All purpose sales and sales rumors/anecdotes thread next gen+

[Silent_Buddha]

Additionally if Australia is anything to go by, it's quite possible that countries other than the US which both Sony and MS shipped to got less PS4 shipments than they got Xbox shipments.

Again that makes sense. Sony had a launch lead in NA. While MS had a launch lead in all other shared regions.

That fact that both companies are selling out of consoles just means that demand is not a factor right now. Only manufacturing capacity and shipment allocations matter currently.

Regards,
SB

 

[Strange]

That fact that both companies are selling out of consoles just means that demand is not a factor right now.

This is not a fact, quite the contrary.

We have plenty of evidence that there are still Xbox One Day One edition well into December in the US, which points out that somebody isn't exactly selling out.

http://www.designntrend.com/article...-includes-xbox-one-day-one-edition-bundle.htm

Monday, Dec. 9 is "Green Monday," one of the busiest shopping days online before Christmas, and to celebrate Walmart is reprising a few of its Black Friday deals, inlcuding an Xbox One bundle.

On Green Monday Walmart will offer extensions of some of its Black Friday sales on its website, giving shoppers another chance to get some discounts before the holidays. The company announced the deals in a press release on its website.


Most notable among the sales is an Xbox One Day One Edition bundle for $617. The bundle offers gamers a choice of one game and one accessory, but only a few will be available. Those who are looking for the console may want to check Walmart.com on Monday, Dec. 9 to possibly get their hands on the console.

Lets not forget that Sony is also preparing for Asia launches in December and eventually the also relatively close Japan launch in February that Microsoft doesn't exactly have plans for in the near future.

 

[Rangers]

Given the actual sales data that we have and the anecdotal evidence I've read, I think Sony shipped a lot more units than MS did for their respective North American launches. I say that because Sony sold-through as many units in North America alone than MS sold worldwide.

Anecdotal evidence tells me that MS is indeed doing a better job refilling the channel in the US (mainly because Sony has to re-supply far more countries), but also that the PS4 sells out a lot quicker when the US do get more PS4s. This is probably because of smaller shipments from Sony compared to MS, and that the demand is higher.

With that all said, I would not be surprised at all if the PS4 is outselling the X1 in the US. I agree with Pacther's PS4 numbers, but I think the X1 sold a bit more than 750K. December will be a different story.

I wish people would stop using "more countries" as a reasoning in either direction for any reason, either for saying MS has more units because they skipped those countries etc. It's likely less than 5% of units either way.

For example a story came out that Brazil (where PS4 has some astronomical price as do all consoles), had zero official PS4 sales at launch. And Brazil would be one of the largest additional markets outside of the main ones. http://www.ubergizmo.com/2013/12/ps4-off-to-a-slow-start-in-brazil/

But my wish shall not be reality and people will continue to assume the countries MS missed and Sony supported make up meaningful units in either direction.

 

[Rangers]

Given the actual sales data that we have and the anecdotal evidence I've read, I think Sony shipped a lot more units than MS did for their respective North American launches. I say that because Sony sold-through as many units in North America alone than MS sold worldwide.

Anecdotal evidence tells me that MS is indeed doing a better job refilling the channel in the US (mainly because Sony has to re-supply far more countries), but also that the PS4 sells out a lot quicker when the US do get more PS4s. This is probably because of smaller shipments from Sony compared to MS, and that the demand is higher.

With that all said, I would not be surprised at all if the PS4 is outselling the X1 in the US. I agree with Pacther's PS4 numbers, but I think the X1 sold a bit more than 750K. December will be a different story.

I think this is a reasonable post. the question would be if XBO's larger reshipments can make up the initial deficit.

The fact MS didn't put out any BF PR for XBO isn't encouraging that they sold a spectacular amount.

Pachter has predicted 1.25m PS4 and 750K XBO on Nov, if we assume he has any insight. Also 149k Wii U.

http://gamerant.com/ps4-xbox-one-november-sales-pachter-predicts/

As far as sales of the consoles go, Pachter estimates that the PlayStation 4 sold 1.25 million units in the US during November, compared to only 750,000 Xbox One units, though this discrepancy can partially be attributed to the Xbox One launching a week later than the PS4. He also predicts that sales of other consoles will have been strongly affected by the new console launches, with Wii U sales down 65 percent year-over-year, Xbox 360 sales down 44 percent and PS3 sales down 28 percent.

