Xbox One (Durango) Technical hardware investigation

[liquidboy]

The hypervisor is... an OS?!?!

no, Im guessing it would be something like

1. System OS (parent Partition) - probably runs dashboard etc.
2. Application OS - all the apps, including the snappable ones
3. Game OS - the single game

all 1,2,3 sits ontop of a HyperVisor ...

something like

 

[ERP]

The hypervisor is... an OS?!?!

Sure it provides services to the other two, just because it doesn't have a shell of any description doesn't make it not an OS.

 

[Kaotik]

no, Im guessing it would be something like

1. System OS (parent Partition) - probably runs dashboard etc.
2. Application OS - all the apps, including the snappable ones
3. Game OS - the single game

all 1,2,3 sits ontop of a HyperVisor ...

something like

I'm quite sure MS said outright that it's "Windows OS", "Xbox (game) OS" and "Hypervisor OS" which controls the 2 and how they work together

 

[liquidboy]

I'm quite sure MS said outright that it's "Windows OS", "Xbox (game) OS" and "Hypervisor OS" which controls the 2 and how they work together

yeah looks like you're right

'three "virtual machines", two on top of a third' - ref : http://www.oxm.co.uk/59251/features...ide-ram-for-apps-is-good-for-devs-and-gamers/

 

[SlimJim]

I think it would add great value to the XBox One if you can plug in a keyboard and mouse and use it as an office computer. Hell, Office even runs on ARM (surface RT), so a 8 core x86 should run it pretty good as well.

I think this might happen at one point, due to the 3 OSes that Xbox one runs simultaneously

 

[Arwin]

Well, I thought so too, but if it is true that the Xbox One has a fixed core allocation per OS as seemed to be suggested by Browser tests, then that isn't going to work so great. But perhaps they can do some dynamic reallocation of cores between the OSs.

 

[SlimJim]

Well, I thought so too, but if it is true that the Xbox One has a fixed core allocation per OS as seemed to be suggested by Browser tests, then that isn't going to work so great. But perhaps they can do some dynamic reallocation of cores between the OSs.

Maybe if it 'runs as a game'?

(They could market it as the ultimate student console.)

 

[loekf]

Well, I thought so too, but if it is true that the Xbox One has a fixed core allocation per OS as seemed to be suggested by Browser tests, then that isn't going to work so great. But perhaps they can do some dynamic reallocation of cores between the OSs.

IMHO they should have to ensure game devs know what they are coding for.

"The other camp" has one Jaguar core for the OS fixed, the other 7 are for games/apps.

 

[Globalisateur]

IMHO they should have to ensure game devs know what they are coding for.

"The other camp" has one Jaguar core for the OS fixed, the other 7 are for games/apps.

Since when? do you have a source?

I thought it was 6 for the game.

 

[eVolvE]

Just FYI: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-the-making-of-killzone-shadow-fall

There's even a video in that article that shows the profiling tools of Killzone Shadow Fall. It explicitly mentions and shows 6 CPU threads that are in use by the game. If they were allowed to use 7 I guess they'd use them.

 

[liquidboy]

On top of that, the two Jaguar modules include 2 MB of L2 each (4MB total). What sense could it make to add an additional 2.5MB L3 cache shared between the two modules? That's probably something else, not an L3. Would it make sense to have a faster storage for page tables? Appears to be a bit excessive compared to small TLB caches to me, but who knows?

Seems like in the latest HSA overview talk given recently, they talk about "cache coherency domains" being solved in numerous ways, one of which is via "COMBINED L3"

presentation slides here : http://www.slideshare.net/insideHPC/hsa-28761300

 

[BeyondTed]

Seems like in the latest HSA overview talk given recently, they talk about "cache coherency domains" being solved in numerous ways, one of which is via "COMBINED L3"

presentation slides here : http://www.slideshare.net/insideHPC/hsa-28761300

That is very interesting.

The extra SRAM block and the large amount of attached logic is in a reasonable place (in the die layout) to be a combined L3.

Not saying that is the case, but it seems reasonably possible.

I wonder if the large block of logic to the right contains the 15 specialty (co)processors (also)?

 

[dobwal]

http://www.google.com/patents/US201...a=X&ei=xm2dUub1EqeL2AW40oHoDw&ved=0CDYQ6AEwAA

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4455/amds-graphics-core-next-preview-amd-architects-for-compute/6

This is an old anandtech preview of GCN, which shows an AMD diagram of the iommu being part of the CPU/north bridge complex.

 

[loekf]

This is an old anandtech preview of GCN, which shows an AMD diagram of the iommu being part of the CPU/north bridge complex.

isn't this patent more on having GPU and CPU simultaneous access to memory ? So ... HSA-like ?

 

[fehu]

onsidering that all runs on a virtual machine, and that there's x86 instructions compatibility, can the one enable at least original xbox compatibility?

 

[bkilian]

onsidering that all runs on a virtual machine, and that there's x86 instructions compatibility, can the one enable at least original xbox compatibility?

Theoretically, but don't hold your breath. They would still have to build another virtualization system for the GPU, and the development and test cost would be substantial.

 

[Michellstar]

Theoretically, but don't hold your breath. They would still have to build another virtualization system for the GPU, and the development and test cost would be substantial.

Add to that Mr Huang??

 

[dagamer]

Theoretically, but don't hold your breath. They would still have to build another virtualization system for the GPU, and the development and test cost would be substantial.

What's the benefit when developers can just crank out Xbox One specific versions for more money? See Tomb Raider: Definitive Edition for the first of many next-gen re-releases.

 

[ProjectNatalFan]

Now it is known right now the xbox one has a 10 percent gpu reservation, something where Microsoft themselves "Goosen" said that this will be available at a later date to devs. So if that is true, and I asked here and from what I gathered by some very intelligent guys that it is in fact possible. How that will be done is a mystery. What prompted this question what that recently Titanfall dev said they will not be using Kinect at all. This was peculiar to me because this is the perfect game for this. You could call your titanfall, etc, and other uses I could see being used, but then, I said maybe they are doing this because they know it is very important to hit 1080p 60fps on xbox one. so im thinking they might be the first devs to use this. How will this gpu reservation done..

 

[Brad Grenz]

Goosen didn't say the 10% will be available to devs later, he said it's possible that reservation may eventually be reduced to some degree.