Fact: Nintendo to release HD console + controllers with built-in screen late 2012

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Wow... First I get a software demo in a small room outperforms a tech demo showcasing more polygons than any current gen console can handle<snip>

How many polygons was that? I didn't have time to count them all.

and now there is someone saying that 720p isn't HD. I guess that mean that the 360 was an SD console just like the Wii. Worst of all, they seem to keep forgetting that it was already stated that the console renders in 1080p...

The console renders what in 1080? The PS3 and 360 can render in 1080.

Who cares about COD?

Nintendo.

If you want to play that you should stick to a standard controller on the 360.

Nintendo disagree.

Nintendo is about innovation and I can't think of many things that are less innovative than a military 1st person shooter.

I can. A mascot based platform game.

I consider COD to be beneath the U controller.

Nintendon't. They'd be happy to see COD on the Wu and would like to see it make good use of the WuCon.

 

[lilbroK]

COD was just an example of a popular multiplat franchise. The majority of WiiU games are likely to be 3rd party multiplat titles, and so they are important.

There is potential, which is most likely to come from WiiU exclusives, but you seem to take great inovation as a given, others will wait to see if that potential is ever realised in a big way. I certainly havent seen or heard anything so far that has convinced me, though i would be happy if im proven wrong. I appreciate your enthusiasm but you really shouldnt expect everyone to be as optimistic as you, from experience it doesnt usually end well

Typical theft of ideas and lack of creativity. I bet EA will be the first on that boat. The majority of games they released on the Wii were rip offs of games that managed to do well.

I'm not sure whether Sony or Microsoft will be the first to rip off the controller though. On one hand you have the six axis which was made to conceptually compete with the Wii Remote(ie, our motion controls vs. there's... and we have more axises) then after it failed you had Move which was just straight theft , and then you have Microsoft which is built from the ground up on taking the creations of other and using them for themselves.

All in all, Nintendo had better invest a lot of money in getting games on that system and getting it out there. It they get a big enough install base it will be just like the PS2. Even thought the consoles that came out after were stronger, it kept the lead because of its software library. That is really all Nintendo needed with the regular Wii itself. Lets hope they do it right with the U.

 

[ShadowRunner]

Typical theft of ideas and lack of creativity. I bet EA will be the first on that boat. The majority of games they released on the Wii were rip offs of games that managed to do well.

I'm not sure whether Sony or Microsoft will be the first to rip off the controller though. On one hand you have the six axis which was made to conceptually compete with the Wii Remote(ie, our motion controls vs. there's... and we have more axises) then after it failed you had Move which was just straight theft , and then you have Microsoft which is built from the ground up on taking the creations of other and using them for themselves.

Not Really sure where that came from or what its related to?

 

[-tkf-]

I can. A mascot based platform game.

The Mascot based Platform game has reinvented itself since the first Mascot game was released.
And the mascot branched out to a wealth of other genres of which several saw another reinvention.

Which is pretty hard to say about shooters since Doom.

 

[dobwal]

720p is HD? I thought that was the weird intermediary format that the electronics industry used to milk the HD customers for money, creating an artificial step between SD and HD in order to extend the marketing benefits of increased resolution for another half a decade or so.

The electronics giants are very skilled at their game of stratification of markets, but I thought this particular shenanigan had run its course, being replaced by 3D, higher frequency interpolation and dynamic backlighting. 720p has run its course. Tv-sets aren't sold with this resolution anymore, no consumer camcorder has used the format for years, even DSLRs use 1080p these days, and of course you'll be hard pressed to find computer screens with resolutions that low. Even cell phones (!) output to 1080p these days.

To respond to the actual question - of course the Wii U can fit such a GPU, it's just a question of how much work it can perform per pixel. But interpreting your question one step further, and assuming that you ask if the Wii U could fit a GPU that can render anything the PS360 GPUs do, but at 720p, the answer is still unequivocally yes. However, what none of us know is if they have actually decided to fit their console with such a GPU. Some developer statements imply that the answer is yes, while a couple of other imply that Nintendo has settled for parity with PS360. It's by no means certain that we will ever know the details of the Wii U hardware, leaving the issue open for forum shouting matches for the next 5-10 years.

WOW?

