I was right, RE4 does have the GC's best lighting.

[Li Mu Bai]

And among the best upon any console. I posted this topic months prior to E3, or the new GI scans. It ranks beside SC IMO, although with much more realistic & subdued lighting. (The stormy night scene with the villager's torches goes unmatched IMO) And not blindingly overexposed. (as many areas in SC were) Viewing through IGN's movies, I actually saw dust particles floating in the air through one of the windows. The way the light changes & reacts with Leon's hair & jacket dependent upon his positioning, phenomenal. Skinning, (at least with Leon's character's hair & jacket) best fire & explosions in a console game, great AI, (I noticed this hands-on at E3) enemy animations, complex geometry, extremely detailed & semi-interactive environments, particle effects, beautifully done water, motion blur, the amount of detail put into the villagers alone is remarkable considering they can come attacking 20 at a time. The monks texturing I found particularly impressive. And still showcases a good draw distance.

Although I found MGS3, KZ, AC5, MP2, all to be very impressive. The most impressive comprehensive graphical showcases were Halo 2 & RE4 without a doubt IMO. (console-wise)

 

[Bohdy]

I wouldn't expect too many posts since this topic mentions neither Sony nor Sega ;-)

 

[Lazy8s]

So many contemporary survival horror games are nothing more than tech demos with their extremely limited viewfields and their one or two on-screen enemy maximums. Resident Evil 4 takes that focused detail and blows it out with mobs full of angry characters and a full-complexity environment where a whole village can be seen expanding out into the dense, surrounding forest.

 

[Rodéric]

"Li Mu Bai' a "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" fan ?

For what I've seen the games is indeed technically impressive and a nice refresh since the old BioHazard (Why, O Why do they use "Resident Evil" instead of Bio Hazard ?!).
When I saw the Dreamcast game was full 3D (as opposed to CGI) I expected much, it was a nice improvement, but not enough to my taste.

I can only wait to try the game.

 

[PC-Engine]

Yes RE4 is absolutely amazing. It does every possible graphical technique from current generation consoles and does them very well. I'm hoping Capcom added some of the effects from the early trailers into the final game. For example the drapes flowing realistically when wind blown. The rain scenes, the flash light, etc. I still have those trailers and they're equally amazing.

 

[London Geezer]

I wouldn't expect too many posts since this topic mentions neither Sony nor Sega ;-)

What was that for?


Anyway, to stay on topic, let's just say that the graphics in RE4 was never the issue here. From every video i've seen, i couldn't help but notice the trademark stiffness of the controls and the main character's movements. Yes, the graphics are great. RE graphics have never been bad in general either.
It's strange that Capcom would focus on the graphics and leave the part of the games that REALLY needed improvement, which is the gameplay. It's not like they haven't done any better. DMC was a gem, and i'm not saying "turn RE into DMC", however DMC gives an idea of what Capcom is capable of doing. Even then, they couldn't replicate the same awsomeness for DMC2 either, so i guess the individual directors and producers play a much bigger part in what a game is like than most people think.

 

[PC-Engine]

Well RE4 is a survival horror game and changing it too much will turn it into another type of game or make it less of a survival horror and more of a hybrid of that + something else. I'm sooo glad Capcom didn't turn RE4 into a FPS. It would be nice to have a first person perspective option like in Code Veronica bonus game.

 

[London Geezer]

Well RE4 is a survival horror game and changing it too much will turn it into another type of game or make it less of a survival horror and more of a hybrid of that + something else. I'm sooo glad Capcom didn't turn RE4 into a FPS. It would be nice to have a first person perspective option like in Code Veronica bonus game.

*LB kicks PCEngine in his knee*

STOP GIVING CAPCOM STRANGE IDEAS!!!!! THEY'RE WATCHIN US U KNOW!!!!

All i can say is enough with the FPS conversions of old games!!

I know they couldn't change the old formula too much, but for god's sake, making the controls more controllable would be very welcome and wouldn't change the "formula" at all... Same for SH games.