According to Games Industry, Pachter sent a note to investors stating that software sales for November would be down by 13 per cent due to slow sales for Battlefield 4 and Assassin’s Creed IV: Black Flag, both of which have apparently had “far weaker-than-expected debuts” (even if Ubisoft had already lowered its expectations).

These underwhelming numbers, along with the somewhat sluggish sales of Call of Duty: Ghosts, have previously been attributed to gamers holding off from buying last-gen versions of the games in order to get the Xbox One and PS4 versions instead.

Actually this does not bode well for the "next gen will cure all" theory of software sales. But with XBO and PS4 going all digital day and date, I wonder how much NPD sales declines mean.

 

[Phil]

On the topic of software sales - how do they track sales of content sold digitally? Or are they not counted at all? I'm just saying because so far, I have bought zero games on disk, but have through PSN (for one, because I got the PS4 before the games were officially on sale). Also, the convinience factor of being able to play your games without having to get up to swap a disk currently outweighs the cons - so I'm thinking there might be more people who think alike. Especially as these consoles have been designed around online sales.

 

[Brad Grenz]

On the topic of software sales - how do they track sales of content sold digitally? Or are they not counted at all? I'm just saying because so far, I have bought zero games on disk, but have through PSN (for one, because I got the PS4 before the games were officially on sale). Also, the convinience factor of being able to play your games without having to get up to swap a disk currently outweighs the cons - so I'm thinking there might be more people who think alike. Especially as these consoles have been designed around online sales.

Sony publishes their "best sellers on PSN" list each month, but it's just a ranking with no figures attached. NPD claims to track digital sales but the charts we see never have digital sales included. For that reason the NPD figures are going to be less and less meaningful moving forward. I, for instance, own many Vita games, but not a single physical copy of any title. I would be 100% digital on PS3 this year, too, but God of War: Ascension and Beyond: Two Souls weren't available through PSN when I bought them. I can't imagine buying any disc games when I upgrade to next gen. Not having to swap discs and never having to worry about losing or damaging a game are far more valuable to me than resale rights. Games are a shitty investment anyway.

 

[djskribbles]

Sony sold 80,000 in Spain with 12,000 - 15,000 pre-orders still needed to be filled. Selling at a 3.5:1 ratio according to Sony.

http://www.meristation.com/playstation-3/noticias/ps4-vende-80-000-consolas-en-espana/61/1942209
http://www.europapress.es/portaltic...-mas-triple-xbox-one-sony-20131210131202.html

I wish people would stop using "more countries" as a reasoning in either direction for any reason, either for saying MS has more units because they skipped those countries etc. It's likely less than 5% of units either way.

For example a story came out that Brazil (where PS4 has some astronomical price as do all consoles), had zero official PS4 sales at launch. And Brazil would be one of the largest additional markets outside of the main ones. http://www.ubergizmo.com/2013/12/ps4-off-to-a-slow-start-in-brazil/

But my wish shall not be reality and people will continue to assume the countries MS missed and Sony supported make up meaningful units in either direction.

The PS4 costs an arm and a leg in Brazil due to taxes. No wonder they didn't sell any. Most people are probably importing.

Sony and MS's allocation between countries will be different, so when we're discussing sales in the US, it does matter that the PS4 is sold in more countries. MS probably allocates a higher percentage than Sony does to the US (probably something like 70% vs 60%). Sony has a much higher demand in countries outside of the UK and US so they need to allocate more units than MS to 'other' countries. Plus Sony is launching in Asia right away, and Japan in a few months.

~5% would be a good guess, but 5% of 2.1M is 105,000. That's not significant but worth mentioning.

 

[tcrews]

Major Nelson says the Xbox One sold 2 Million consoles in 18 days.

Xbox One sells 2 Million Units in 18 Days

Some solid numbers coming out of the global Xbox One launch last month:

2 Million Consoles sold through in 13-markets in the first 18-days
Over 83 million hours in games, TV, and apps on Xbox One since the system launched
39 million Xbox One achievements unlocked
595 million total Gamerscore achieved on Xbox One
At peak demand, customers were ordering the Xbox One console at over 1000 units per minute on Amazon.com

http://majornelson.com/2013/12/11/xbox-one-sells-2-million-units-in-18-days/

 

[Rangers]

For reference it apparently took Sony 16 days to announce 2.1m (which included the gap to EU PS4 launch).

