UC4: Best looking gameplay? *SPOILS*

[rockaman]

I just posted the screens showing how his chest hair details are actually visible from gameplay distance.

And I've already demonstrated how the 1080p resolution is the only thing holding it back from showing that detail from a distance with the zoomed image.

As for the ROTR/QB comparisons.... I'm not even going to enter that conversation, no thanks.

How about you just post shots of what the game looks like when you play it rather than when you pause it and zoom in on something to load an LOD that wouldn't be visible while you're playing it?

We just did, this is proof you are claiming incorrectly. Zoomed in on an image from regular gameplay distance.

The only thing holding it back from showing this detail clearly is the rendering resolution which is too weak to display "Nathan Drake's" chest hair.

As I've said before, my own chest hair, or another CG character's chest hair, is a completely different matter. Drake's detail is very micro, and thus a low output resolution becomes a more limiting factor faster.

And lastly I don't know why you're sounding upset in this exploration of Uncharted 4 graphics. These comparisons to other games are notwithstanding upon the comment of whether or not Drake's chest hair is being rendered or not in gameplay. Leave me out of the pointless comparisons.

 

[ultragpu]

Anyway guys, for me the top moment graphically, the U2 Nepal village equivalent (apart from the whole chapter 13), is the very first moment in which the Epilogue starts. I thought it was a photo until I took the control... Do you have a pic of this?.

Yeah that did get me for a second too
http://cubeupload.com/im/CxvOAw.png

 

[Love_In_Rio]

Yeah that did get me for a second too
http://cubeupload.com/im/CxvOAw.png

That is!. Thank you!. One moment previously to the shown by the picture (a little more zoomed out and the girl looking ahead), it all looked almost real!.

 

[rockaman]

The dog is incredible in this scene

I took a couple of his gaping mouth, outstanding animation quality.

Specifically the mouth and facial animations of the dog here, they are particularly amazing!

 

[Clukos]

Here it is, all outdoor lighting (sun main light source, almost the same distance [due to different fov in each game])

Rise of the Tomb Raider (PC maxed out)

Lit directly

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/riseofthetombraider0549lsw.png

Partly under shadow

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/riseofthetombraider05z1l34.png

Under shadow

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/riseofthetombraider05wxy22.png

Closeup during gameplay (as much as i could in this scene)

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/riseofthetombraider05gvl9b.png

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Quantum Break (PC maxed out - no reconstruction)

Lit directly

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/quantumbreak5_24_2016usxf6.png

Partly under shadow

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/quantumbreak5_24_201663lxb.png

Under shadow

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/quantumbreak5_24_20163bapz.png

Closeup during gameplay (as much as i could in this scene)

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/quantumbreak5_24_20164uzha.png

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Uncharted 4

Lit directly

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/uncharted4_athiefsendq3a7b.png

Partly under shadow

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/uncharted4_athiefsend7ebzh.png

Under shadow

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/uncharted4_athiefsendm7aa0.png

Closeup during gameplay (as much as i could in this scene)

Original PNG here: https://abload.de/img/uncharted4_athiefsendh7yu0.png

I don't get what a simple picture of Lara's ass proves (it's great i know but when comparing things it doesn't make much sense to post different screenshots in different scenarios, you have to make it as even as possible).

 

[pjbliverpool]

And I've already demonstrated how the 1080p resolution is the only thing holding it back from showing that detail from a distance with the zoomed image.

No you haven't. Even Clukos admits that the game probably isn't loading the higher detail LOD's at greater distances. In fact it would be completely nonsensical if it were.

As for the ROTR/QB comparisons.... I'm not even going to enter that conversation, no thanks.

The comparison was purely of character models at a normal distance instead of a "I'm standing an inch away from a wall with the camera perfectly positioned to rush up to my face" distance. Nothing more.

We just did, this is proof you are claiming incorrectly. Zoomed in on an image from regular gameplay distance.

So you're seriously telling me that that ^ is, aside from resolution, identical to this:

And lastly I don't know why you're sounding upset in this exploration of Uncharted 4 graphics. These comparisons to other games are notwithstanding upon the comment of whether or not Drake's chest hair is being rendered or not in gameplay. Leave me out of the pointless comparisons.

My comments were never specifically about chest hair, I don't know why you're fixating on that. They were about how ultra close up shots of characters and materials in photomode are not directly comparable to other games that don't offer the same ultra close up option outside of rare corner cases during gameplay, where they would arguably be a waste of developmental resources. The same doesn't apply to UC4, because it has a photomode.

