Chat with J Allard

[kyleb]

I had to buy a memory card when I bought a PS1, a PS2, a Dreamcast, an Xbox, and a GameCube. I also had to buy a second controller.

The Xbox had the HDD built in and ready to save games so most people didn't have to worry about a memory card.

But the second controller cost argument against the core system is a red hearing as the premium package only comes with one controller as well/

 

[Carl B]

Bad Boy I understand what you're saying on the memory card thing, just not the controller thing. I mean the 'premium' version only comes with one controller also, so if you're going to do cost comparisons on the consoles with the assumption of two controllers, you might as well add a controller to the price of the premium as well.

EDIT: Kyleb, you're fast man! Beat me to it

 

[Confidence-Man]

I actually prefer the core system.

I don't want a wireless controller (ultimately more $$ to recharge), I don't care about backward compatibility, I don't have an HDTV, and the most content I've ever downloaded is a couple maps.

For the price of a premium system alone I can get the core system, memory card, and a game.

The only reservation I have is if games like Oblivion have noticably better performance with the HDD.

 

[Bad_Boy]

First, weekends are not free. Only special promotional weekends will be free. Second, only 10% of Xbox users are online. When only 1 out of every 10 consumers will use the headset, it makes sense to bundle it in the premium version and not in the core version.

ok sorry about the free part, im pretty uninformed on that so thats my fault.

but cmon, if only 10% of the entire world had a disease, does that mean to just ignore those 10% and try not to make a cure. no, because its still a pretty high number even if its 10%. and what about those other 90% that have the potential to get the disease too?

bad analogy i know, but do you get what im saying?

Bad Boy I understand what you're saying on the memory card thing, just not the controller thing. I mean the 'premium' version only comes with one controller also, so if you're going to do cost comparisons on the consoles with the assumption of two controllers, you might as well add a controller to the price of the premium as well.

yeah i see what your saying, that 20 dollars saved turns into 60 if the two controllers are on both packages. but i still feel bad for the core package buyers

ill shutup now.

 

[Sis]

ok sorry about the free part, im pretty uninformed on that so thats my fault.

but cmon, if only 10% of the entire world had a disease, does that mean to just ignore those 10% and try not to make a cure. no, because its still a pretty high number even if its 10%. and what about those other 90% that have the potential to get the disease too?

Yeah, I feel ya man. I'm just saying, MS did take care of everyone. They have a core pack for those who don't have the need. And--as you note--for little more than the price of a controller and memcard, they have a feature rich package.

I just don't understand why people are offended by the 299 pack. It is useful to some group--a VERY small group during launch. But this group will eventually grow to be the dominant group over the lifetime of the console.

.Sis

 

[Lord Darkblade]

Make that $440 for the Premium package, those players probably want a second controller too...

 

[Gholbine]

I love this one, it's gold.

-----
Q: will the loss of HDD mean that all games will be made without the HDD in mind, therefore effecting users of the premium pack?

A: absolute not. consider this last generation where somewhere in the neighborhood of 20% of game consoles had hard drives attached. this did not deter game developers from utilizing the hard drive both for exclusive games and cross platform games on xbox. this generation our first party team and our exclusive content developers are just as committed to using the hard drive and like we they demonstrated with this generation our third party cross platform developers are committed as well. games like splinter cell, madden, and tony hawk all demonstrated unique capabilities in hard drive configured systems.
-----

Good stuff J! We're all totally mindless.

 

[pc999]

About the online I think that this time there is the chance to get much more online user at least on the silver.

About the SKUs I dont like it, the only 2 things I want from the 400 is HDD and headset (which I think we already lost a lot from they not being standart) then the HS is only interesting if we got Gold Live; the wireless as pointed ist much more $$ i.e. it is much worst IMO; all the rest is pretty uniteresting for me. So I never get a good deal.

But a core version + HHD is an ultrage and in the premium I will got things that I really dont want (wireless), and still without gold.

And we still playing on sp even in campain

They maked so much (plain sarcasm), and at the end they forgot those how just want to a complet system to play (or to play all), unless you spend a lot of $$ (which you shouldnt need) so that is why I get offended.

