upnorthsox
Veteran
I guess there's the obvious Kinect2
As you say, the equally obvious esram
Third, idk, HSA maybe. It makes sense in that its new/different and will likely bring a nice performance boost.
Predict: The Next Generation Console Tech
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I guess there's the obvious Kinect2
As you say, the equally obvious esram
Third, idk, HSA maybe. It makes sense in that its new/different and will likely bring a nice performance boost.
Yes but by the time the next gen consoles launch the 8xxx series will be out and if I'm not mistaken the suggestion being made is that the rops and texture units etc.. in the next gen console GPU's will perform better than the PC equivilents. So the question is why would that be the case?
If AMD has 2 ROP designs, one that performs at performance level 1 and the other that performs at performance level 1.5, why would they include the 1.5x design in the consoles and only the 1x design in their latest and greatest PC GPU?
My point is that it doesn't make sense to expect per unit performance increases in basic fundamental parts of the GPU just because they are in consoles. It's not like AMD aren't already doing everything they can in the PC space to make these units as fast as they can be. How are they going to do something more just because the GPU happens to be in a console rather than a PC?
Sure we may see some improvements in efficiency over the by then "old" 7xxx series but those improvements will only be what is going into the "current" 8xxx series. Obviously that doesn't account for the number of units or the arrangement of them, e.g. ROPS connected to edram like the 360.
The flops capacitor is a bit of strange thing...
Wii lost it's legs in it's death throws but it proved to be the number 1 console through the current generation. Who isn't going to look at that as a business model?
If Ms believe Kinect 2 is as different as the Quixote was why wouldn't they invest in that rather than hardware which only matters to people like me that like to sit there with a controller in my hand 90% of the time. Im not suggesting they would make a xbox 400 but I doubt they will care if the PS was more powerful if they are backing Kinect to succeed for them.
Something like Kinect (but better than the first try) is a difference maker being able to run a game your competitor does but with Aa isn't as proven by the news that PS3 had overtaken 360 for the number 2 spot this generation in terms of shipped units
Did you even know what MS released yesterday?that thing use controller to play,and if you still believe "have Kinect=low power level" logic,sorry i don't buy that,and it's so boring,even most neogaf members won't talk about it anymore.
Plus
1.look back what Kaz said in CES.
2.You know what happened of Wii,then why you still think MS(or Sony) would follow?they both don't want a console can sell only 5 years.
Oh,you maybe like sony,but i don't care,and please don't take the IDC article seriously,maybe(actually,90%+) this year PS3 will overtake 360 to number...2,but please wait the official announcement unless you believe PS3 can ship 8+ million in 2012 Oct-Dec)
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nunomoreira
Newcomer
maybe a resolution scalar too?
scaling 1600x900 to 1080p would be good since most tv don´t suport that resolution.
Bagel seed
Veteran
Also, going back to the leaked devkit shot, could it be possible that the GPU is some other card besides the HD6870/6950 we originally thought? Possibly around the 1 to 1.6 TF mark? What does the backside of a 7770 look like?
Didn't bkillian say that no one guessed right in which card was in the devkit? Or maybe it just wasn't HD6870 or 6950? People also guessed 7950 though.
So if every guess was wrong then.. *shrugs*
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It's the alternate reality folding that causes the most issues. I trust MS have developed suitable drivers.
That reply was from Dec 28,so don't count any guess after that day(but i don't know how many guessed card after Dec 28)
For me i predict the final console will based on HD8000 series,whatever low,mid,high.
anexanhume
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Ok easy then.
bkillian, I'm guessing the durango dev kit has one of the following:
6770, 6850, 6870, 6950, 6970, 6990, 7750, 7770, 7770 GHz, 7850, 7870, 7870 GHz, 7950, 7970, 7970 GHz, 7990.
Am I on the right track?
I should quote this in a business oriented thread though, but the comparison with the Wii is out of place even taking the low end of the rumors around. Not too mention the Wii made plenty of money, its sales might remain untouched by either Sony or MSFT, and overall Nintendo strategy is a different matter.