And I'm not 'upset' about your exploration of Uncharted 4 graphics, I've said multiple times that it looks amazing and in many ways better than all other games. I've also stated I'm not in any way trying to put it's graphics down. I just prefer a more even handed approach to comparisons that what seems to be taking place here. There's really no need to get so defensive over the games graphics, I agree it looks incredible.

 

[pjbliverpool]

Here it is, all outdoor lighting (sun main light source, almost the same distance [due to different fov in each game])

I don't get what a simple picture of Lara's ass proves (it's great i know but when comparing things it doesn't make much sense to post different screenshots in different scenarios, you have to make it as even as possible).

Fair enough, and that's a good even handed comparison you've posted there. However I believe it demonstrates my point well. Aside from the close up shot where the UC4 model looks clearly better (but is shot you wouldn't encounter very much in actual gameplay) the character models look entirely coparable between all 3 games. I'm not seeing anything particularly stand outish about the UC4 model there. The more you zoom in though, the better it gets in comaparison.

 

[ultragpu]

Yeah not only everything was so well rendered, it was the animation of the dog that really jumped out as omg is that a real dog?

Don't bother, there are plenty available on line. For instance:

I'm not seeing how the gameplay distance character models I screenshotted above are particularly better than this. When zoomed in it is a different story of course.

Well you know Fifa 2010's player model when zoomed out at playing distance looked almost exactly the same as Fifa 2016, but it's a whole different story when you zoomed in. The point is just because you can't see it doesn't mean it's not there, thus it's inaccurate to say UC4's model is the same as QB's or TR's model despite viewing at similar distance.

 

[ultragpu]

To illustrate it more for you pjbliverpool. Can your eyes resolve as much details in one particular human in this

the same way as this

? Real life LODgate?

 

[rockaman]

No you haven't. Even Clukos admits that the game probably isn't loading the higher detail LOD's at greater distances. In fact it would be completely nonsensical if it were. So you're seriously telling me that that ^ is, aside from resolution, identical to this:

It is the same hair model being rendered. Yes, that is exactly what I am saying. You can even see the individual hair strands from this far away from the character. That's why I blew up the image so it is proof that the exact same hair is being used in-game.

1080p isn't even *close* to the rendering resolution needed to show these details *limited specifically by resolution*. This is coming from someone who just played through DOOM 3 and Tomb Raider Underworld at 4K, so I can tell you for 100% that resolution will limit some of the details you will see, especially so small at 1080p, especially at that distance. There is no way to resolve anything better from a 1080p image with a detail that small (literally a detail taking up so little space of the character, and even less of the screen real estate, to the point you can count easily the number of pixels across in this image his hair is being rendered on). It's like a 20 to 40 pixels across detail we're talking about. That's not good enough resolution, that does not mean the detail is *not there*. That's absurd.

It is simply the distance. The image I shared is about 5 to 10 times the distance from the camera of the same image, and with even larger FOV than Clukos' image *and with no increased resolution* to compensate for that fact. Every image in this thread is 1080p maximum of course (unless we start tiling screenshots, but no one has done that yet...). And yes, this image *does* show the hair is still rendered.

The limiting factor because of the 5 to 10x distance from camera is the 1080p resolution. We're talking about a detail that is about 2% the surface area of the character model. Do you see how much difference there is in zoom level between these two images? It is a factor of 5 to 10x at least.

Rendering resolution is absolutely the limiting factor when going so far away from the character when we are literally talking about an element that makes up less than 2% of the body surface area of the character.

Do I have to take like 5 more pictures to prove this? I really don't see the point when this image clearly proves his chest hair is being rendered in gameplay exactly the same, even at gameplay distances.

 

[AlNom]

Mipmaps?

 

[Scott_Arm]

zoomed-in chest-hair comparison thread

 

[rockaman]

Let's put ChestGate to rest, these are the last images I will post on this particular subject.....

If you really, really, really need me too, I will even zoom on these images as well and show that the hair details are still there. Even when you rotate the camera around Drake they are easily visible as long as you push the camera up close to Drake, only limited in further camera distances from being visible by rendering resolution, not LOD at far gameplay distances.

 

[Karamazov]

we now need realistic genital physics under the clothes, especially with tight suits.

