Fact: Nintendo to release HD console + controllers with built-in screen late 2012

[tongue_of_colicab]

While I agree, nobody is going to buy a 300 dollar console along with a couple of hundred dollars in controllers just to play souped up board games. You'll have just as much fun, and probably more sitting at the table with your mates and a drink for only a couple of bucks.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Although that's great in concept, I question the implementation and choices of Nintendo here. If it were me, I'd actively support that sort of personal device cooperative gaming through mobile devices. Many people already have Android phones or iPods capable of providing a useful interface without having to shell out £100 or whatever these controllers are going to cost. The cost of providing this experience could be a £200-300 console and whatever handhelds you already own or intend to buy, rather than £200-300 console plus several hundred pounds worth of controllers which you'd rather spend on a new tablet.

Sony could potentially go that route with PSS. If Android and iOS can connect to Sony devices through it, they could enable remote play and multiplayer interfaces through their software layer, competing with Nintendo in features but being priced way more competitively. Not sure that MS are positioned to try such a thing. Of course, Nintendo will actually have a system designed around this concept instead of it being an afterthought, so would get the better software which would define it. But cost is likely to be prohibitive. I'm sure 3DS will be able to function as a controller, or else Nintendo are asking too much of their userbase's wallets.

 

[Teasy]

While I agree, nobody is going to buy a 300 dollar console along with a couple of hundred dollars in controllers just to play souped up board games. You'll have just as much fun, and probably more sitting at the table with your mates and a drink for only a couple of bucks.

Nobody ever bought a console just because it had rumble either, does that mean rumble wasn't a good idea?

We're talking about one possible feature of a system here, not the entire picture.

Personally I wouldn't be interested in board games in the slightest, but I'm interested in other possible uses for a detachable screen on a controller.

 

[patsu]

Although that's great in concept, I question the implementation and choices of Nintendo here. If it were me, I'd actively support that sort of personal device cooperative gaming through mobile devices. Many people already have Android phones or iPods capable of providing a useful interface without having to shell out £100 or whatever these controllers are going to cost. The cost of providing this experience could be a £200-300 console and whatever handhelds you already own or intend to buy, rather than £200-300 console plus several hundred pounds worth of controllers which you'd rather spend on a new tablet.

Sony could potentially go that route with PSS. If Android and iOS can connect to Sony devices through it, they could enable remote play and multiplayer interfaces through their software layer, competing with Nintendo in features but being priced way more competitively. Not sure that MS are positioned to try such a thing. Of course, Nintendo will actually have a system designed around this concept instead of it being an afterthought, so would get the better software which would define it. But cost is likely to be prohibitive. I'm sure 3DS will be able to function as a controller, or else Nintendo are asking too much of their userbase's wallets.

Not enough info to engage in discussion. ^_^
Price is indeed a concern, but you probably start with just 1 screen controller ? Still useful for "remote play" and occasional mobile gaming use.

The games and game bundles may encourage you to buy more controllers. It's just a way to increase the utility of dedicated game consoles.

 

[Teasy]

Although that's great in concept, I question the implementation and choices of Nintendo here. If it were me, I'd actively support that sort of personal device cooperative gaming through mobile devices. Many people already have Android phones or iPods capable of providing a useful interface without having to shell out £100 or whatever these controllers are going to cost. The cost of providing this experience could be a £200-300 console and whatever handhelds you already own or intend to buy, rather than £200-300 console plus several hundred pounds worth of controllers which you'd rather spend on a new tablet.

Nintendo would have to provide a base controller with an adjustable connector to fit your mobile phone on though, which would still cost (and probably look crappy). You then have possible compatibility problems such as the phone not fitting the output resolution of the console and the wireless not being good enough to stream effectively. As well as the screens not meeting other requirements Nintendo may want. IMO controllers should be made for the system from top to bottom, anything else just creates more problems then its worth.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Not enough info to engage in discussion. ^_^
Price is indeed a concern, but you probably start with just 1 screen controller ? Still useful for "remote play" and occasional mobile gaming use.