What country are you talking about, because you not talking about the vast majority of the world the rest of us lives in? In the US, the vast majority of the HD TV sets still support 720p since the vast majority of digital HD channels are still broadcasted in 720p/1080i. Furthermore, a rather high share HD camcorders sold in the US still support 720p. And in the US you will find that 99% of smartphones don't come with a screen resolution anywhere near 1920 X 1080. A lot of DSLRs not only support 720p video recording but some still don't offer 1080p recording, which is surprising since DSLR have big sensors to capture still images at resolutions far beyond 1080p, which makes supporting 1080p a piece of cake.

For at least the last 5 years on the majority of HD device, 1080p always represent the high level of a feature set of supported resolutions, not sole resolution supported. Plus, we've had a console that can natively render at 1080p and been readily described as a 1080p console (does anyone remember the two hdmi ports on the PS3 mock up) and still is the only console to support 1080p off a optical medium, but now Nintendo labels its console "1080p" and it implicitily implies that all games off the Wii-U will required to be natively render at 1080p and match the 360/PS3 to boot when both commonly work with half the amount of pixels that the Wii will be forced at for 1080p.

 

[Blazkowicz]

what about anti-aliasing?

while playing a few PS3 games on letterbox 576i, I've found there was quite more aliasing that I would expect.
downscaling doesn't quite do the trick. be it downscaling from 720p to 480p, or from 1080p to 720p, that is 2.25X ordered-grid supersampling, which is weak.

a game downscaled from 1080p to 480p/i should thus look good (that's 5x AA) but a good deal wasteful (wasteful, bad-looking kind of AA)
I'd rather see proper anti-aliasing, at a target resolution of 720p. that would improve the picture on all TV sets.

 

[patsu]

And that's exactly why the WuCon will not be successful, COD and all the other games like it that make up the vast majority of gaming.

That logic didn't apply to Wiimote or even iPad.

 

[dobwal]

That logic didn't apply to Wiimote or even iPad.

Probably nothing logical about it, because its not true. Look at a Wii top selling list and you will see titles that rival COD in sales.

 

[obonicus]

I'm not sure the iPad belongs in this discussion. It can do other things.

 

[patsu]

Look at iPad game sales. Don't look at iPad books and Sports Illustrated video sales twisted. The hardware base is not that big but games is the top sales items based on an earlier public data I saw. Nintendo and Sony should carry the momentum and run with it.

 

[dobwal]

what about anti-aliasing?

while playing a few PS3 games on letterbox 576i, I've found there was quite more aliasing that I would expect.
downscaling doesn't quite do the trick. be it downscaling from 720p to 480p, or from 1080p to 720p, that is 2.25X ordered-grid supersampling, which is weak.

a game downscaled from 1080p to 480p/i should thus look good (that's 5x AA) but a good deal wasteful (wasteful, bad-looking kind of AA)
I'd rather see proper anti-aliasing, at a target resolution of 720p. that would improve the picture on all TV sets.

I agree. I think 1080p is over hyped feature bullet point especially for gaming. I think if the Wii at 1080p can do what the PS360 does at sub 720p, then sub 720p games would kill on the Wii and produce a visual gap that simply going to 1080p wouldn't produce.

 

[dobwal]

The Mascot based Platform game has reinvented itself since the first Mascot game was released.
And the mascot branched out to a wealth of other genres of which several saw another reinvention.

Which is pretty hard to say about shooters since Doom.

No, Nintendo has sucessfully reinvented Mario around several different genres and a plethora of games. I don't why you think you can generalize a phenemnom that specifically only occurs for a specific set of characters from one brand. Its not like Sega or Sony is burning up the charts with a bunch of Sonic and Crash Bandicott games spread across several different genres.

 

[pc999]

Just to point out that EA this time, being in partnership with Nintendo for the online, does have a personal take in the success of Wii U.

So that probably mean that very popular games like Fifa/NFL or Battlefield/MH and the big names will very probably take added value for the Wii U,the best way to do that is by gameplay elements

Other big publishers are also sporting improvements like Ubisoft with Ghost Recon: Online (good uses for the Wipad), improvements for the anvil engine in Assassins Creed, and 2 BRAND NEW IPs.

There is some talk about a exclusive FF too.

Not only that but they had in the video a plethora of game designers saying that will have new features eg in Teken they even showed customization of characters and dual matches at the same time. That for the first release in a Nintendo console.

They are already taking advantage of it.

 

[fehu]

some generic article is gericially sayingn that generally is 50% more powerfull than the ps3

 

[Deleted member 13524]

some generic article is gericially sayingn that generally is 50% more powerfull than the ps3

Care to point out where that generic article can be read?

