Official White Knight Story (level 5 RPG) thread

nintenho said:
of course not if you accept the pre-rendered footage will be "reached".
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I think most people "believing" that some of the CGI shown will be reached and maybe surpassed are making a common mistake at looking at history and trying to predict the future from it.

They remember that in the PS2 days, before release, Sony showed some really cool "realtime demos" (the infamous and very ugly "GT2000 demo", "Tekken demo" etc) which were obviously realtime and looked great at the time, but 5-6 years on everyone saw that the PS2 had real games with much, much better graphics under all points of view.

So the understandable misconception is that Sony will "do the same" and eventually, PS3 will be able to surpass what are obviously CGI videos shown prior to release.

I'm not saying they will or they won't. Whether they do or don't, it's not up to me to say - although i do have an opinion on whether they will, and whether anyone should use CGI to raise expectations prior to a product's release - that's just a matter of wait-and-see. But the act itself of predicting the future using only history as an element of analysis is flawed, especially seen how what happened 6-7 years ago has no relevance to the present (different company structure and objectives, different hardware, different competition and timelines, different century etc)
 
london-boy said:
I'm not saying they will or they won't. Whether they do or don't, that's just a matter of wait-and-see. But the act itself of predicting the future using only history as an element of analysis is flawed, especially seen how what happened 6-7 years ago has no relevance to the present (different company structure and objectives, different hardware, different competition and timelines, different century etc)
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True.
Another "based on history" "analysis" is that
"no console has dominated more than two generations in a row, thus Sony will not dominate this gen"
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Which is totally absurd. The history of consoles is a very very short and recent one, you just can't draw conclusions that are founded on such non-existent data. Hell, the science of history can't even reliably predict events that have a much much longer history.

Edit: Corrected "more than two generations in a row ;)
 
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I've only got the trailer in mini-vision, no HD, so can't comment on quality. My take is that it's either realtime of a simulation of realtime.

I don't accept the 'its got a fancy interface so it can't be real' argument. That's ridiculous. Some games do have fancy interfaces (GT series was always quite good in having added swish), and I expect them to increase in the future.

The character models definitely look realtimeable to me. Nothing stellar about them. Poly detail and texture detail aren't anything spectacular.

The scenery and its lighting (shadowing when passing under the tree) were what most impressed me. If this is rendered, that stuff might be tarted up. Still, limited to only a handful of characters the demands of the lighting engine should be satisfied by the available hardware. In this IGN screenshot, texture detail isn't astounding on the terrain either. Considering Oblivion, and factoring in a similar game better targetted to the hardware with more CPU power, I don't see the scenery as impossible.

The IQ seemed very high. That screenshot shows plenty of AA. Maybe that's a promo shot? I don't know what the trailer was like quality wise.

That pic also shows a clipping fault with the sword. If it's CG they've taken deliberate steps to fake faults that wouldn't exist in a properly constructed CG anim!

As for animation, given the quality of Level 5's efforts in other games, I don't doubt that.

My personal opinion is it's either realtime, or a 'previs' that's a pretty accurate example of what the game will be like. The 10% comment could mean pretty much anything. It might be the engine is there but they've only got 10% of the content that makes the game. Perhaps much of the combat variety, skills, characters etc. isn't done and this is only showing 10% of the gameplay? There's no qualification of the 10% remark, nor even a quote. How good is GS reporting in this instance? All we have to look at is the footage. The quality of the content isn't beyond what seems plausible, just with very good art direction. The animation and interacticvity of the combat is what we expet from next-gen. The only area of doubt for me is the IQ. Maybe they're rendering in 720p with 4xMSAA? Or maybe it's non-real-time engine rendering at stupid resolutions and downsampled to produce that PR look?
 
Okay. Back to White Knight Story :)
It's surpriding the short gameplay video is getting so much good responses, more than any PS3 game thus far.
I think it's more to that it finally is something new shown for PS3, or nexst gen in general. I don't mean "new" as in revolutionary in technology or gameplay, but just new.
We've seen those same "old" games (GoW, MGS4, Motorstorm, F1, Resistance, Lair, Heavenly Sword) at their various stages of development for over two years now.
WKS is a new title, that's come out of nowhere and refreshened the preview scene and is something new to talk about.

And it is a very good looking and technically competent title too.
Personally, I don't like the art style that much, based on what I see on that limited area video, or more specifically, I don't like the character art.
 