I will wait too see what the others will do, before thinking in get a XB.

 

[Sean*O]

edit.

 

[NavNucST3]

J Allard (Expert):
Q: Why even offer the core package, its seems quite useless
A: great question! the thing to remember that while we designed a no compromises game system, a huge percentage of our customers are not like the folks in this chat room. recognize that more than 75% of the folks on xbox have not played halo. by introducing the core system we are sending a signal to the market that we are committed to this part of the market just like with the xbox 360 premium bundle that we are committed to you.

...

J Allard (Expert):
Q: will the core system come with a memory card? if not, how can u save games?
A: i think it is really important to emphasize especially for the folks in this chat room that we did not design the core system around you guys. similar to the shuffle, the boxter, the 4:3 tv, the 1mpix camera, *we designed the core system as a way to get folks to come into the family at a cheaper prices and decide if an how they scale the system. the great thing about our approach unlike these examples is that the core owner can upgrade the system and match the capabilities of the premium system when the time is right for them.

Alright, let me voice my dismay again...the core system was designed with the casual gamer in mind, yet it is being introduced at a price ($299) that the hard-core gamer is used to paying. How in one breath can you use the logic of memory cards "... which is consistent with the games industry for the last decade." but then introduce a new price point for the casual gamer in the next?

*=my emphasis

As a side note regarding the wi-fi, the price isn't that bad when you consider some of us bought this bad boy (which I love). It retails for $100 (ebuyer has it for about $84 and ebay has it at 105+), and again that one is NOT bus powered and probably four to five times the size. I also bought the DGL-4300 which retails for about $100-130 but at least it is gigabit.

 

[scooby_dooby]

The difference being, this generation, everyone will have live by default and a 30-day trial of Gold. Its really easy to not be interested in something you have never tried. The other difference being that at some point, the realization that here in the states one will HAVE to buy a digital set (one could opt for just a decoder box) if they want to keep their OTA signal. Granted the cutoff date will be towards the end of the 360s life (01JAN09) but I would imagine TV mfrs. and movie studios starting to make a push with HD DVD, BD-ROM, xbox 360, and PS3 all coming out this year and next.

I'm not saying those numbers won't grow, obviously they will. But I still expect that the vast majority will remain off-line players, with SDTV sets. Also, many many games last gen came with free 3 month trials of Live, it didn't mean everyone got on live, there's much more required than just a subscription, you need a PC, highspeed internet, hub, cabling etc etc,

So they(MS) are on the money IMO, people without HDTV and who don't want live shouldn't have to pay for things they really don't need, so MS stripped it down and offered the cheapy base model. In alot of cases people WILL by the base model because it's all they need. It may not be the best "deal" but hey, it plays the same games as the HDD version so it does the trick.

Ihave a feeling people who are used to HDD's will most definately buy the HDD version, many others who've are used to memory cards and don't see what a total rip-off they are, will just buy the base model + MU and start gaming.

It works well.

Badboy - No console has ever come with 2 controllers so I really don't see what you're getting at. We've always had to buyan extra controller + memory card at launch, that just the way she goes.

 

[PARANOiA]

consider this last generation where somewhere in the neighborhood of 20% of game consoles had hard drives attached. this did not deter game developers from utilizing the hard drive both for exclusive games and cross platform games on xbox. this generation our first party team and our exclusive content developers are just as committed to using the hard drive and like we they demonstrated with this generation our third party cross platform developers are committed as well. games like splinter cell, madden, and tony hawk all demonstrated unique capabilities in hard drive configured systems.

Did I miss something? I thought games had to be written to assume there was no HDD?

 

[scooby_dooby]

They don't "have" to do anything.

It's in their best interest not to make games dependant on the HDD as they may lose sales, but they are free to do as they wish as far as I know.

 

[Guden Oden]

Alright, let me voice my dismay again...the core system was designed with the casual gamer in mind, yet it is being introduced at a price ($299) that the hard-core gamer is used to paying. How in one breath can you use the logic of memory cards "... which is consistent with the games industry for the last decade." but then introduce a new price point for the casual gamer in the next?

