Josh Robinson's blog on PS3/XBOX360

[mckmas8808]

Well, good to know.

Anyway whatever, I'll stop trying to prevent people from railroading this guy if that's what everyone wants to do.

But seriously, nothing he's said has rattled me in the least... and if it seems no one else here even believes him, why all the fuss? Let the man live his life. He's working on a game for *you* afterall!

xbd if a guy in his position makes a statement about his of game and says it sucks. Fine! But when he says all the extra stuff about being the only real demo and that most PS3 games now are being made on PC's then will be ported over to the PS3, people on the net will make a fuss.

And rightfully so.

 

[Carl B]

Hey, that came fully equipped with a wink, damnit!

I personally believe that he believes what he is saying and that he is who he claims to be. It is more of a case of 'indirect FUD' because of the plausible deniability aspect "to the best of my knowledge", poor editing in the article, and appeals to authority ('the programmers said so but I have no idea' is not admissible evidence). We already know some of the facts presented are incorrect, and that's a real judgement clouder in this world.

Mmmkay I was wasn't targetting you with that post even though I used 'FUD,' I was just speaking in general.

I agree the article of his is somewhat bogus, but at the same time, I mean this guy is closer to it than the vast majority of us, so I'll just choose to weave his comments into my 'PS3 information tapestry' rather than discard them outright.

 

[expletive]

Because much of what he is saying is inconsistent with what we've seen for ourselves, to date, and what we've heard from other devs. When you see an inconsistency, or something which you believe not to be true, do you not call that out?

What have we really 'seen' though? The only gameplay i've actually seen is fatal intertia, which looks current gen at best.

This guy wreaks of 'axe to grind' though imo. I have no idea why someone would do this. Its one thing for Major Nelson to shop up at a NIntendo event to get his DS signed, but this is entirely off the charts...

 

[Synergy34]

Heavenly sword is not a launch game...so what's your point?

We don't even know what the launch line-up is, so how can anyone possibly "know" this guy is wrong? We don't "know" anything...we've seen videos...

Where has it been said HS isn't a launch title?

 

[mckmas8808]

What have we really 'seen' though? The only gameplay i've actually seen is fatal intertial, which looks current gen at best.

To be fair to those devs that was on a build pre E3. With close to one whole year of programming and a few dev-kit models to go, that video clip means nothing compared to what the final product will look like.

 

[Bobbler]

This guy wreaks of 'axe to grind' though imo.

Yea, that is one of the many thoughts that went through my head.

Whatever the case, I'm anxious for the feb PS event, if only to stop all this insanity that has been spreading around for the last few months.

 

[Carl B]

xbd if a guy in his position makes a statement about his of game and says it sucks. Fine! But when he says all the extra stuff about being the only real demo and that most PS3 games now are being made on PC's then will be ported over to the PS3, people on the net will make a fuss.

And rightfully so.

Alright well...

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Here's my 'pocket guide' to refuting some of Josh's major points:

1) He claims PS3 games equal PC games ported at the last minute.

Well, plenty of devs here and otherwise have claimed to be trying to take advantage and 'become accustomed' to coding for the SPE's, implying that in fact PS3 devs are at this very moment attempting to approach PS3 from a Cell-centric direction rather than simply that of a PC port. In addition, comments made by Guerilla devs and Ninja Theory have implied that visuals on the order of their respective E3 demos are well within the realm of reason. It comes down to whether you wish to believe the words of devs themselves or the anonymous friends of a 3D artist at Sony Online Entertainment (a division of Sony Pictures).

2) He says that 360 is 'better'

Again, he is citing anonymous sources within the industry, while at the same time admitting to his own limits with regards to the technical side of things. Who are these people? When did they tell him this? There is always the possibility that the individuals he spoke with did not have too much greater of an understanding of the consoles than even he himself did, and there is no reason to think that they may not have been the victims of the MajorNelson FUD campaign as were so many news outlets when it happened. Context is needed as to who these individuals are, and when and what they spoke about. Until then, you have the words of many devs presumably more familiar with the hardware saying that PS3 should enjoy 'an advantage' over 360 to one level or another power-wise.