This debate is dumb IMO, even if it is CG (which I don't see why it would be) the GFX are absolutely nothing that can't be done easily on either of these systems, look at the environments? 2d foliage? The character models, besides the main character, are not great. In general, it's nice but not amazing.

No reason to think this is not realtime imo.
 
Yeah, it's why I didn't even think to talk about the graphics other than to say "they look good." It certainly doesn't look out of place, so there's no reason in my mind to debate them. It's mainly the combat system and overall presentation of the game that intrigues and is with investigating right now. :smile:
 
I think the excitement over this game among JRPG fans is simply... you watch the trailer, and you get the notion that this is going to be a great game. No more, no less. When I saw it what I felt was: 'Here is the next-gen RPG I've been waiting to see.'
 
xbdestroya said:
I think the excitement over this game among JRPG fans is simply... you watch the trailer, and you get the notion that this is going to be a great game. No more, no less.
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Exactly, well said. Now that TGS is over I have to say that - to me - this trailer was the most impressive and interesting media from the show by far. (Followed by Trusty Bell)

Regarding the real vs. trailer debate: Even if it is a "target render" (which I strongly doubt) I see nothing that couldn't be done by a talented team like Level5 except perhaps the AA, though that is hard to tell even in the 720p video. On the gameplay side, the battle system looks like it's already been designed with a lot of detail and gameplay in mind. On first seeing it it seemed like magic (or fake), but since then I believe I've clearly discerned all the control mechanisms.
 
This game was definately the most positive. I think people where mainly surprised about there was hardly any info on this game and then booom..one of the most promising games of the show.
 
one said:
At Playstation Premiere 2007 today in Tokyo a new demo was played.

http://www.famitsu.com/game/news/2007/07/17/103,1184677087,75349,0,0.html

You can create an avatar with a face editor and include a new character in your party. It's going to be playable at TGS this year.
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I saw some screens online!

I really like how this game is shaping up..

However..

I'm not a fan of JRPG's following western RPGs route of dropping deep, rich and interesting characters in favour of generic (create-a-hero) style protagonists..

It really ruins alot of what makes RPGs what they are (otherwise what "roles" are you playing?.. might as well call it an RDG; "Role Defining Game").. :cry:
 
archangelmorph said:
I'm not a fan of JRPG's following western RPGs route of dropping deep, rich and interesting characters in favour of generic (create-a-hero) style protagonists..
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I disagree. As long as you're playing a role, whether it's a forced role or a chosen role, it's role playing. In this case, there's nowt wrong with allowing the player to customize their avatar. The story can still revolve and the character no matter what he looks like. The only real downside IMO is custom names that get dropped in the dialogue, which sounds very fake. Other than that, I like customization. And importing yourself into the game is bound to be well received.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
I disagree. As long as you're playing a role, whether it's a forced role or a chosen role, it's role playing. In this case, there's nowt wrong with allowing the player to customize their avatar. The story can still revolve and the character no matter what he looks like. The only real downside IMO is custom names that get dropped in the dialogue, which sounds very fake. Other than that, I like customization. And importing yourself into the game is bound to be well received.
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Ok it's true there are some very positive aspects to character creation in games..

But after playing so many games which use these systems I tend to find a general dissapointing trend of negatives which become apparent:-

- Most systems don't have the flexibility to "really" import something that looks even remotely similar to yourself into the game (unless you have a very generic, very stereotypical appearance.. Heck I don't even know what that is!!)
- Most systems produce far too uninteresting results (RPG characters are supposed to matter to the player.. How can you draw any kind of connection with a character who effectively doesn't have their own [and thus has to be fed an] identity?)
- Most systems end up alienating at least one specific demographic (due to the vast & diverse creed of players through race, sex, age etc..)
- Most systems are far to generic (due to a lack of the ability to create surreal and exotic looking characters (not everyone want's to make themselves!).. They either come off look deliberately stupid, like the player or like any old boring, generic, average joe..)

Also

- The inclusion of such a system creates problems when your IP works to contribute to or define a game lore/universe.. The best example of this is observing how "Darth Revan" and "The Outcast" contribute VERY poorly to the overall stars wars universe.. On the official Star Wars website revan is only ever depicted in her Biography wearing her mask and sith clothing (and an assumed sex is provided however this is contradictory to the nature of the game as you could have made her a "he") and the Outcast is not even depicted at all..

If they can implement a flexilible and powerful system thats avoids call these pitfalls then it maybe pretty sweet (most games only ever tackle one or two)..

Otherwise give me Cloud Strife (over archangelmorph) anyday..
 
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