Then you like it and want to play this new 7 player Settlers of Catan game, and price the cost to play at another $500 for 5 controllers...

Whereas if your existing mobile or iPod could provide that personal interface, the cost is just the game. I don't know what phone networking options exist though. Perhaps what I'm thinking of just isn't possible at the moment?

Nintendo would have to provide a base controller with an adjustable connector to fit your mobile phone on though, which would still cost (and probably look crappy). You then have possible compatibility problems such as the phone not fitting the output resolution of the console and the wireless not being good enough to stream effectively. As well as the screens not meeting other requirements Nintendo may want. IMO controllers should be made for the system from top to bottom, anything else just creates more problems then its worth.

Yes and no. Custom controllers are the ideal solution as you say, but they cost a lot (unless Nintendo have a way to make these £40 each, say). Apps can be written pretty painlessly that scale to different devices. Android specifies a minimum spec that you know you can target at any given level, for example. Potentially a proprietary controller could be offered as an option for those without devices, but I wouldn't want to expect lots of people buying lots of expensive controllers. Maybe Nintendo's success with Wii Fit has them thinking the market is willing to go to 100 bucks plus a controller? Or maybe these controllers can be made cheap enough?

 

[borowki]

Nobody ever bought a console just because it had rumble either, does that mean rumble wasn't a good idea?

We're talking about one possible feature of a system here, not the entire picture.

Rumble would be a lousy idea if it just functions as a substitute vibrator That's basically what some people are arguing, that the screen will just function as a screen. My opinion is that the touch screen only makes sense if it simulates some part of the game reality.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

I also fail to understand why everyone assumes the controller will cost >= £100, or $150 and the console will cost £300 or $450.

First of all, I don't think that even with the "SDK V1.3" crazy specs the console would be that expensive, as it's been rumoured to use some out-of-the-box components in order to cut costs.

The Wiimotes also used pretty straightforward technology for their time (infra-red camera, accelerometers, bluetooth, internal memory, speaker, etc) and they never passed the $50 dollar mark.
Sure, the new controllers will probably be more expensive, but looking at a possible BOM, I don't know how adding an LCD touchscreen and a puny camera sensor will cost another $100. My bet would be on <$100 for each extra touchsreen controller, with most games having the capability of being playable with a Wiimote for split-screen multiplayer.



I for one am really hyped with the remote play function. For many times, I play in my PSP while at home because I just feel like lying in my bed (or simply not leaving it during weekends), even though I have a high-end gaming PC in my bedroom.

Heck, I'd pay quite a bit for an efficient and fail-proof way to stream games from my gaming PC to my UMPC, even if it was limited to Wireless N networks. Streammygame is just too buggish and hard to use.

Nintendo Stream (or just "Nintendo Nintendo", according to latest rumours?) would solve all that for me.

Then you like it and want to play this new 7 player Settlers of Catan game, and price the cost to play at another $500 for 5 controllers...

Whereas if your existing mobile or iPod could provide that personal interface, the cost is just the game. I don't know what phone networking options exist though. Perhaps what I'm thinking of just isn't possible at the moment?

First and foremost, I don't think Nintendo will upgrade the 4-player-per-console limit.
As for having to buy all the additional controllers, I find that a bit exaggerating. I have a Wii, I've had lots of game sessions at my home with 4 players and I've never had to buy 4 Wiimotes.
There are so many people with Wiis that all I have to do is ask them to bring their own controllers. That was the point of keeping player information in the controller from the beginning.



I also believe connecting handhelds with puny touchscreens would become more of a hindrance than an advantage for many games.
There's a valid reason why the screen is 6" and not 3.5".

 

[Teasy]

Then you like it and want to play this new 7 player Settlers of Catan game, and price the cost to play at another $500 for 5 controllers...

Whereas if your existing mobile or iPod could provide that personal interface, the cost is just the game. I don't know what phone networking options exist though. Perhaps what I'm thinking of just isn't possible at the moment?