(I watched Austin Powers - The Spy who shagged me last night, so expect loads of "quotes" today and for the next couple of weeks at least... u know... "LASER"... )

 

[Teasy]

london-boy

They have made the controls more comfortable simply by ensureing that the camera is always behind your character. That makes a huge difference with the Res Evil controls.

The actual controls are neccesary for this type of game AFAICS. There needs to be an aspect of "Shit can I get away fast enough before they all catch me". The only real control problem with past Resident Evil games was the fact that these controls were mixed with a bit of a crazy camera. One minute it was behind you, the next in front of you, the next to your right ect, every time you entered a room it changed. That made controlling the character very difficult (certainly until you really got used to it anyway). Although with the slow monsters in those games it was probably necessary. Res Evil 4 has fixed that and that's all I want it to fix. It would ruin the Survival Horror aspect of the game if you could just instantly run and run in any direction just by pressing that direction.

 

[London Geezer]

^ ^ But in reality, if you're running away from someone (not that i'd know about it...), would it take you a whole half a second to turn 180 degrees and then slowly start running? There is still a lot to be changed in the way we control games, as it is it's far from natural. Does "that's all i want them to fix" mean that in 10 years from now u'd be very happy with the way you control your in-game character today? I'm sure i won't be.
I'm not saying "turn RE and SH games into DMC or Jak&Daxter games!"(picked those up cause they have the most intuitive controls in games i can think of right now), but i can't help but feel that they're just "stiff". Cause they are. What can i say.

 

[Phil]

The only real control problem with past Resident Evil games was the fact that these controls were mixed with a bit of a crazy camera. One minute it was behind you, the next in front of you, the next to your right ect, every time you entered a room it changed. That made controlling the character very difficult (certainly until you really got used to it anyway). Although with the slow monsters in those games it was probably necessary. Res Evil 4 has fixed that and that's all I want it to fix. It would ruin the Survival Horror aspect of the game if you could just instantly run and run in any direction just by pressing that direction.

Given, it's been quite a while since I played my last BioHazard game - but the control problem was a non-issue back in the days of Resident Evil 1 - 3 + CV, because the controls were not dependend on where the camera was positioned as pressing the "Up" button would always make the character move forward ("Down" walking backwards, "left/right" for rotating the character). In other words, even if you were walking and the camera changed, the player would still be facing the same direction and the button "Up" would still make the character move forward, regardless from which angle the camera would be showing the camera. I'm not quite sure why it made it more difficult - certainly has its benefits compared to a MGS control sheme in which you would have to change the button for moving forward everytime the camera changes. Same goes for FFX aswell, as Silent Hills if I remember correctly...

Anyway, I like the controls. Always suited the slow-paced game Resident Evil was.

 

[Teasy]

In reality people can get frozen in terror in these situations or die on the spot from a heart attack or just panic and do something incredibly stupid. But this is a game, its not reality and your not going to panic like you would in real life. It'd be stupid if the character just froze in terror at the start and got eaten, or died of a heart attack So the only other option you have right now for this type of game is to make the controls a little less free. Again the camera is always behind you so the controls aren't actually clumsy and confusing like the past Res Evil controls could be. So I don't really see your complaint against Res Evil 4's controls here.

Also it doesn't take half a second to turn 180 degree's, you can use the c stick for a quick 180 degree turn.

There is still a lot to be changed in the way we control games, as it is it's far from natural. Does "that's all i want them to fix" mean that in 10 years from now u'd be very happy with the way you control your in-game character today? I'm sure i won't be

Woah there, I thought we were talking about Res Evil 4's controls being a problem not the problem with the interface of all games today

 

[London Geezer]

In reality people can get frozen in terror in these situations or die on the spot from a heart attack or just panic and do something incredibly stupid. But this is a game, its not reality and your not going to panic like you would in real life. It'd be stupid if the character just froze in terror at the start and got eaten, or died of a heart attack

That would be really cool actually! Imagine... just encounter an enemy and BOOM "Game Over" from heart attact...

So I don't really see your complaint against Res Evil 4's controls here.

