The GT5 expectation thread (including preview titles)*

[Arwin]

here is another one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lrkgZMW1h8&f18

sometimes when in the spray, the wiper look like they are made of 10 pixels?!?!?

I don't know if anyone remembers that a while back someone pointed towards aliasing issues around transparancy effects like smoke? This issue is still in the game, even in some of the photo-mode shots. So that's what you're seeing probably. If you look out for it, you'll probably see some more elsewhere. It seems to stand out much more in this night race though.

 

[N_B]

here is another one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lrkgZMW1h8&f18

sometimes when in the spray, the wiper look like they are made of 10 pixels?!?!?

There's a fair bit of screen tearing there too, but it may be a replay vid.

 

[Neb]

I get why they 1/4 (or even 1/16 as it seems??) the resolution of the particles, but surely there must be a better way. The jaggy wiper really sticks out. Like blur the edge more or something at least.

Perfomance reasons and IMO it looks horrible and rain drops dont look to good either. They should add with a patch option to toggle it on/off and at the same time that will give perfomance improvement. Track and visuals looks good but that sure stands out really bad.

 

[Billy Idol]

so, this seems to be one of the brutal trade offs...necessary to mantain the other standards

 

[Shifty Geezer]

here is another one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lrkgZMW1h8&f18

sometimes when in the spray, the wiper look like they are made of 10 pixels?!?!?

Gosh, that's awful! Looks like LBP1's volumetric shadows. 1/16th res (actually made it 1/25 measured from a grab at 26 seconds, but with upscaling blur I'd say that was measured wrong). They should have found a solution such as drawing the wipers in a different pass. 2D wipers drawn as vector overlays would be less disconcerting than these shattered, blocky blobs. I guess PD miss the bandwidth of PS2!

 

[Arwin]

Gosh, that's awful! Looks like LBP1's volumetric shadows. 1/16th res (actually made it 1/25 measured from a grab at 26 seconds, but with upscaling blur I'd say that was measured wrong). They should have found a solution such as drawing the wipers in a different pass. 2D wipers drawn as vector overlays would be less disconcerting than these shattered, blocky blobs. I guess PD miss the bandwidth of PS2!

Yep, this seems to be the biggest trade-off / issue of this engine right now - all the smoke effects cause vicious low res aliasing on anything drawn in front of it. You can find this everywhere in the game, even in Photo-Mode I think. It must be a trade-off for the enormous increase in smoke and rain effects that they've managed to get into this engine (which is a lot more than previous versions and also many other games that run at 60fps)

Impressive photo by the way:

I'm thinking this is what PS4 GT will probably look like.

 

[dragonelite]

Dam those cars look like real life.

Uuh did sony actually kick started gt 5 marketing already just saw like 3 hours tv and not a single gt 5 commercial. Saw like 15 black ops ones either for a contest or sponsering ncis, ncis Miami and numbers.

 

[Arwin]

Dam those cars look like real life.

Uuh did sony actually kick started gt 5 marketing already just saw like 3 hours tv and not a single gt 5 commercial. Saw like 15 black ops ones either for a contest or sponsering ncis, ncis Miami and numbers.

I don't think even Sony Netherlands banked on GT5 really coming out this week. By the way, I downloaded one of those taxigamer direct feed videos (took ages, everyone seems to want them) and it makes a lot of difference. Very, very smooth and clean image, framerate and stuff like the edge of the road and power-lines and such look great. Shadows are still very blocky at times though, both in cockpit and in replays at high camera distances.

 

[Bagel seed]

Perfomance reasons and IMO it looks horrible and rain drops dont look to good either. They should add with a patch option to toggle it on/off and at the same time that will give perfomance improvement. Track and visuals looks good but that sure stands out really bad.

I wonder if some of the tricks mentioned in this blog post might have helped: http://realtimecollisiondetection.net/blog/?p=91

As per low-res artifacts, if I remember right, there is an article in GPU Gems 3 (which NVidia is in progress of placing online now) which describes a method to remove edge artifacts on low-res particle rendering. Effectively you do a stencil pass to check for edges, then re-render particles at full resolution in those areas with stencil test on.

 

[the ignoramus]

There's a fair bit of screen tearing there too, but it may be a replay vid.

there's a fair bit of screen tearing in the 60 fps video of SSR7. Still impresses the hell out of me. (although the hideous pixellation of cars and objects whenever they interact with downrezzed particles can really compromise the replays.

 

[Clerigo]

I'm thinking this is what PS4 GT will probably look like.

