PS3 deliberately hard to program?

[PC-Engine]

What, no kitchen sink?

OK, how about I toss in a rice cooker?

What are you talking about? Everyone knows that Naomi2 chipset was actually cheaper to manufacture then DC hardware and could probably launch in 98 if they wanted too, but in spirit of fair competition Sega kept it away from console market

Uhhh... Yeah, you keep believing that... For one, a standard NOAMI rig (even factoring in mass-production) would still be more costly than a DC. Secondly NAOMI 2 is a significantly more complex board than NAOMI (and more costly). And Finally how are they going to release a NAOMI 2 in '98 when the damn thing was unveiled in late 2000 at JAMMA?

And there was never a convincing argument made along your theory regarding the NAOMI 2 in that thread either...

I think everyone was pretty convinced at the end of that thread or they would've had valid counter arguments.

 

[ChryZ]

http://www.segatech.com/arcade/naomi2/case.jpg

Almost X-Box size, everybody knows: bigger is better

EDIT: switched from

 

[PC-Engine]

I hope you realize that by posting that picture, you're actually supporting my case

Way to go dude!

psssttt...here's a hint...look at that round thing

 

[ChryZ]

I hope you realize that by posting that picture, you're actually supporting my case

Way to go dude!

psssttt...here's the hint...look at that round thing

Hey, no prob ... your case is so hopeless, I was feeling like you could need a little help

 

[PC-Engine]

I hope you realize that by posting that picture, you're actually supporting my case

Way to go dude!

psssttt...here's the hint...look at that round thing

Hey, no prob ... your case is so hopeless, I was feeling like you could need a little help

Um..yeah..you have NO clue...and just got OWNED!

 

[ChryZ]

Um..yeah..you have NO clue...and just got OWNED!

If you like to think so, bottom line is: Sega is out of the consumer hardware market and none of your "what-if" scenarios will change that. Learn to deal with it

 

[PC-Engine]

Um..yeah..you have NO clue...and just got OWNED!

If you like to think so, bottom line is: Sega is out of the consumer hardware market and none of your "what-if" scenarios will change that. Learn to deal with it

Whatever you say man, since you seem to be the genius around here.

 

[Tagrineth]

Or to say it more correctly...the console who came out first won the war!! And it is bound to be inferior!

Not exactly; Saturn launched a good amount of time before PSX and lost horribly (outsold 6:1).

I don't consider Dreamcast the 'first console of this gen', though... it's more of an in-between along the lines of Jaguar and 3DO (and you could in theory call 3DO the start of the 32-bit gen... but it A. had some incredibly strong hardware, and B. lost horribly as well).

 

[archie4oz]

I think everyone was pretty convinced at the end of that thread or they would've had valid counter arguments.

I wasn't (and apparently there are others), nor did I feel like spending time arguing with a wall.

Not exactly; Saturn launched a good amount of time before PSX and lost horribly (outsold 6:1).

Depends on your frame of reference. Are you considering a specific region's launch or system debut? If it's the latter the Saturn debuted only a month in advance of the PSX.

I don't consider Dreamcast the 'first console of this gen', though... it's more of an in-between along the lines of Jaguar and 3DO (and you could in theory call 3DO the start of the 32-bit gen... but it A. had some incredibly strong hardware, and B. lost horribly as well).

You should consider it. Where do you draw the line? I mean the DC's debut in reference the next system (PS2) was actually shorter than the PS2s.

 

[bas1975]

"The most powerful hardware has never won a console generation. "

The SNES was the most powerful hardware and beat out the Genesis in the 16 bit era.

 

[zurich]

"The most powerful hardware has never won a console generation. "

The SNES was the most powerful hardware and beat out the Genesis in the 16 bit era.

Thats debateble. Yes, it had a kickass colour palette and the SuperFX chips, but its CPU was dogslow compared to the Genesis.

 

[PC-Engine]

Uhhh... Yeah, you keep believing that... For one, a standard NOAMI rig (even factoring in mass-production) would still be more costly than a DC. Secondly NAOMI 2 is a significantly more complex board than NAOMI (and more costly). And Finally how are they going to release a NAOMI 2 in '98 when the damn thing was unveiled in late 2000 at JAMMA?

...and somehow NAOMI->smaller/cheaper=DC...must be magic. Xbox using NAOMI 2 would be the same scenario...NAOMI 2->smaller/cheaper->Xbox

Xbox would likely be only 2.5 times the size of DC in physical dimensions with a HDD.

BTW NAOMI 2 hardware was completed a year before it was shown at JAMMA and the design was locked down even before that

Ask SimonF is you don't believe me.

So what does this all mean? It means if Xbox used N2 and released at the same time as PS2 it would be very comparible in price/performance and so far all of the counter arguments to prove otherwise have been shot down.

...and since an Xbox based on N2 would be backwards compatible with all exisiting DC games, it makes a lot of sense. Too bad MS and SEGA couldn't come to an agreement.