Woah there, I thought we were talking about Res Evil 4's controls being a problem not the problem with the interface of all games today

No no no i'm not complaining about RE4 at all! I was saying "in general". I haven't played RE4 so i can't really tell... I know i went a bit off-topic on the control issue. I'm a control freak what can i say

 

[Teasy]

Phil

I think it just confused people, especially initially. I mean if your walking along and suddenly the camera changes its perspective it can be quite confusing. Once you played a lot of the game you got used to it and it wasn't a problem. But some people didn't get that far because they were annoyed by the (initially) confusing controls.

 

[London Geezer]

By the way, not sure about RE games, but in SH games you can choose what kind of control you want, the "MGS way" or the "RE way"... I think it's under 2D/3D controls option...

 

[Phil]

In reality people can get frozen in terror in these situations or die on the spot from a heart attack or just panic and do something incredibly stupid. But this is a game, its not reality and your not going to panic like you would in real life. It'd be stupid if the character just froze in terror at the start and got eaten, or died of a heart attack So the only other option you have right now for this type of game is to make the controls a little less free. Again the camera is always behind you so the controls aren't actually clumsy and confusing like the past Res Evil controls could be. So I don't really see your complaint against Res Evil 4's controls here.

I remember playing Resident Evil 2 way back at one of my friends places. It was dark. It was very intense... and I was already on my second way through (B-Plot) - the Plot in which this T-Variant suddenly appears from time to time and you are either forced to shoot everything you've got... or RUN!!! Anyway... I was playing and at this one place within the police station, the camera is facing from the floor upwards to the ceiling. I knew something was going to happen, so I walked carefully to the center of the room, expecting something to jump through the glass at any moment. Nothing happened. I was still skeptical though and proceeded to get the gem hanging at the wall. Still nothing happened. Meanwhile my friend was (as bored as he was) playing around with the remote of the hifi system turning up the volume and down - just playing around. After taking the gem, I really didn't think something would happen and was on my way to the exit of the room, feeling relieved to finally being able to leave the room.... when SUDDENLY, this bloddy licker comes flying through the glass ceiling from above. At that point, my friend had the volume all turned up and it was such a shock, I let the controller fall to the ground and almost fell backwards from the couch. I tell you, I was close to a heartattack and so was my friend.... and while we were staring at the screen (well I was desperately seeking for the controller somewhere in the dark), the screen filled with red blood as Leon died a slow one...

One of the most horrific moments I had in gaming, actually. Yeah, it was that good! 8)

 

[London Geezer]

HIS CHILDHOOD TRAUMA

^ ^ That's actually quite funny...

 

[Teasy]

Phil

What would have happened if you'd had Super Mario 64 controls and a normal camera though? The less responsive controls and camera were necessary to help create the clostrophobic scary atmosphere in the Resident Evil games. That was my point.

 

[Phil]

Teasy,

Yeah, I still would have died - but not in that room. Actually, with Super Mario 64 controls, Leon would have died way before, like on the escape from the evil tyrant running into every wall everytime the camera switches. In fact, if the tyrant wouldn't get to him first, I'm pretty sure Leon would have died from head injuries from running into all the walls.

But yeah, I get your point (I actually agree with you) - I just had to comment on "But this is a game, its not reality and your not going to panic like you would in real life."... and I'm in a funny mood. Must be work..

 

[Cyborg]

That would be really cool actually! Imagine... just encounter an enemy and BOOM "Game Over" from heart attact...

Not to turn this off topic but, check out Echo Night - Beyond, Its a new survival horror on PS2, really nice looking. Its set in 2044 on a moon base, you're an astronaut trying to figure out what happened since everyone is dead. You dont have weapons apparently, and the ghosts try to scare you to kill you, augmenting your pulse and ultimately (havent seen it happen in the trailer though) die from an heart attack. You have to do actions for the ghosts so that they're "free", like giving a kid his teddy bear, etc.

About RE4, aye, capcom sure knows the little cube well, i wish there were more devs trying to push it like capcom is doing, but oh well, i guess its the same situation as konami and ps2.