RSX Secrets

[Carl B]

@edepot: The Cell version in the PS3 is DD2, 235mm^2. If Tech-On quoted 228mm^2 in that article, it's simply because they made the same mistake you're making now.

 

[edepot]

Hmm... Perhaps Sony did use the DD2 but removed/substituted some IBM stuff inside the Cell so that it is smaller? 235mm^2 - 228mm^2 = 7mm^2

http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_EN/20061127/124495/

 

[edepot]

Ok, I can understand where the mixup is now. The site I listed is actually nikkei electronics (the origin of the figures, and doesn't seem like a report of someone else's measurements). Their measurements are correct, but I think the error is in the rounding. Using a millimeter caliper, they should have been able to measure to the decimal place, but instead they opted to only report the rounded down number. So thus, I think maybe it was something like 19.2mm x 12.2mm (~235mm), but they simply listed it as 19mmx12mm (~228), and use the latter figure in their report. Either that or, Sony did change the Cell. In any case, I've decided to go with the more established 235mm unless someone else has a better measurement.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Sony haven't changed the Cell. It's the same silicon IBM is chucking out, as Sony are buying them from IBM (or at least were). The rounding error is probably the issue here.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Ok, I can understand where the mixup is now. The site I listed is actually nikkei electronics (the origin of the figures, and doesn't seem like a report of someone else's measurements). Their measurements are correct, but I think the error is in the rounding. Using a millimeter caliper, they should have been able to measure to the decimal place, but instead they opted to only report the rounded down number. So thus, I think maybe it was something like 19.2mm x 12.2mm (~235mm), but they simply listed it as 19mmx12mm (~228), and use the latter figure in their report. Either that or, Sony did change the Cell. In any case, I've decided to go with the more established 235mm unless someone else has a better measurement.edepot: The Cell version in the PS3 is DD2, 235mm^2. If Tech-On quoted 228mm^2 in that article, it's simply because they made the same mistake you're making now.

Translated PC WATCH IMPRESS article

Whether it is DD2 or DD3.x , I think we can trust the numbers in that PC WATCH IMPRESS article.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The subject of DD3 came up before and I thought it was accepted PS3 Cell was. It was a revision that found it's way into PS3 dev kits, and IIRC was more about yield improvements than anything, where IIRC DD2 improved some aspects of performance. AFAIK though all the Cell's out there are at least DD3.

 

[Heinrich4]

Very very good information in this link (and topic) but i have some questions :

1 - If G71/Geforce 7900GT/GTX have 64KB cache per quad we have something like 10/15% increase performance overall over G70/Geforce 7800GTX at same clock etc,how much impact in performance RSX with 96KB(10% over G71?)?


2 - A fast vector normalize its same extra 7 flops in pixel shader pipe (Ex: pixel shader -> at best ...each has 27 flops/5 instructions = 16flops/4* vec4 + vec4 "free" + 7 flops normalize) with increase to more or present in vextex shader pipe?



3 - With 63 max vertz = 36KB post transform/light cache?


Since now thanx all for answers.

 

[babcat]

Anyone find out any new information about the RSX?

 

[PS3MAN]

I think 550/700MHz RSX/GDDR3 not 500/650MHz. If PS3 500/650MHz like you guest why not public some information before its final spec.

 

[StefanS]

I think 550/700MHz RSX/GDDR3 not 500/650MHz. If PS3 500/650MHz like you guest why not public some information before its final spec.

Just because it wasn't released publically, doesn't mean it didn't happen. The devs were told beforehand and Goto's PCWatch article confirmed it (in fact if I remember correctly, he refered to the private briefing Sony gave to some devs). So it's as confirmed as it can get apart from a public announcement.

 

[PS3MAN]

I see Goto's article about PS3 hardware more times friend. However he use the word "guestimate" all of his dialog charts. So the private information from PS3devs without
the real source or official release can't be trust. I think in US and many countries their are the law to protect us and all consumers. How dare Sony risk to challenge with those lawsuites.

There are around 10+ millions PS3 owner now. 10+ millions lawsuites for wrong specification
product will kick Sony to the tomb like hell.

So, I think RSX 550MHz and 700MHz GDDR3 til now.