 

[London Geezer]

"The most powerful hardware has never won a console generation. "

The SNES was the most powerful hardware and beat out the Genesis in the 16 bit era.

Thats debateble. Yes, it had a kickass colour palette and the SuperFX chips, but its CPU was dogslow compared to the Genesis.

yeah and those days it's not like anyone could really see the difference between a tiny weeny what was it 10MHz CPU and a 12MHz one.... im sure i got the Hz wrong but u got the point...

 

[bas1975]

"Thats debateble. "

It really isn't though. Take a look at the multiplatform titles. The SNES version was almost always the better looking one. From the many Street Fighter versions, to Mortal Kombat, and so on. The Genesis had nothing that could compete on a visual level with the Donkey Kong Country games either.

 

[zurich]

"Thats debateble. "

It really isn't though. Take a look at the multiplatform titles. The SNES version was almost always the better looking one. From the many Street Fighter versions, to Mortal Kombat, and so on. The Genesis had nothing that could compete on a visual level with the Donkey Kong Country games either.

I agree, but the keyword was 'powerful'. Which could lend itself to colour palette stuff, or it could lend itself to raw Mhz. Like I said, its debateable

IMO, Genesis titles were buttass fugly.

 

[Teasy]

Living in a sheer phantasy world must be nice...

I don't know, why don't you tell me? You seem to be living in a fantasy world were I said Sony will slip up next gen, or that they were lucky last gen. It may be a nice cozy world to live in but unfortunately its not reality.

This is probably the saddest thing I've ever seen written in this forum BTW:

If you want to debate What if scenarios all day, we can do it. Although I assure you in ever situation you raise in which you think you've had a point, I will personally smack it down.

Man your about as threatening to me as a mouse with a small knife

Now to the point:

Nowhere in my post did I say that Sony were not "damn good". I just said that if PS3 is difficult to program for and is released at the same time as GC2 and XBox2 it would be akin to PS2/GC/XBox all being released at the same time. Notice that is if. That if is based on the subject of this thread. I am not saying that I believe that will be the case.

I clearly said, in my post, that while PS2 was difficult to program for and would have been in trouble against XBox and GC at release Sony knew they did not need to compete with GC and XBox at release. They knew that by the time GC and XBox were released devs would have gotten used to PS2's hardware. They also knew that by then PS2 would have a very large game library. So Sony were not lucky, they knew what they were doing.. but apparently you missed all of that in your fervor to attack me.

My own opinion on PS3 is that it will be a roaring success. It will be the leader next gen. Sony are too damn good to slip up badly enough to seriously damage PS3. Maybe you should have actually asked if that was my opinion before assuming it was and acting like a total ass.

Finally, I have no idea why you even replied to my post when my post was only there to try to clear up what I thought PC-Engine was saying. PC-Engine was the one who said Sony where lucky ect.. not me.

 

[Panajev2001a]

I clearly said, in my post, that while PS2 was difficult to program for and would have been in trouble against XBox and GC at release Sony knew they did not need to compete with GC and XBox at release. They knew that by the time GC and XBox were released devs would have gotten used to PS2's hardware. They also knew that by then PS2 would have a very large game library. So Sony were not lucky, they knew what they were doing.. but apparently you missed all of that in your furver to attack me. Save it, I'm not impressed by your ability to waffle for hours on end.

Your point seemed to be:

SCE: "Hehehe why should we give them good documentation and nice high-level APIs now ? HAHAHA We have no competition and developers will have to beg us and we can just sit there and let them hang because they have NO CHOICE... HAHAHA We can just wait until we really have competition HAHAHA It must suck o be a developer for PlayStation 2 but what can we do we are EVIL"

That is why Vince got that hot I think...

 

[London Geezer]

SCE: "Hehehe why should we give them good documentation and nice high-level APIs now ? HAHAHA We have no competition and developers will have to beg us and we can just sit there and let them hang because they have NO CHOICE... HAHAHA We can just wait until we really have competition HAHAHA It must suck o be a developer for PlayStation 2 but what can we do we are EVIL"

hahahah thats funny.... and the funnier part is, some people actually think that is the way things went....


oh, BTW can anyone take that fricking USELESS picture from up there. its USELESS and gives that annoying wide-screen effect.... come on... people are working here, with no time to go right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left- for every line
thank u

 

[Teasy]

Panajev2001a

Erm, quote me saying anything like that. I said PS2 was difficult to program for. Which is true. I also said Sony knew that PS2 being difficult to program for would not be detrimental to its success because by the time its competition came out devs would have gotten used to programing for it and it would have built up a nice game library. I did not say at any time that they deliberately made it hard to program for just for the sake of it. Where you got the "HAHAHA" bit from I have no idea.

 

[Saem]

oh, BTW can anyone take that fricking USELESS picture from up there. its USELESS and gives that annoying wide-screen effect.... come on... people are working here, with no time to go right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right-left- for every line
thank u

One big reason I dislike inlined pictures. GRR!