Some PS3 developers still unaware of removal of rumble feature.

[Tap In]

BTW, has MS paid off Immersion yet?

-aldo

my understanding was that MS paid off and also bought part of the rights to the tech so that may be one reason sony does not want to incorporate it.

I didn't read it in the news (although I'm sure it's out there) I read about it on GAF from some supposedly reliable industry sources so take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Tap In]

Well if we think about the fact that the entire BC selection of PS2 games will no longer have rumble support, it sounds like a dumb idea, not to include it.

Playing off like the rumble feature in games is now suddenly unnecessary is just a convenient rationalization, IMO.

 

[RobertR1]

Well if we think about the fact that the entire BC selection of PS2 games will no longer have rumble support, it sounds like a dumb idea, not to include it.

Playing off like the rumble feature in games is now suddenly unnecessary is just a convenient rationalization, IMO.

Agreed. They're trying to play it off and as usual plenty of people will buy it. They could have had rumble +tilt. Tilt only came because rumble wasn't going to.

I'm sure some people will even discredit the developer for making these comments, sad as that may be.

 

[wco81]

If the retail PS3 controller doesn't support it, then it's likely that the controller libraries would not support it.. Which means it doesn't matter whether 3rd parties add it, as without OS/library support for rumble it would be a waste of money..

Dean

Didn't Logitech or some other third-party peripheral manufacturer distribute some kind of SDK for some peripheral?

I want to say the headset but VOIP was probably supported by the PS2 libraries?

But was that support always from the start or did their-parties start the voice-chat support without official Sony support?

 

[DeanA]

Didn't Logitech or some other third-party peripheral manufacturer distribute some kind of SDK for some peripheral?

Yeah.. I think you're right. It may have been for a headset of some kind.. but in my experience it's very rare for a developer to add support for hardware not directly supported by the platform. It can be a pain in the butt having to get drivers from the 3rd party hardware manufacturer in a timely fashion (as they often have to be updated as the platform SDK changes).

Besides, it's not as if devs don't have enough to do to get titles out without this kind of stuff..

Dean

 

[Almasy]

Well if we think about the fact that the entire BC selection of PS2 games will no longer have rumble support, it sounds like a dumb idea, not to include it.

Playing off like the rumble feature in games is now suddenly unnecessary is just a convenient rationalization, IMO.

It´s really unfortunate, true, rumble, while lately its importance has been exagerated, is still a very nice way of adding a layer of immersion to the game. Also, when used properly it can add to the gameplay as well.

However, I feel that if a compromise HAS to be done, adding motion detection functionality is far more worthwhile than rumble. It can actually affect gameplay in a more direct manner, such as camera movement, which could improve FPS tremendously. Heck, I´m considering giving them a chance with the new funcionality, whereas in the past I hated aiming in almost every one of them, yes, even kb/mouse.

Still, BC may suffer and feel somewhat crippled in some games due to the lack of rumble, so hopefully enough people complain so Sony adds it before PS3 launches.

 

[RobertR1]

What are the chance of Sony leaving rumble support in the console, allowing 3rd parties to develop and rumble based controller and let them pay the royalties?

 

[Tap In]

It´s really unfortunate, true, rumble, while lately its importance has been exagerated, is still a very nice way of adding a layer of immersion to the game. Also, when used properly it can add to the gameplay as well.

However, I feel that if a compromise HAS to be done, adding motion detection functionality is far more worthwhile than rumble. It can actually affect gameplay in a more direct manner, such as camera movement, which could improve FPS tremendously. Heck, I´m considering giving them a chance with the new funcionality, whereas in the past I hated aiming in almost every one of them, yes, even kb/mouse.

Still, BC may suffer and feel somewhat crippled in some games due to the lack of rumble, so hopefully enough people complain so Sony adds it before PS3 launches.

yes IF they can really expose a lot of in-game (practical) uses for the new tilt feature, than it could offset the loss of rumble.

Sony thinks they can or they wouldn't be banking on it.

I still think they should have done whatever was necessary to accomplish both and add to the experience rather than just change it.

 

[Graham]

Honestly I like rumble. When done with subtlty it can be very powerful.
Last night when playing crimson skies, it wasn't until I actually paused and thought about it, that I realised just how much better the game was for it. It's one of those things that adds to the whole without being obvious.

What I wonder is if sony will provide 3rd parties with the motion sensing chippery. Otherwise 3rd party controllers will dry up pretty fast. Even more-so for nintendo.

 

[AzBat]

Lock picking on Splinter Cell, PS3 will need another method for Double Agent.

Tommy McClain

 

[aldo]

supposedly the designer that sony owes the money to for the rumble feature (name escapes me) also said that they would be more than happy to make rumble work for them with the tilt feature if they would pay up.

Nintendo is using rumble in their remote.

Spot on, Tap In.

