Mass Effect 3

Anyone want to summarize WTF happened (in spoiler tags, of course) for someone who won't play the game?
 
MfA said:
If they keep leading people on just to kick them in the balls their only followers will be masochists ...

They are already taking the wrong turn in DA3 by not bringing back the Warden (or at least progress the story elements they introduced in there, lets go to the golden city already and end the blights once and for all). It's strange, in Dragon Age they screw it up by not wanting to progress the universe and tell epic stories ... in Mass Effect they screw it up by progressing the universe into oblivion.
Click to expand...

At least locally the rapid degeneration of Bioware's ability to tell a good story as well as fundamental changes to shifting away from being an RPG company to either a generic Shooter or generic 3rd person click action gaming company has lead to mass defections among the RPG gamers that are local to me.

So I think they've done a fantastic job of alienating what used to be their core fanbase. For many while DAO reinvigorated their interest in Bioware, DA2 then marked the end of the company to them. For a few it was DA2 combined with ME2. And for most of the remaining, ME3 completely shut them off. There's still 1 or 2 that are willing to give them a chance at redemption, but most of the others have moved on.

But for the majority of us, we have high hopes for Wasteland 2 to bring back a proper RPG to play. :)

Regards,
SB
 
NRP said:
Anyone want to summarize WTF happened (in spoiler tags, of course) for someone who won't play the game?
Click to expand...

Commander Shepard saves all advanced organic lifeforms in the galaxy going through a phase in which he turns a god out of the machine. In other words it's a hallmark of bad writing. If you seen the 3rd Matrix movie it's just like that but much, much, much worse.

/the end
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Silent_Buddha said:
At least locally the rapid degeneration of Bioware's ability to tell a good story as well as fundamental changes to shifting away from being an RPG company to either a generic Shooter or generic 3rd person click action gaming company has lead to mass defections among the RPG gamers that are local to me.

So I think they've done a fantastic job of alienating what used to be their core fanbase. For many while DAO reinvigorated their interest in Bioware, DA2 then marked the end of the company to them. For a few it was DA2 combined with ME2. And for most of the remaining, ME3 completely shut them off. There's still 1 or 2 that are willing to give them a chance at redemption, but most of the others have moved on.

But for the majority of us, we have high hopes for Wasteland 2 to bring back a proper RPG to play. :)

Regards,
SB
Click to expand...

I don't know whether it was their sale to EA or simply that they, somewhere along the line, lost their mojo... or even that they simply saw the cash cow that is COD and thought, "I'd like to get a piece of that pie".

I wish more developers would chase games like GTA, RDR, Skyrim in terms of design and immersiveness of the world, rather than everyone chasing COD, as if that's the only game that sells anything. It's silly.
 
Comparing Mass Effect to COD is absurd and ignorant.
Both the shooting gameplay mechanics and the general action gameplay (class specifics, powers, squad members, enemy behaviour etc) are completely different. ME has a lot more depth, even when compared to Gears of War which has a lot more similarities on the surface.

Also, at least with my play style, shooting is still less than half of the gameplay time. I spend a lot of time with managing powers, equipment, traveling around and conversations... another significant difference that would probably bore the COD crowd.
 
NRP said:
Anyone want to summarize WTF happened (in spoiler tags, of course) for someone who won't play the game?
Click to expand...

Bioware made a game that's clearly superior to ME2 in it's gameplay and depth, an - at least to me - ideal mix of ME1 and ME2. They also did pretty well in pacing, story, mood, graphics, music; basically everything.

Then the ending was not what most people expected. It sure has its problems in that it wasn't built up well enough in the previous games and even in ME3; and it wasn't executed well either.
The player choices also did not have a significant effect on the actual ending, in that all storylines were concluded before that point and it wasn't about the individual characters and plot lines, but about the trilogy as a whole.


Then the whole thing blew out of proportion through the internet as a loud minority was feeding off each other's posts, videos and articles.
 
Laa-Yosh said:
Comparing Mass Effect to COD is absurd and ignorant.
Both the shooting gameplay mechanics and the general action gameplay (class specifics, powers, squad members, enemy behaviour etc) are completely different. ME has a lot more depth, even when compared to Gears of War which has a lot more similarities on the surface.

Also, at least with my play style, shooting is still less than half of the gameplay time. I spend a lot of time with managing powers, equipment, traveling around and conversations... another significant difference that would probably bore the COD crowd.
Click to expand...

I don't think you even read my post at all beyond the word "COD".

If you did you'd see I clearly wasn't comparing the two games at all, rather making a comment about publishers and games developers chasing the "COD-consumer" by simplifying and "streamlining" :)roll:) their games.