Yes and no. Custom controllers are the ideal solution as you say, but they cost a lot (unless Nintendo have a way to make these £40 each, say). Apps can be written pretty painlessly that scale to different devices. Android specifies a minimum spec that you know you can target at any given level, for example. Potentially a proprietary controller could be offered as an option for those without devices, but I wouldn't want to expect lots of people buying lots of expensive controllers. Maybe Nintendo's success with Wii Fit has them thinking the market is willing to go to 100 bucks plus a controller? Or maybe these controllers can be made cheap enough?

I don't see any reason why they couldn't be around £40. To me the idea of using phones sounds far too hit and miss. Even though I have one of the best phones for that kind of idea in the Samsung Galaxy S II.

 

[patsu]

Then you like it and want to play this new 7 player Settlers of Catan game, and price the cost to play at another $500 for 5 controllers...

Whereas if your existing mobile or iPod could provide that personal interface, the cost is just the game. I don't know what phone networking options exist though. Perhaps what I'm thinking of just isn't possible at the moment?

Yap ! I like the concept. It gives Nintendo and customers a versatile entertainment platform (living room and mobile together). Make sense if they can keep the price reasonable. Thought of this set up some time ago. It's part of the reasons I hope Sony look into distributed computing.

Existing phones and pads already have some of these games. e.g., You pass the iPad around for playing Monopoly and Scrabble. Note that you can do the same here... pass the screen controller around for such games, but if you have more than one, then it may be easier to play. The cost of one screen controller should be much cheaper than an iPad.

For using existing phones... I don't think it's necessarily mutually exclusive to Nintendo's model if their hands are forced. You can always download an app for the phone to join Nintendo's cluster. I don't like to litter my phone with too many apps but your mileage may vary.


Then there is another rumor about OnLive-style gaming for these screen controllers...


For Sony, their user base is very different. So I think their approach should/will be different even if they thought of the same idea. I think there are many ways to do this.
(Technically, doing it with Cell computing model is more sexy and may have additional benefits. ^_^)

 

[pc999]

Saw the XB conference.

Almost all the good ideas* for having a screen in the controller could be done on a camera+microphone, probably in a beter way,plus at no additional cost for multiplayer games.

So I really hope that if the screen is true, that it is only a small part of their strategy.

*menu navigation, commands, special ability...all besides the private info/portable stuff.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I also fail to understand why everyone assumes the controller will cost >= £100

This thing can't be particular cheap to make, ignoring any potential profit Nintendo may want to make. Add in typical Euro markups, and it's not hard to see why some of us pessimistically talk that way. The £300 price of the console comes from a £200 console and £100 controller, or similar. The controller cost has to be added the minimum price unless Nintendo decide to go with a loss leader, which I'm sure they won't.

Sure, the new controllers will probably be more expensive, but looking at a possible BOM, I don't know how adding an LCD touchscreen and a puny camera sensor will cost another $100. My bet would be on <$100 for each extra touchsreen controller, with most games having the capability of being playable with a Wiimote for split-screen multiplayer.

You're probably right, but $80-90 per controller is still a lot. It's more about the psychological impression than actual value.

I for one am really hyped with the remote play function. For many times, I play in my PSP while at home because I just feel like lying in my bed (or simply not leaving it during weekends), even though I have a high-end gaming PC in my bedroom.

It's good for some, for sure. Not sure how well that'll sell the system though. Wii was sold to families and such on its social strength. For gamers who want their gaming portable, Project Cafe will offer better graphics than NGP, but only while you're in range of access to your box. If the controllers have Wifi then Nintendo can implement long-range remote play like PS3, but that's adding to the cost and issues of the controller.

Nintendo Stream (or just "Nintendo Nintendo", according to latest rumours?) would solve all that for me.

How representative do you think you are to the majority of the potential market? You might be right, but my gut is that the appeal of playing your console in your house on a portable small screen isn't really a big draw for most. Heck, that's even a big argument against future NGP success!

As for having to buy all the additional controllers, I find that a bit exaggerating. I have a Wii, I've had lots of game sessions at my home with 4 players and I've never had to buy 4 Wiimotes.
There are so many people with Wiis that all I have to do is ask them to bring their own controllers.

