Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2020]

[Lalaland]

Six.

The answer is six.

Now that I've settled how many angels dance on the head of a pin I shall examine which mid range card is a useful comparison for the RT capabilities of a new console on a new architecture and without useful cross platform titles to do a real world test with.

Hi, does Digital Foundry have comparison between cross-platform games of PS5 and Xb Sx? Thanks.

Oh they will but neither have launched yet so expect those after launch

 

[London Geezer]

To anyone worrying about whether the PS5 is closer to 2070 or 2070 Super performance: have a hearty meal and then a hefty wank and ask yourself again if you're really that bothered.

I'm not.

*Burp*

Honestly this is what I’ve been wondering. Who the hell cares??????

 

[iroboto]

INT32 should never be counted towards FLOPs, because, INTs aren't FLOPs.

Well aware . But the hardware is being used in parallel regardless.

 

[iroboto]

understand availability argument but still don't get putting rx5700 (not xt) on description

5700xt is a better lock for clockspeed and overall TF but running 40CU. 5700 is a better lock for CUs

yea not really a good answer to go with when concerning which one will drive RT performance.

 

[snc]

5700xt is a better lock for clockspeed and overall TF but running 40CU. 5700 is a better lock for CUs

yea not really a good answer to go with when concerning which one will drive RT performance.

5700xt ~10tf rdna1 is probably better performance indicator of ps5 ~10tf rdna2 gpu than ~8tf rdna rx5700

 

[iroboto]

5700xt ~10tf rdna1 is probably better performance indicator of ps5 ~10tf rdna2 gpu than ~8tf rdna rx5700

Yea for overall performance yes I think so too. An interesting debate they must have gone through. Splitting hairs on which one to go with even with the discussion between which closest nvidia card to be comparative with.

 

[Dictator]

5700xt ~10tf rdna1 is probably better performance indicator of ps5 ~10tf rdna2 gpu than ~8tf rdna rx5700

RT performance throws a wrench in that one till we have PC RDNA 2 GPUs. Which also will once again have more dedicated bandwidth than the PS5 so it will be... Interesting.

The other point to make about the RTX 2060S is that it will be the GPU I put in my lower midrange Machine and try and run console settings on it. I will do the same for the RDNA 2 competitior there. Just like I do today on a gtx 1060/rx 580 testbed which I will be phasing out and replacing with a rtx 2060S (or Ampere equivalent) /RDNA 2 PC with a Ryzen 3600x like CPU.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Honestly this is what I’ve been wondering. Who the hell cares??????

Fanboys.

 

[snc]

RT performance throws a wrench in that one till we have PC RDNA 2 GPUs. Which also will once again have more dedicated bandwidth than the PS5 so it will be... Interesting.

both 5700xt and 5700 have 448gb/s bandwidth

 

[Dictator]

both 5700xt and 5700 have 448gb/s bandwidth

Dedicated bandwidth here means bandwidth just for the GPU - the PS5's GPU share its bandwidth to its RAM pool with the CPU and may also have an unknown level of contention as well like existed on PS4.

 

[snc]

Dedicated bandwidth here means bandwidth just for the GPU - the PS5's GPU share its bandwidth to its RAM pool with the CPU and may also have an unknown level of contention as well like existed on PS4.

ok understand your argument but rumours says rdna2 has cache improvements and ps5 isn't probalby bandwidth lacking

 

[PSman1700]

Its good for users to know youd get around with a 2060S level of performance if you want parity with PS5 and exceeding its RT abilities.
A 3050/3060 and your golden probably for exceeding alltogether.

 

[iroboto]

ok understand your argument but rumours says rdna2 has cache improvements and ps5 isn't probalby bandwidth lacking

in a traditional sense until we learn more, 448 GB/s dedicated vs 448 GB/s in contention with CPU, I think we both understand why he would choose to go with the 448 dedicated. We just don't know enough in the public space to make a call about cache improvements being able to mitigate bandwidth requirements.

 

[Deleted member 86764]

Its good for users to know youd get around with a 2060S level of performance if you want parity with PS5 and exceeding its RT abilities.
A 3050/3060 and your golden probably for exceeding alltogether.

The 2060S presumably can run Death Stranding at 4k 60hz with DLSS off? Seeing as the PS4-PS5 Spiderman goes from 1080p@30hz to 4K@60hz.

Honestly, I hardly care - it's just we can test the theory using logic and mathematics.

 

[iroboto]

The 2060S presumably can run Death Stranding at 4k 60hz with DLSS off? Seeing as the PS4-PS5 Spiderman goes from 1080p@30hz to 4K@60hz.