As for the product cycle length, it is highly disputable what is sane or not sane to do.
Plenty of big actors (editors) are against long cycles. What the plan of either Sony and MSFT is unknown.
Planning for more than 5 years is imo a tad risky when the market seems on the breaking point to "open". By the way if the market allows you can still extend your product life but it is different to do that than to have a +5 year profitability plan for a product.
End of the rant.
Inuhanyou
Veteran
If Durango was aiming at the casual market specifically, Microsoft would go the wii route.
We know they aren't going to overclock the 360 and re-release it with an upgraded kinect, so why worry? We know whatever comes out of Microsoft will be significantly more powerful than what they have on the market right now. What matters is what devs can do with all that newfound legroom to make the best games possible.
We can expect a few base things just on what we've heard so far.
4 gigs of ram overall(or more)
atleast a 1 tflop GPU.
DX11.1 feature set
An equivalently powered processor.
From this data alone, we can say that on paper, we already have an 8x jump of ram, a 4x jump in GPU strength(on paper) and a similar jump of power for the CPU.
And that's just on paper. In real world circumstances, the potential goes much farther than that.
Going by those very base assumptions, its already looking bright.
We know they aren't going to overclock the 360 and re-release it with an upgraded kinect, so why worry? We know whatever comes out of Microsoft will be significantly more powerful than what they have on the market right now. What matters is what devs can do with all that newfound legroom to make the best games possible.
We can expect a few base things just on what we've heard so far.
4 gigs of ram overall(or more)
atleast a 1 tflop GPU.
DX11.1 feature set
An equivalently powered processor.
From this data alone, we can say that on paper, we already have an 8x jump of ram, a 4x jump in GPU strength(on paper) and a similar jump of power for the CPU.
And that's just on paper. In real world circumstances, the potential goes much farther than that.
Going by those very base assumptions, its already looking bright.
The fastest desktop hex-core today (3970x) = 336 GFLOPs
The fastest desktop quad-core today (3770K) = 224 GFLOPs
The fastest quad-core at next gen consoles launch (4770K) = 448 GFLOPs
Though achieving Intel performance within the power budget Intel is delivering is out of reach of the whole industry.
For the sake of completeness, the fastest AMD chip is the FX-8350, with a peak of 256 GFLOPs. I wonder if Steamroller or more likely Excavator will double the width of the FMA units and support AVX2.
I don't know but as far as FP calculation are concerned, AVX already operates on 8 wide vectors.
The thing is that AMD has only one AVX unit per module ( in fact 2 4 wide units that can works together on wider vectors). I've read nothing about AMD improving this in streamroller.
I would hope that they support at least AVX2 by 2014 when Excavator ships, though will they double the width of the SIMD (so 2 8wide units per module)? I'm doubtful.
Will they implement transactional memory? I don't know either.
I still think they are beating a dead horse with their cluster/CMT approach, the premise were wrong, big cores are getting nowhere.
Inuhanyou
Veteran
I guess what i'm asking really is, is it bad for a next generation console to have that kind of level, as in, does it need it to behave in a superior fashion to the Xenos and scale similar with the other superior components of the next gen console?
Well, one could argue that Cell (i.e., an ambitious CPU) could have been used to improve physics, AI and the scale of gameplay. However, it ended up being used mostly to aid RSX, even by first party developers. So I guess spending more of the transistor budget on the GPU makes sense, especially considering that GPGPU is now a much more viable option that it was back in 2005/2006.
As a few people have said, SIMD performance from jaguar is likely to be much higher than Xenon despite beng lower on paper. While non SIMD performance will see a far bigger increase again. And from what I gather, none SIMD performance is probably more important than SIMD performance in a console CPU.
It also sounds like Durango may have an audio DSP so that's going to free up more CPU resources. I'd say overall its probably at least as big a jump as from the XCPU (Xbox) to Xenon (Xbox 360).
Inuhanyou
Veteran
I see, thanks for explaining it. It sounds decent.
I'd never have guessd that there were so many variables that go into a specific component and how it utilizes its performance in an efficient manner relative to the rest of the unit. How it all works in synch, you know?
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