But that realy is GT in the PS3


Ferrari 458 Italia @ Top Gear Test Track

 

[Lucid_Dreamer]

Yep, this seems to be the biggest trade-off / issue of this engine right now - all the smoke effects cause vicious low res aliasing on anything drawn in front of it. You can find this everywhere in the game, even in Photo-Mode I think. It must be a trade-off for the enormous increase in smoke and rain effects that they've managed to get into this engine (which is a lot more than previous versions and also many other games that run at 60fps)

Impressive photo by the way

I'm thinking this is what PS4 GT will probably look like.

I would agree, but it seems like some people rather step back down to the other console racers. Would they rather have no AA @720p instead of 4xMSAA + temporal AA (or 1280x1080 with 2xMSAA + temporal AA), no nice weather effects, no dynamic shadows, no day/night cycles, less cars on track, less polys per car, no deformation, less physics, no headtracking, no track editor, less realistic setups, etc like it's direct competitor? It just seems so abnormal.

 

[joker454]

here is another one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lrkgZMW1h8&f18

sometimes when in the spray, the wiper look like they are made of 10 pixels?!?!?

They are more than likely rendered to a 1/16th size buffer, or possibly even a 1/32rd buffer for 1080p mode. I'd be curious if water particles are less pixelated when running in 720p mode. Anyone care to test? Basically i'm wondering if they say go with 1/32nd for 1080 gameplay, 1/16th for 720 gameplay, 1/4 for 30fps replay mode, and 1/1 for photos.

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4126/5193086227_bbfca62881_o.jpg

Oooh, some cool American cars in that pic! I mostly wrote this game off figuring it would focus on Japanese cars, maybe I need to check that vehicle list again.

 

[tha_con]

Oooh, some cool American cars in that pic! I mostly wrote this game off figuring it would focus on Japanese cars, maybe I need to check that vehicle list again.

Cars are cars. If you're interested in them, you're interested in them It makes no difference what silly country they come from

In references to the weather effects, I honestly don't care for them at this point. A lot of things don't bother me, like small artifacts, some frame drops, even tearing. That said...everything going on during that replay with the effects is just too jarring, even for me (which is saying a lot).

 

[djskribbles]

Not necessarily... there are different levels of car fans and some people just have different preferences. True hardcore car fans will like anything. I personally prefer Japanese manufacturers.

 

[patsu]

Just saw the pixelated wiper + rain effect. Ugly indeed ! Skimmed through the official forum and GTPlanet forum to see what others say. It looks like people haven't focused on it yet (Still lamenting about standard vs premium cars, damage model, camera view).

Wonder if PD will do something to tone down the effect after launch. Kaz was concerned with dropped frame + rain effect for the delay. This must be one of the items on their hit list. It's too obvious to miss.

Also curious how many cars the game supports for a rainy track.

EDIT: I drove in a near-zero visibility rain storm before. You don't see the spray from other vehicles that clearly. The entire windscreen is like a water fall. Or rather it's like buckets of water poured over your windscreen. No matter how hard the wipers work, it looked like the car was under water. ^_^

So if they want to, they can tone down the spray, but work on the water effects on the screen.

 

[2real4tv]

But that realy is GT in the PS3

images

Wow I guess we know where they spent their time...next gen can't come fast enough.
OT, but will development times increase for next generation of consoles? The biggest thing this gen seems to be cost and development times. Hopefully the engines that were developed this gen will be scalable to next.

 

[patsu]

What can you do (in-game) with these telemetry data ?
http://www.gtplanet.net/gran-turismo-5s-telemetry-data-graphs/

 

[joker454]

Cars are cars. If you're interested in them, you're interested in them It makes no difference what silly country they come from

Well I'm not personally a fan of the styling on Japanese cars. For example the Subaru Impreza, whenever I win that car in any car game I immediately sell it, just no interest in them. Likewise I'm also not a fan of small displacement motors that rev high like the Honda S2000, etc, just not my cup of tea. There's always exceptions that I like such as the Lexus IS, or the older Datsun 510, but generally I much prefer American and European cars.

 

[Billy Idol]

hm, but couldn't they use at least the tech in KZ2, where they used QAA for the low res buffer to smooth out the brutal edges? Or would it make sense to even use MLAA for the low res buffer to get better wiper? Or a combination of both (I guess QAA blur would not hurt with those rain effects, but rather help to smooth/blur the overall image!)

If it is only a 1/32 or 1/16 res buffer - it much be cheap as hell to AA it, right?!?!?

man, I was so looking forward to play the night+rain stuff (this is actually something I hate in real life driving) - but at the moment, the cockpit view is a little bit disgusting - probably the low res effects are not so pronounced in first person view, as this view misses at least the wiper!

and as for cars: one of the greatest cars in the world is the FORD GT 40 which seems to be a US car...but I also love those EVO's and especially the Skyline