Mercury News - I subsequently conducted a phone interview with Immersion CEO and president Vic Viegas. There are a number of angles I need to do further reporting on, but Viegas made one assertion that clearly intersects with the E3 news and might prompt some interesting reaction for any number of gaming gearheads:

Viegas said that if Sony wants to discuss the problem, he's sure his company could eliminate any technical conflict between having both the motion sensitivity and the vibration effect in a PS3 controller and that Immersion also is ready to provide a "next-generation" level of force feedback for the console.

If true, this is ridiculous. Sony should just pay up like MS did and provide both features.

-aldo

 

[wco81]

I believe MS took an equity position in Immersion.

Maybe if as many suspect, Sony decided at last minute to go with the gyro instead of the rumble (or in addition to it), they tried to settle but couldn't reach a compromise.

I'm sure Immersion wanted more from Sony than MS.

 

[RobertR1]

Spot on, Tap In.

If true, this is ridiculous. Sony should just pay up like MS did and provide both features.

-aldo

Sony is way too arrogant. This isn't gonna happen. Hopefully some 3rd party can use Immersion technology for a PS3 controller later down the road.

 

[ihamoitc2005]

Business

Sony is way too arrogant. This isn't gonna happen. Hopefully some 3rd party can use Immersion technology for a PS3 controller later down the road.

No company is arrogant my friend. They have number one priority of business and profit. This is true for all companies. So Microsoft and Sony are same because both have same goal of business only. Microsoft is not evil empire and sony is not arrogant.

I think Immersion technology maybe good maybe not good, we do not know. Many companies make promises for new amazing technology but problem for new technology is no one has made testing so maybe is good for lab test result but for real world is it practical for large volume manufacture? We cannot know.

 

[RobertR1]

No company is arrogant my friend. They have number one priority of business and profit. This is true for all companies. So Microsoft and Sony are same because both have same goal of business only. Microsoft is not evil empire and sony is not arrogant.

I think Immersion technology maybe good maybe not good, we do not know. Many companies make promises for new amazing technology but problem for new technology is no one has made testing so maybe is good for lab test result but for real world is it practical for large volume manufacture? We cannot know.

Immersion tech is what all the consoles have been using for "rumble" technology. I'd say that's pretty proven.

My examples of arrogance:

1. "i could release the PS3 tomorrow!" Kent Kutaragi before the RSX was even taped out and the Dev kits were the size of small fridges. Holiday of 2005, I believe.

2. "the PS3 is too cheap!" Same winner, just a few weeks ago.

I'm sure there's a ton more.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

They all do it RobertR1.

Ideally if Immersion do have a useful tech Sony should consider licensing it and keep everyone happy. Maybe they're just peeved at having lost the patent case and are snubbing Immersion?

 

[Sis]

Immersion tech is what all the consoles have been using for "rumble" technology. I'd say that's pretty proven.

My examples of arrogance:

1. "i could release the PS3 tomorrow!" Kent Kutaragi before the RSX was even taped out and the Dev kits were the size of small fridges. Holiday of 2005, I believe.

2. "the PS3 is too cheap!" Same winner, just a few weeks ago.

I'm sure there's a ton more.

Sure, but that's bravado in the PR sense. The company itself is not arrogant, otherwise they would have been petulant about the world wide launch and the 2 sku approach that they were dismissive of when Microsoft did it last year. The rumble decision is a business decision, probably brought about by some focus group that had gamers prioritize features they desire in a controller. Given the discussions we've had about this lately, it would not be surprising to see rumble always rank near the bottom. Of course, I would chaulk this up as a flaw with focus group-based decision making...

 

[Powderkeg]

No rumble would also suggest no Force Feedback.

That should upset about 12 million Gran Turismo fans. Racing games without any road feedback are not going to be a great deal of fun.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Dunno why you think that. I doubt Sony are that stupid to get rid of support for FF peripherals. Just means FF rumble hardware isn't in the de facto controller and likely won't be supported if it appeared in third party controllers. Speaking of which, will there be any? Are Sony doing themselves a peripheral favour and muscling out the 3rd party controller business?

 

[Powderkeg]

Dunno why you think that. I doubt Sony are that stupid to get rid of support for FF peripherals.

Why not? They were stupid enough to get rid of a standard controller feature that has been around for over a decade and announce a price that is very hard to justify to the majority of consumers.

Just means FF rumble hardware isn't in the de facto controller and likely won't be supported if it appeared in third party controllers.

It also would suggest that they wouldn't support rumble or force feedback through software either since they wouldn't make a dime from doing so.

Speaking of which, will there be any? Are Sony doing themselves a peripheral favour and muscling out the 3rd party controller business?

Clearly they've left 3rd parties out in the cold for this year anyways. I doubt a single one was expecting a lack of rumble and inclusion of a Wii inspired tilt function.