 

[StefanS]

I see Goto's article about PS3 hardware more times friend. However he use the word "guestimate" all of his dialog charts. So the private information from PS3devs without
the real source or official release can't be trust. I think in US and many countries their are the law to protect us and all consumers. How dare Sony risk to challenge with those lawsuites.

It has been confirmed by multiple source throughout the dev community. I can't believe we're still arguing about that after almost 2 years. Carl's sources have confirmed, I've heard from people.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

There are around 10+ millions PS3 owner now. 10+ millions lawsuites for wrong specification product will kick Sony to the tomb like hell.

The hardware specs are not on the box, nor in the manual, nor were sold to owners. It's not like a GPU where you know the clock-speed you are buying - this is instead a product. There's also no risk of lawsuits. Many (every?) recent console has released with changes to the original public spec, including downclocks.

You can take it as read the clockspeeds are 500\650 MHz. If you don't want to believe that, fine, but that's the way it is, and it doesn't land Sony in any trouble.

 

[PS3MAN]

Thank for advise Geezer, However 500/650 MHz system in my mind is not PS3. It's may be
PS2.98 ,isn't it?

My PS3 is 550/700MHz this sound make value for my dollars.

 

[Neb]

How did you overclock your PS3 to 550/700MHz?

 

[PS3MAN]

It is 550/700MHz already for you,too. Even if you trust SCEI.

I'm own PS family since PS1 SCPH-1000 (Japanese Model) PS2 SCPH-10000 (Japanese Model) and PS3 CECHAXX Japanese Model.

A long milestone of Sony console for me was. I can trust it spec and quality of these consoles.
So, PS1 CPU R3000A Clock at 33.333MHz (Do you trust it?) PS2 Emotion Engine Clock 298.3697MHz (Do you trust it?) same as PS3 Cell BE clock 3.2GHz (Do you trust it?)

Same method from upper line. I believe that PS3 550/700MHz GPU ,too.

 

[Neb]

It is 550/700MHz already for you,too. Even if you trust SCEI.

I'm own PS family since PS1 SCPH-1000 (Japanese Model) PS2 SCPH-10000 (Japanese Model) and PS3 CECHAXX Japanese Model.

A long milestone of Sony console for me was. I can trust it spec and quality of these consoles.
So, PS1 CPU R3000A Clock at 33.333MHz (Do you trust it?) PS2 Emotion Engine Clock 298.3697MHz (Do you trust it?) same as PS3 Cell BE clock 3.2GHz (Do you trust it?)

Same method from upper line. I believe that PS3 550/700MHz GPU ,too.

But 550/700 detracted from where, where does it say that, the old spech papers that are outdated?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

If you think PS3 isn't good value for your dollars, the cheapest, bestest disc player, excellent games machine, and improving all the time, you're a tough customer! If you hadn't heard the specs you wouldn't be complaining. It's like saying PSP isn't good value on hearing that all those games you've been playing and enjoying are running at 2/3's top speed the machine can do. And by that reasoning, all those games you're playing on PS3 now are poor value for money because they're only using a limited amount of the performance potential. When a dev comments "For instance we are only using approximately 1/3 of the processing power of the SPUs on the Cell processor in Uncharted," does that make Uncharted really 'Uncharted 0.3', and poor value for money? What about Pixeljunk Monsters? That's hardly taxing the system, so I guess it's extremely poor value!

The specs you heard were not finalised. They were no more what you were being sold when the console released than a box with 2 HDMI ports, 3 Gigabit Ethernet ports, 6 USB ports, etc. Specs in CE goods often change a bit from when first shown to final product. The Playstation Eye is nothing like the originally announced IPCamera!

 

[PS3MAN]

I think many rumor 500/650MHz from dev cause PS3 Devtool spec setup. The different between 50MHz gap may need for dev to re-check some kind of BUGs, framerate issue,
screen tearing,...etc. When its release their games to the market those games will work
with your PS3 better than Devtool.

However there are some problem in case of some command line of those games refer
strickly or refer from Devtool spec clock rate may perform badly to your PS3 console @
550/700MHz if there are not re-check with official retail PS3 Model before release.

 

[PS3MAN]

Thank Geezer. No. I didn't mean PS3 suck! or poor value.

I say my PS3 was 550/700MHz GPU/GDDR3 refer from SCEI press conference.