Something like 14 days of USA sales and a day or two of Europe sales (basically launch) for PS4's number.


Not too shabby at all given the 499 handicap imo. Solid start for next gen hardware.

It also might give MS a shot at November NPD crown unless I miss my guess, since MS sales should be so heavily USA weighted. Just depends how many sales occurred before December I guess.

I'd say for the most part this disproves the "yield problems" meme that was omnipresent pre-launch as well.

Basically everybody doing well but Wii U.

This is a really good number for Xbox and basically , means it's maybe not too far from a tie ballgame in worldwide sales with PS4, contrary to what I'd feel is a perception that XBO was on the ropes or being dominated. And all that with the caveat of costing $100 more. However, I wonder how well XBO will hold up in comparison once Sony is able to begin to fully meet PS4 demand, that will be a big hurdle.

But kudos to MS for getting a lot of hardware out there regardless if demand seems softer vs PS4 or not, that really doesn't matter right now in a way, they have perhaps held serve as an analogy. I just wonder how much marketing spending it takes to prop up the (evidently) weaker console. From what I see MS has been spending a lot more on marketing from the get go.

I also find it a OT commentary on inflation that in 2006 599 was a utterly ridiculous, disastrous price point, and in 2013 499 is a viable mainstream console price point, if on the high end.

 

[RobertR1]

Sony should take NPD nov with one week head start. Ms should take dec with continous supply.

 

[Shortbread]

Sony sold 80,000 in Spain with 12,000 - 15,000 pre-orders still needed to be filled. Selling at a 3.5:1 ratio according to Sony.

http://www.meristation.com/playstation-3/noticias/ps4-vende-80-000-consolas-en-espana/61/1942209
http://www.europapress.es/portaltic...-mas-triple-xbox-one-sony-20131210131202.html


The PS4 costs an arm and a leg in Brazil due to taxes. No wonder they didn't sell any. Most people are probably importing.

Sony and MS's allocation between countries will be different, so when we're discussing sales in the US, it does matter that the PS4 is sold in more countries. MS probably allocates a higher percentage than Sony does to the US (probably something like 70% vs 60%). Sony has a much higher demand in countries outside of the UK and US so they need to allocate more units than MS to 'other' countries. Plus Sony is launching in Asia right away, and Japan in a few months.

~5% would be a good guess, but 5% of 2.1M is 105,000. That's not significant but worth mentioning.

World wide sales are going to really widen once PS4 goes on sale in Japan... as for the EU sales, seems Sony is pushing more units and outselling XB1 for being a week late to the party. The US will be MS bread and butter on having strong sales. By midway next year, Sony could/should hold a 3:1 (possibly 4:1) World wide sales advantage.

 

[Rangers]

World wide sales are going to really widen once PS4 goes on sale in Japan... as for the EU sales, seems Sony is pushing more units and outselling XB1 for being a week late to the party. The US will be MS bread and butter on having strong sales. By midway next year, Sony could/should hold a 3:1 (possibly 4:1) World wide sales advantage.

That seems massively generous especially as sales will slow drastically after the first of the year.

In January or shortly after you will see Xbox One (especially) and PS4 sitting on shelves collecting dust, hard as it may be to imagine. It happened with PS3, 360, etc.

Even if PS4 outsells XBO 3-1 or something crazy in early 2014, the raw sell through numbers will be much less limiting a drastic shift in fortunes.

The power of Europe to swing numbers is also overrated. it's not 5X the USA or anything, more like 1:1 at best (less if you remove UK). Which is precisely why 360 has outsold PS3 this gen (or basically a tie if you want to argue) despite being weaker in Europe and nonexistent in Japan.

I would say at the least these preliminary numbers suggest status quo. It wont really be possible for either console to lose third party support due to both having large install bases (even if PS4 is perhaps having a clear initial edge, XBO will maintain a significant presence), thus neither is in any real danger.

Very similar to how 360 and PS3 turned out.

I'm happy next gen is off to a strong start for all, the Wii U was not some harbinger.