Well, um, maybe because three 3.2GHz processors with bidirectional 10.5GB/s bus links, 500MHz GPUs, half a gig high-performance GDDR3 system memory and so on costs a lot of money to make?

It seems people keep forgetting what exactly it is this rather small amount of money really buys. Couple years ago you couldn't buy a system like x360 for ANY amount of cash! If you wanted similar capabilities at similar performace it was MUCH larger in size, and MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more expensive!

So instead of bitching over the $300 price point why not save your money instead, or maybe spend it on beer, because there's certainly nobody that FORCES you to buy this console...

 

[NavNucST3]

Badboy - No console has ever come with 2 controllers so I really don't see what you're getting at. We've always had to buyan extra controller + memory card at launch, that just the way she goes.

I distinctly remember my consoles coming with 2 controllers, and I am not THAT old.
I thought it was the playstation that killed off the two controllers...yes/no?

 

[Guden Oden]

I distinctly remember my consoles coming with 2 controllers

Maybe you bought ataris or something I dunno, but no nintendo system was ever offered with two controllers as standard. There were probably promotional pack-in offers for a limited period, but it was neverever standard equipment. I don't think sega included two controllers either, sony definitely didn't. Why should they offer a second controller for free when people would otherwise have to pay a lot of dough for what is essentially a bit of plastic at the end of a string?

 

[Johnny_Physics]

I distinctly remember my consoles coming with 2 controllers, and I am not THAT old.
I thought it was the playstation that killed off the two controllers...yes/no?

The Super Nintendo only came with one controller. At least mine did back in '92 when it was released here in Sweden.
IIRC the NES was the only system I've had that came with two controllers, not even my old Vectrex had two controllers bundled with the machine.

edit: damn, beaten.

 

[NavNucST3]

Well, um, maybe because three 3.2GHz processors with bidirectional 10.5GB/s bus links, 500MHz GPUs, half a gig high-performance GDDR3 system memory and so on costs a lot of money to make?

It seems people keep forgetting what exactly it is this rather small amount of money really buys. Couple years ago you couldn't buy a system like x360 for ANY amount of cash! If you wanted similar capabilities at similar performace it was MUCH larger in size, and MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more expensive!

So instead of bitching over the $300 price point why not save your money instead, or maybe spend it on beer, because there's certainly nobody that FORCES you to buy this console...

IF I were irate I wouldn't have already bought the damn thing in the first place plus four games. Second of all as you get off your high horse let me point out that EVERY generation says the same damn thing...you've never had blah, you've never seen this, you've never been able to do that, if you were to try and find this power in a computer it would cost (insert insane amount). They have always cost alot of damn money to make. But I would imagine you are just going to continue to belittle those who suggest that there has been a paradigm shift in pricing for consoles, for the worse.

 

[Tap In]

Well, um, maybe because three 3.2GHz processors with bidirectional 10.5GB/s bus links, 500MHz GPUs, half a gig high-performance GDDR3 system memory and so on costs a lot of money to make?

It seems people keep forgetting what exactly it is this rather small amount of money really buys. Couple years ago you couldn't buy a system like x360 for ANY amount of cash! If you wanted similar capabilities at similar performace it was MUCH larger in size, and MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more expensive!... snip

that's how I look at it too.

 

[Mr_Puffy]

No for $299 you get a console w/ a controller, just like the n64, ps1, ps2, PS3 etc then you buy a memory card for $40 which is industry standard and people are trained to buy memory cards. So $340 and you are set, you can start buying games.

Sony (PS3) allows users to use non proprietary memory cards(I think?) that are pretty cheap comparatively and the Revolution has 512MB of flash built in. MS seems to be trying to be more Sony then Sony and what they don't realize (or maybe they do and just don't care) is that a lot of the people who got the Xbox, got it because they liked MS's ideas about gaming more then Sony's or Nintendo's but this is changing (for me anyways). Not to mention MS seems to continually use the past “game industryâ€￾ as the standard for the x360 rather then trying to think different or pioneer like I believe they did with the Xbox.

Read only?
We won't be able to copy game saves on USB drives, it seems.
Datel will probably release an Action reply for that, I guess.

Don't all peripherals have to be licensed or wouldn't they have to circumvent MS's security?