3) Josh says their demo was the only 'real' one at the show

Josh may not be fully aware of comments from other devs indicating the 'real-timeliness' of the demos presented at E3. Though there may not have been explicit confirmation for all demos seen, the Terrain demo and the UT2K7 demo stand out as two that have been confirmed as real0time; the terrain demo on the Cell alone and the UTK7 demo on a high-end PC that as stated by Epic should be surpassed by the RSX and final PS3 configuration. Other real-time demonstrations such as the Molina and Duckies demo - though purely for conceptual purposes - show what level of detail and physics PS3 could be theoretically capable of through use of the Cell processor.

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I don't know... are there even any other points to refute? You know, I don't even care about half the stuff I just wrote about, but it's true nontheless. Still to me this whole thing is a 'shoulder-shrugger.' It's all opinion vs opinion. But to those who hang their hats off of such things, the opinions I cite should 'trump' Josh's opinions in terms of 'validity-factor.'

So, I think Josh should just be left alone and left to make this game for us. If there are those who feel the need to refute this whole thing across the web, well just use "xbd's talking points" and go from there. And I agree with Expletive, there seems some sort of axe to grind on his part. Or maybe not? Who knows and who cares.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

What launch titles do we know and have seen to compare his comments with? eg. Looking at Heavenly Sword we see some fantastic visuals with HDR, AA etc. but we don't know for sure it's a launch title. AFAIK we don't actually know any launch lineup, not least because we don't actually know when the system will launch! It could be that the launch titles are all games we haven't heard of, haven't seen, and are rather lame. Maybe

I actually think that unlikely, but we don't know for sure.

 

[mckmas8808]

Well xbd and this quote to your list.

In the end however, its not a real time demo and its not running ON the actual box. We were the only company to my knowledge that showed something that ran it live on the box.

Wasn't the Molina, Unreal 2K7, Terrain, Fight Night 3, Duckies demo, and The Getaway demo running on a real machine?

 

[Powderkeg]

What launch titles do we know and have seen to compare his comments with? eg. Looking at Heavenly Sword we see some fantastic visuals with HDR, AA etc. but we don't know for sure it's a launch title. AFAIK we don't actually know any launch lineup, not least because we don't actually know when the system will launch! It could be that the launch titles are all games we haven't heard of, haven't seen, and are rather lame. Maybe

I actually think that unlikely, but we don't know for sure.

Realistically speaking, I would assume that most of the PS3 launch lineup would consist of ports from other systems. (PC or 360) The odds are there won't be more than 2-3 exclusives in the launch lineup, and any multiplatform game would almost certainly be a port from another system.

Now, as to what those exclusives are, who is to say. But I think the vast majority will be just like he said. Ports from other systems that do little if anything to show off the systems power, just like the 360 launch titles.

 

[Bobbler]

Well xbd and this quote to your list.

Wasn't the Molina, Unreal 2K7, Terrain, Fight Night 3, Duckies demo, and The Getaway demo running on a real machine?

He does have the qualifier "To my knowledge" in there. He probably wasn't very aware and possibly a bit annoyed at the situation, seeing as his tone is a more like an angry second grader than a person who actually put some thought into his responses (maybe he isn't/wasn't happy with the project? who knows?).

I'd take his comments for what they are worth and at face value, and just wait until we see something concrete. I learned a long time ago that basing your judgement of something on someone else's opinion is usually the wrong way to go, and you're likely to make a fool of yourself in doing so.

 

[Titanio]

What have we really 'seen' though? The only gameplay i've actually seen is fatal intertia, which looks current gen at best.