That's true and I do the same. That only works for people coming over though. For a family wanting to game together, you need enough controllers. It's the maximum price that families will be looking at. Hence the cost of a family virtual boardgame is going to be very high.

I also believe connecting handhelds with puny touchscreens would become more of a hindrance than an advantage for many games.
There's a valid reason why the screen is 6" and not 3.5".

There are lots of large screen devices and loads more coming. I agree a 6" screen is advantageous, but that has to be weighed against cost. If my choice is an iPhone for me and the misses and a £200 console, or a £300 console and another £100 for another controller and £200 less to spend on phones so we have to get something else, the competition for Nintendo in terms of gadget dollars is high. If Nintendo could offer both optional controllers and support for your iDevice, they'd have a wider potential market.

 

[patsu]

Saw the XB conference.

Almost all the good ideas* for having a screen in the controller could be done on a camera+microphone, probably in a beter way,plus at no additional cost for multiplayer games.

So I really hope that if the screen is true, that it is only a small part of their strategy.

*menu navigation, commands, special ability...all besides the private info/portable stuff.

Not really true. Camera and voice input are generally much slower compared to a real controller. Besides, one camera can't look from multiple perspectives, one microphone may not take in multiple input at the same time.

I believe Ninty's controller has it's own camera. The most glaring downside is price.

If the rumor is true, we haven't even covered streaming games and freedom to play from anywhere a stationary camera can't see.

I know Kinect have problems tracking little kids too. Sad to see a liitle girl in Fry's waving as hard as she could but scored 0 out of 8 tries. Kids are key Nintendo consumers.

 

[pc999]

Ok saw the PS Vita, you link can the PSV to PS3 and play on PS3 the reverse of the rumors for Nintendo.

I will say it again:

I think someone messed up the Nintendo rumors with PSVita

I willneed live prove to belive in those, but I cant figure out what else they could do.

Maybewith afourdable todays OLEDS and sensor they can try a new Virtual boy .

 

[Deleted member 13524]

Ok saw the PS Vita, you link can the PSV to PS3 and play on PS3 the reverse of the rumors for Nintendo.

Maybe we saw different presentations, as I didn't see any of that.
All I saw was cross-platformed games for PSVita and PS3, and potentially getting the same game for both consoles for the price of a single game, probably with compatible save games between both.platforms.


That said, the graphics you get in the Stream\Feel's controller are destined to be a #lot# better than what you'll see in the NGP. Even more if Nintendo applies additional filters when using a single controller, in order to compensate for rendering a quarter of the target resolution.

 

[GZ007]

And what if the screen is mainly a touch screen and just a basic cheap display. Something like a VCU - virtual control unit.

So basicly the display can be a infinite number of input configuration and type. U can have 2 or 16 aditional buttons if the game needs. U can have a cool virtual keyboard for fast chating , browser input and so on.
And u could make not just buttons but sliders (Steel Diver) or for example a piano board. Basicly a virtual input device that can be anything thanks to the touch screen.

 

[V3]

Maybewith afourdable todays OLEDS and sensor they can try a new Virtual boy .

Yeah, if they're going to have technology that let them stream data to the controller wirelessly, why stop there, why not give gamers a proper HMD, highres, 180 degree field of view and 3D, plus all the tracking.

 

[Deleted member 13524]

4h30m until the E3 presentation.

The silence before the storm.. grrr I hate this..

 

[nintenho]

Wii....U

 

[patsu]

Ok saw the PS Vita, you link can the PSV to PS3 and play on PS3 the reverse of the rumors for Nintendo.

I will say it again:

I think someone messed up the Nintendo rumors with PSVita

I willneed live prove to belive in those, but I cant figure out what else they could do.

Maybewith afourdable todays OLEDS and sensor they can try a new Virtual boy .

Rumor confirmed:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/07/the-wiiu-controller-revealed/

Name aside, here's a very nice video showing the capability of a touch controller ! ^_^