Rather than calling people ignorant, why not try actually employing a little reading comprehension ;-) Might make you less enemies
 
But that's my point, ME3 wasn't streamlined from ME2 it's the exact opposite.
- all DLC armor and weapon added, plus even more N7 armor components, plus even more weapons
- weapon mods
- weight vs. power recharge
- more powers, more complex trees
- grenades
- combat moves
- tech detonation combos
- more complex level design
- more complex enemy behavior, with synergies like Marauders providing barriers for husks/cannibals

More than half of the above are RPG systems which are actually driving it further from COD and Gears. They were trying very hard to please all the fans who were complaining about ME2's simplifications, if they were aiming for easy grabbing they would not have added complexity but removed more of it instead.
 
People can be so clueless sometimes. Most people play ME for the story because the combat and RPG elements aren't very strong to begin with and if the story is badly written, (which it is - simply because of its deus ex machina style ending) what makes you think somebody would want to play it other than fans of the series?
 
Ghostz said:
the combat and RPG elements aren't very strong to begin with
Click to expand...

dude+opinion.jpg
 
NRP said:
Anyone want to summarize WTF happened (in spoiler tags, of course) for someone who won't play the game?
Click to expand...

I think a fundamental issue is the conflict of Freewill and Predestination. Games, in general, are player controlled to a degree. Players are used to having some input in the gameplay; less so the story. Bioware was progressive in that they provided gamers a general illusion that their choices and actions throughout the game have an impact on the galaxy (story). In the end of ME3 you are essentially presented with 3 possible endings (or slight variations thereof) and your actions throughout make no meaningful impact on (a) what choices you get and (b) the outcome of your selection. To draw upon the reference someone else made to the Matrix Bioware has sided with the Machines: there is only the illusion of choice. Of course I don't look at this as necessarily a bad thing; games have functional limits and while some may not appreciate it there is much to be said in philosophy about freewill and predeterminationism (fate, whatever). Bioware basically groomed gamers to feel they were important, they made choices, and their choices made an impact. But in the end it basically didn't matter, they got 3 choices and 3 choices only. Basically Shephard cannot avoid his fate; in fact his fate is pretty much sealed
sans gasping scene
as are his crews for the most part. The choices the gamer is left all have significant tension within the story arch--but I think that has a lot to do with the fact the galaxy is pretty much messed up and all the options (presented) are pretty much heaved upon the gamer at virtual gun point. Shepherds run has ended and these are his options, nothing more, nothing less. For those who may have wished for a different ending--or worse thought that they in some way would craft their own ending--were forced to swallow a bitter pill.

I think there would have been less complaining if (a) Bioware had offered a "and everyone lived happily ever after" ending and (b) had both limited your end game choices by your actions in the game as well as had alternate endings for each choice. e.g. You are a jerk throughout the series but choose the "happy ever after ending" and watch as it blows up in your face because you clearly don't deserve the happy ending--but pick the tyrant ending and it actually plays out happily for the most part.

I think those wishing for (a) and calling it poor writing for not offering it have a very one-sided view of what makes a good story; as for (b) I think gamers have a valid complaint that the endings don't take the game's choices into account as well as not offering enough branching based on your characters status and its relation to the choice you made. That is a pretty valid complaint. But it seems in the grand scheme of things these are pretty minor, I have not played these either but I live my own life with general understanding it isn't where you started or where you end but how you got there. There is something to be said about immersing and enjoying an experience, for good and bad, and not only be caught up in "the end." That said I almost always read the end of a book to see if I want to indulge because I hate sad endings. So I guess, maybe, I can sympathize with those who got emotionally involved in the experience and then had Bioware rip their heart out
by space boy no less
:LOL:
 
Laa-Yosh said:
But that's my point, ME3 wasn't streamlined from ME2 it's the exact opposite.
- all DLC armor and weapon added, plus even more N7 armor components, plus even more weapons
- weapon mods
- weight vs. power recharge
- more powers, more complex trees
- grenades
- combat moves
- tech detonation combos
- more complex level design
- more complex enemy behavior, with synergies like Marauders providing barriers for husks/cannibals

More than half of the above are RPG systems which are actually driving it further from COD and Gears. They were trying very hard to please all the fans who were complaining about ME2's simplifications, if they were aiming for easy grabbing they would not have added complexity but removed more of it instead.
Click to expand...

To clarify though, I wasn't specifically speaking about ME3 when I made the comment. More the move from ME1 to ME2. I haven't yet played 3.

Perhaps my comment was premature, but i'll reserve judgement for when i've played ME3 ;-)
 
I shall not be censored :devilish:...

I've played ME1 & ME2 and thus i feel i'm quite qualified to speak about Bioware wrt to those games. (It is afterall only my opinion)

After i've played ME3 i promise to come back and eat my words if i'm wrong ;-)

How does that do ya? :)
 
Bioware gave in to the pressure, in part, because an "extended cut" free DLC is coming, additional cinematics and epilogue scenes that provide more detail to the existing endings.

They don't change the endings though.
 
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