since that's not the kind of procedural generator you would actually use.
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