Do CGI artists for movies modelise genitals by the way ?

 

[Scott_Arm]

we now need realistic genital physics under the clothes, especially with tight suits.

Do CGI artists for movies modelise genitals by the way ?

Does Drake hang left or hang right, or do his undies keep him locked up? These are the important questions.

 

[Recop]

From close up, UC4's character models look better than any other game, this is true. But from a normal gameplay distance, I honestly don't think they look any better than Tombraider or Quantum Break. But since neither of those games feature a photomode that allows extreme zooming, it's less of an issue for them.

But there are many games with a photomode and character models still don't look as good as in Uncharted...

Also, why do you ingore the video posted by Clukos ?

It proves that you will have the same level of detail if you're able to make a close up during gameplay.

I'm not seeing how the gameplay distance character models I screenshotted above are particularly better than this. When zoomed in it is a different story of course.

All objetcs tend to look the same from a large distance... if you want to compare them, you have precisely to make some close ups...

 

[Karamazov]

 

[Recop]

All objetcs tend to look the same from a large distance... if you want to compare them, you have precisely to make some close ups...

Is this proves something ?

 

[rockaman]

Fair enough, and that's a good even handed comparison you've posted there. However I believe it demonstrates my point well. Aside from the close up shot where the UC4 model looks clearly better (but is shot you wouldn't encounter very much in actual gameplay) the character models look entirely coparable between all 3 games. I'm not seeing anything particularly stand outish about the UC4 model there. The more you zoom in though, the better it gets in comaparison.

Looking comparable does not mean equal. Everything is relatively comparable in any generation. Even Half-Life 2 or Crysis is comparable to Uncharted 4.

Even Uncharted Collection is arguably technically better than Uncharted 4 being that it runs at 1080p60 and in many ways has sharper textures than even Uncharted 4 too. Arguably UC Collection is even more impressive than ROTR or Quantum Break or Uncharted 4. I've got another few hundred images of that we can use to compare to U4 as well.

"Comparable" is one thing. But comparable does not preclude one or the other being more detailed or having more impressive graphics in one way or another. And telling Clukos to "don't bother" gathering screenshots to make a more objective comparison is rather defensive, even while seemingly cherry-picking shots of TR and QB (one with an incredible amount of motion blur that hides all the details in the image too, how does that help us compare the visual quality? even on top of that both images were showing the backs of the characters, and we know that the "back" of the character is the flattest and easiest to shade, and the one we see for the greater proportion of these games), and yet you're dictating terms on what images are acceptable enough for Uncharted 4? That is a double standard, no less.

Even worse, Clukos' comparison does much more justice to the technical merits of all 3 games much more accurately than the screens you posted, despite saying he should not bother with such a comparison (good comparison btw Clukos).

I would love to micro-analyze Uncharted 4 probably as much as anyone else in this thread, which is why I even came back to this forum when this game released, I made my own assumption that *everyone* would be participating sensibly in taking a look at a fantastic looking game, and would be willing to look at comparisons between other games, but not in a way that assumes parity or restricts the discussion about how resolution can impair visible detail (if it didn't, would we be even trying to upgrade to 4K resolutions? obviously not), or in what way one game is allowed to take screenshots, or trying to deny details existence in certain games, because these games, even if comparable, are not the same, and there is no reason to approach any comparison while starting with such an assumption, or any assumption for that matter.

we now need realistic genital physics under the clothes, especially with tight suits.

Do CGI artists for movies modelise genitals by the way ?

Have you played Dead or Alive Extreme 3?

I mean maybe not "realistic", I could hardly call anything in that game about body proportions realistic... at least not all of it... lol....

But simulation of those things... there definitely is. Maybe not specifically genitals... but the rest, breast-physics, buttocks physics, bikini and other outfits straps and decorations, etc. They even react to wind, not joking...

And no, I don't own the game... haha. Oddly enough the cloth physics aren't actually that good in that game. Neither the hair physics. They are acceptable, but not that great, lots of clipping, especially with the long hair characters.

 

[Laa-Yosh]

I personally think that Jack Joyce from QB looks reasonably better at medium to high distances than even Drake. Has to do a lot with the lighting and shading and of course the extensive use of scanning.
However, Drake's hair (on his head, mind you) is still better.

Tomb Raider, not so good IMHO. Non-realistic model, but not stylized enough, shading and lighting aren't impressive either.