 

[zed]

Which is precisely why 360 has outsold PS3 this gen

It hasnt

I assume you talk about the 80 million statement from MS
according to MS investor financal relations statement (released after the above 80million statement) xbox360 was at 79.3 million
oct17 xbox360 shipments = 80 million
oct24 xbox360 shipments = 79.3million

So when did they release that 80 million statement?
It was released The same time as the ps3 outsold xbox 360 on NPD for the first time in years, thus it was used to deflect media attention, they just pulled the number from their asses

 

[AlphaWolf]

It hasnt

I assume you talk about the 80 million statement from MS
according to MS investor financal relations statement (released after the above 80million statement) xbox360 was at 79.3 million
oct17 xbox360 shipments = 80 million
oct24 xbox360 shipments = 79.3million

So when did they release that 80 million statement?
It was released The same time as the ps3 outsold xbox 360 on NPD for the first time in years, thus it was used to deflect media attention, they just pulled the number from their asses

You think they haven't sold another 700k since oct 24? Keep in mind there would be significant numbers of $75 black friday models moved.

 

[Rangers]

It hasnt

I assume you talk about the 80 million statement from MS
according to MS investor financal relations statement (released after the above 80million statement) xbox360 was at 79.3 million
oct17 xbox360 shipments = 80 million
oct24 xbox360 shipments = 79.3million

So when did they release that 80 million statement?
It was released The same time as the ps3 outsold xbox 360 on NPD for the first time in years, thus it was used to deflect media attention, they just pulled the number from their asses

The Oct 24 date is just when they release quarterly financials, or numbers through Sep 31.

The Oct 17 80 million number would be a up to date at the time figure. So yes, valid.

Sep 31=79.3m

Sometime after Sep 31 and announced on Oct 17, 80m.

Especially as October is a heavy shipment month in prep for Nov/Dec sales this is perfectly expected.

MS/Sony have internal access to up to date shipment numbers that they can make announcements around.

 

[Shortbread]

Sony PS3 being a full year late (pricey at that), and being able to match/succeed XB360 world wide sales - speaks a lot about the potential of PS4 success on surpassing PS3 installed base. Next year, we will see a major gap as Japan (even, China) will most likely swing in Sony favor. If MS doesn't keep the EU mindshare as seen with the XB360, then MS will solely need the US to be its "factor" on determining its next move within the console space.

 

[temesgen]

The 360 PS3 LTD numbers are extremely close at this point, not sure what a few hundred thousand units + or - wins either side other than a talking point. Remarkable comeback for Sony and impressive staying power for MS either way not sure what you guys are arguing about.... Perhaps Sony's recovery might mean a little more but the financial backdrop pours cold water on that pretty quickly. Both sides are tasked with identifying a way to generate profits in this business and instal base alone won't get either one where they need to be.

 

[Shortbread]

Nice take on things....

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/12/11/whos-really-ahead-ps4-or-xbox-one

If Sony turns out to have the upper hand in the US, too, Xbox's home turf, it will be a significant coup. One analyst, Colin Sebastian of Robert W. Baird & Co., expects that tomorrow's NPD November US sales data will show sales of 1.3-1.4 million versus 800-900,000 Xbox Ones.

The facts say that the PS4 is unquestionably ahead at this moment – the question is how far ahead. 2 million versus 2.1 million is barely a difference, but If the PS4 has continued to sell at roughly the same pace since last week’s announcement of 2.1 million, it could have sold another 750,000 by now, which would put it at 2.85 million. The waters are muddied by the console’s staggered launch; are US sales slowing down whilst UK and European sales are spiking thanks to the delayed release, or is the PS4 maintaining momentum in all territories in the run-up to Christmas?

There's also another important thing to remember here: neither console is out in Japan. That fact still seems so bizarre to me that I keep almost forgetting about it. When the PS4 launches there, it will add another huge figure to Sony's tally, and widen the gap between the two consoles ahead of the end of the financial year. As for the Xbox One... well, it's no secret that Japan is hardly Microsoft's strongest territory. Japan will make a difference

 

[eastmen]

Not much of a take on things , doesn't seem to be concerned that a lot of the extra momentum on the ps4 side can be due to the amount of territories its released in vs the xbox one.

 

[Shortbread]

Not much of a take on things , doesn't seem to be concerned that a lot of the extra momentum on the ps4 side can be due to the amount of territories its released in vs the xbox one.

Funny thing you said that... two weeks ago, PS4 warriors were claiming the same thing when XB1 reached it 1 million sales number in 24hrs. Now, it's the XB1 warriors claiming PS4 is only ahead because of more territories.

My thing is this, if you can supply them - why not? To me it shows "who has the better and stronger" distribution channels and greater production yields on meeting them. Next year numbers are going to be the funniest...