Whilst you may remain cautious, I expect Gundam, Warhawk, Lair and HS - the titles I named above - to be graphically as good as the footage we've seen of them sofar. In the case of the first two, a lot of what we've seen of them, particularly post-E3, looks suspiciously gameplay-ish in parts anyway (the Gunam PSM live demo, and the last Warhawk vid has parts that definitely look like someone's playing (and those bits look as good as the rest - shock!)).

 

[3roxor]

I also expect mostly port with 1 or 2 games showing some of the system capabilities. Much like the 360 launch. Someone should ask that guy what games he already saw.

 

[Carl B]

Well xbd and this quote to your list.

Wasn't the Molina, Unreal 2K7, Terrain, Fight Night 3, Duckies demo, and The Getaway demo running on a real machine?

Ok, I added a '#3' addressing this question to my 'guide.'

 

[Powderkeg]

Well xbd and this quote to your list.



Wasn't the Molina, Unreal 2K7, Terrain, Fight Night 3, Duckies demo, and The Getaway demo running on a real machine?

On a side not, didn't Mark Rein of Epic say that UT2k7 was the ONLY demo running in real-time on PS3 hardware at E3?

If we are going to write off everything this guy says because of his claim that TO THE BEST OF HIS KNOWLEDGE no other demos ran on PS3 hardware, shouldn't we also discount every comment Mark Rein made about how great the PS3 is for the same reason?

Or do we only ignore everything someone says about the PS3 when it's bad?

 

[barnak]

Lair, Warhawk, and I-8 all look very good to me. Arent they all expected to hit roughly around launch?

 

[Titanio]

On a side not, didn't Mark Rein of Epic say that UT2k7 was the ONLY demo running in real-time on PS3 hardware at E3?

I think he made the claim that it was the only Live demo. Though EA may disagree at least. The Duckies demo was also live.

 

[expletive]

Whilst you may remain cautious, I expect Gundam, Warhawk, Lair and HS - the titles I named above - to be graphically as good as the footage we've seen of them sofar. In the case of the first two, a lot of what we've seen of them, particularly post-E3, looks suspiciously gameplay-ish in parts anyway (the Gunam PSM live demo, and the last Warhawk vid has parts that definitely look like someone's playing (and those bits look as good as the rest - shock!)).

Thats fair. I remain cautious, you optimistic, theres nothing wrong with either. But to continue in the vein of fairness, in terms of what we've actually seen, you're still using words like "suspiciously gameplayish", " and "looks like someone's playing". Unless i'm reading it wrong, that amounts to nothing in terms of actual gameplay doesnt it?

Maybe i havent seen all the videos that youve seen though, which is entirely possible.

 

[Titanio]

Thats fair. I remain cautious, you optimistic, theres nothing wrong with either. But to continue in the vein of fairness, in terms of what we've actually seen, you're still using words like "suspiciously gameplayish", " and "looks like someone's playing". Unless i'm reading it wrong, that amounts to nothing in terms of actual gameplay doesnt it?

I think in-engine cutscenes are usually a good indicator of what to expect from a game graphically, while playing.

Gundam had a live demo, with someone playing it, and graphically it looked as good as the video up to that point, pretty much.

Warhawk, I'm referring to the TGS vid, that had sequences with a "behind the plane" camera and a targetting reticule etc. It certainly looked like gameplay footage.

I don't think I'm being baselessly optimistic at all. I'd put money on those games looking as good as the video we've seen to date. Do you think that'd be unreasonable? Is there reason to believe otherwise, yet?

 

[Farid]

Well i also thought that if he were a real Sony developer, he'd be breaking so many NDA's with that blog that come tomorrow morning he will be unemployed.

Yes.
Being unemployed won't be his biggest problem in the days to come, though.

He probably wasn't very aware and possibly a bit annoyed at the situation, seeing as his tone is a more like an angry second grader than a person who actually put some thought into his responses

The guy was probably on his way out. Or he is just really and extremely stupid.

I would really be interested in what the other developers working on PS3 think of this guys statements. Anyone..........

I don't think you'll get a lot of comments from known developers about this.