Honestly, I hardly care - it's just we can test the theory using logic and mathematics.

Hmm I think it's possible on PS4 Pro settings it can achieve that, though on max PC settings it will do 46 fps at 4K.

 

[PSman1700]

Hmm I think it's possible on PS4 Pro settings it can achieve that, though on max PC settings it will do 46 fps at 4K.

PC max is higher then Pro i think DF mentioned something about that. Anyway, you cant compare two totally different games, spiderman and DS as their both on complete different engines. Il side with DF and assume its ballpark RTX2070 in rasterization performance. It could be higher in some cases or lower in others, no idea.

And like alex mentioned, those are 2018 products, i think Alex/DF will replace the 2060s with a 3050/3060 as their lower end machine to compare to PS5 (and XSX?). With probably the 3600x zen3 variant of that etc.

 

[iroboto]

Just to make sure we're doing a bit more representative of DF comparative choices:
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/...theory-does-a-4tf-next-gen-console-make-sense

They used the 5500 de-tuned to represent Lockhart. Having the chance now to look back at their choices and the resulting final spec, (though we are still waiting for final review),their choices fairly within the vicinity of what to expect in terms of performance.

pro thoughts here from Richard:

thought it would be interesting to see how the results would adjust if this time we stacked up a circa four teraflop Navi graphics card up against both Xbox One X and PC-based GCN products tuned to deliver 6TF of compute performance. I used a Radeon RX 5500 XT, downclocked from its 'real life' game clock-based 4.8TF to around 4.3TF. The RX 5500 XT features 22 active compute units from 24 total - and my gut feeling (and nothing more!) is that an actual Lockhart machine would likely feature increased clock speeds and fewer CUs, necessitating a slight rebalancing on the part of my surrogate PC.

Even then, I think that our Navi-based GPU may be falling short of a prospective Lockhart spec. The RX 5500 XT only has a 128-bit interface with 224GB/s of memory bandwidth connected to four or eight gigabytes of GDDR6. If Lockhart ships with 12GB of memory, the most cost-effective solution is likely a 192-bit bus, with something in the region of 288GB/s of bandwidth.

he detuned to about 1500MHz IIRC.
Anyway how right his instincts were

Final Series S Specs: (source):
Processor 8x Cores @ 3.6 GHz (3.4 GHz w/ SMT) Custom Zen 2 CPU
Graphics 4 TFLOPS, 20 CUs @ 1.565 GHz Custom RDNA 2 GPU
Memory 10 GB GDDR6
Memory Bandwidth 8 GB @ 224 GB/s, 2GB @ 56 GB/s
Internal Storage 512 GB Custom NVME SSD
I/O Throughput 2.4 GB/s uncompressed, 4.8 GB/s compressed
Expandable Storage 1 TB Expansion Card (matches internal storage exactly)
External Storage USB 3.2 External HDD Support
Optical Drive None, digital-only
Performance Target 1440p @ 60 FPS, up to 120 FPS
Color Robot White, Black
Dimensions Unknown (60% smaller than Xbox Series X)
Price $299, £249, €299
Release date November 10, 2020

 

[Deleted member 86764]

Hmm I think it's possible on PS4 Pro settings it can achieve that, though on max PC settings it will do 46 fps at 4K.

Considering increased settings in Spiderman proportional to PS4 then it sounds like the 2060S punches below PS5 *shrugs*.

 

[iroboto]

Considering increased settings in Spiderman proportional to PS4 then it sounds like the 2060S punches below PS5 *shrugs*.

Yea I'm not sure. We'll need to wait to find out.
I can't know what I don't know. Based on the knowledge in the public space I would have put PS5 at a overclocked 5700XT, or an 50th anniversary 5700XT and that should punch at 2070 or above.
But looking back, DF has been pretty spot on with a lot of things, and I don't know what they may know. So it's a data point I keep in my head. A bit like poker and having multiple people playing in a hand. If you consider DF to be very accurate, you're just going to watch what they do before you place your bid.

 

[PSman1700]

Considering increased settings in Spiderman proportional to PS4 then it sounds like the 2060S punches below PS5 *shrugs*.

Would be easier if spiderman engine had a pc version too i think.

I can't know what I don't know. Based on the knowledge in the public space I would have put PS5 at a overclocked 5700XT, or an 50th anniversary 5700XT and that should punch at 2070 or above.

Theres where i think it sits too, instead of comparing it to nvidia products.... And there is where DF put it aswell (around 2070). In 2018 we where hoping for GTX 1070 performance, no ray tracing and no SSDs