 

[obonicus]

Yeah, but what does that even mean? Hahahaha, there's so much nonsense.

 

[fehu]

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/wii-u-is-actually-50-more-powerful-than-ps3---report/

i precisely forgot the link

 

[Trejser]

Care to point out where that generic article can be read?

http://www.industrygamers.com/news/wii-u-is-actually-50-more-powerful-than-ps3---report/

And here are some pretty interesting news from Gustav Halling:

http://www.gustavhalling.com/2011/06/08/wiiu-thoughts-nintendos-new-console/

- It’s not a big step up from consoles as x360 or PS3, it is better hardware wise but when the new xbox and ps4 comes it will be runned down again, wanted to see something much stronger.

- All the Zelda stuff was RENDERED, we havent seen anything play on the console in their show, all “good looking” stuff was rendered. BF3 was from our movies. I dont think the end game results will be significantly better than x360 and PS3. But the extra RAM will help with player limits that are stopping x360/ps3 today in for example BF3.

I did say I am exited about the controller.
I won't be exited about the console until I see a good game running on it.
Using SD card and "usb" devices, disabling internal permanent storage is
also weak in my mind, wouldn't be suprised if it is for ppl to buy Nintendo
licensed H.D.Ds later to have the illusion of a cheaper console.

We devs need storage to run and patch our games properly, something
Microsoft is being a showstopper on current gen with their x360 without
harddrive and 4mb title update limits.
Meaning we can't patch what we want if needed.

The future will tell what WiiU will give us

Didn't say it wouldn't compete with current gen.

But I know how much RAM the WiiU has and I have an idea of how much "we" developers would like to see in the next Xbox and PS4, and they differ a lot.

Still, the WiiU will be the most powerful console out there when it's released, BY FAR!
But I wonder for how long...
Nintendo cant go and compete with MS and Sony i think because they want to keep their console cheaper as with the Wii.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Incorrect. It is just head tracking in GT5 and nothing else. Same in The Fight, which is the only other title that really implements it, and that too cannot do head-tracking reliably against a chaotic background. I just think you're wrong. It only seems to be a doddle, given the right circumstances.

I'm kinda confused by that. Digital cameras can manage face and smile recognition no worries. Triangulating a position from eyes and mouth is easy, and in something like head-tracking where you don't need fine-grained particularly sensitivity, there shouldn't be any issues with resolution limits. I don't understand how they can be struggling and unable to use PSEye in a meaningful way due to technical limits. If so, I guess it means all that Sony PR about possible PSEye uses was all make-believe...

And that is again way outclassed by the Wii, no question about it. I expect the WuCon to be supported similarly, as it comes standard with the new console. And I certainly agree that we don't have to care about CoD at all for this controller...

Hang on, I wasn't ever saying WuCon won't see good use. I only said it won't see good use in all the conventional titles that get Wuu ports. Sixaxis may have some examples of great games, but the core games of COD, FIFA, et al, never made use of it. Likewise use of WiCon will be as a DS3 with a screen in the middle by my reckoning. Games developed for Wuu should make good use of WuuCon, but the migration of existing and potential future PS360 owners to Wuu won't be facilitated by an amazingly superior game experience, IMHO. Wuu won't be making headlines with it's amazing FIFA experience because it has a touch screen, any more than PS3 was the platform of choice of FIFA because it enabled you to use natural motions to help with the complex interface. If 3rd parties do embrace WuuCon and actively implement novel and useful systems on it, then Sony is doing something wrong in promoting its own technologies for failing to get same said developers making the most of PS3's input options. EA have announced support for Kinect in four upcoming titles - it'll be interesting to see if that's anything more than the most mundane implementation like voice commands for navigating the menus.

 

[Rangers]

^^ Wow, the most interesting stuff yet from someone who seems to know.

Once again we see more RAM mentioned, but maybe not a great deal. Is 768MB possible? Makes sense to help with the added burden of rendering the controller. Either 768 or 1GB I think.

Many of you are probably disappointed by those comments, but I'm coming from a more realistic perspective that it had looked exactly equal to PS360 after E3, it appears now it will possibly be a 33-50% step up, so that's actually a positive for me.

Will start to gently put a bit more pressure on Sony MS then, but it's clearly not a generation step either, which again I never expected.