Microsoft UWP Discussion

Does Microsoft really think that independent PC developers and publishers, who cherish their freedom and their direct customer relationships, are going to sign up for this current UWP fiasco?" asks Sweeney.

Ironically, one of the few games available on the Windows Store is Epic's Gears of War: Ultimate Edition.
Click to expand...

Lulz .. Anyway, yeah UWP isn't all roses and rainbows. However, many of these peculiarities are part of the cross-ecosystem functionality of UWP.

Nobody is stopping Epic from moving forward with Origin, nor Valve from moving with Steam. You don't need UWP or the Windows Store to successfully sell games, Sweeney. Unless he's worried that Origin will die because of the additional competition?
 
Kaotik said:
Yeah, really sneaky, telling on several occasions it's totally open and any store can support it
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Totally open, except UWP software MUST come from windows store and windows store only, and any store can support it, except windows store takes 30% cut of everything sold, and steam takes another 30% leaving only 40% for the publisher and even less for the dev? No I don't think that would fly very well with devs and publishers alike.

If MS goes forward with introducing new windows features for UWP software only then that would indeed fuck with steam, gog and origin, as well as any independent publishers (battle.net, and so on.)
 
Grall said:
Tim Sweeney rips MS over abusive, monopolistic practices in Universal Windows Platform, accuses company of trying to lock down PCs with console-like restrictions: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2016/...indows-platform-can-should-must-and-will-die/

Claims MS gives "evasive, ambiguous, and sneaky answers to questions about UWP’s future".
Click to expand...


Arsetechnica is bad and the author should beel bad for writing that PoS article.
And people should feel bad for clicking that link and giving them ad revenue.
 
Kaotik said:
No it doesn't, you just need to enable "sideload apps" from settings
Click to expand...
Right, which windows of course tells you about, informs you how to do and makes easy? I did an experiment, actually knowing the option exists, I went about looking for it.

Can't fucking find it. And you know why? Because MS doesn't want you to know about it. (Yeah, you knew that already of course.)

Now, what do you do if you DON'T know sideloading is an option? Like most of us I would think.

Then, just for giggles, I decided I should maybe not give up so easy, so I looked again through all of the windows store itself (there isn't any settings at all in there), then every sub-page of the new (and terrible) control panel, and finally found the setting under "updates and security"/"for developers". Didn't say NOTHING about apps, or windows store. And the sub-page again warns you these settings are only intended for developers, which doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in most people I would think.

It's pretty damn obvious that MS's intent is to lock you into their own store. Otherwise, why would you even need to enable any "sideloading" options? This has never existed as a concept on the PC until now, there's no historical prescident for it. Then they prominently label "sideloading" as a developers option, clearly to dissuade casual use of it.

This is a load of bollocks, but feel free to defend the indefensible. It's a free country... :p
 
Kaotik said:
Yeah, really sneaky, telling on several occasions it's totally open and any store can support it
Click to expand...

Third party stores can't sell UWP apps - they've been clear on that. Phil Spencer said everything else but Terry Myerson is VP in charge of Windows, the stores and the app platforms. I know the lines are blurring inside Microsoft but the gaming guy isn't the person to re-assurances about Windows or the Store. You may as well grab a quote from the tea lady!

Being less cynical, I agree with iroboto in that even if Tim Sweeney did/does seemed a bit confused, it was useful to air these concerns publicly so that Microsoft have to face/consider them. There likely never was any insidious plan to erode open technologies for software sold outside of Microsoft's store but it's good for big companies to have to face concerns of developers.

latest
 
ToTTenTranz said:
- There is no 3rd-party marketplace that can sell certified UWP apps / games.
Click to expand...

And your point being?

Nothing stops developers from selling anything they make for Windows Store in other Stores.

When it comes to smartphones, it's no different from say Apple's store for iOS.

When it comes to tablets, what do you know it's just like regular PCs. Developers can sell anything they make for the Windows Store in any other store they want.

UWP's main benefit is being able to run on Consoles (already locked to Microsoft) and smartphones (already locked to Microsoft). On PC it's business as usual. A developer can release UWP in the Windows Store so it has access to smartphones and potentially consoles. On PC they STILL can release on whatever store they wish.

Yes, some UWP programs aren't sold in say Steam because Steam wouldn't want to sell most of that stuff anyway.

My god the paranoia of some people out there. :p

So for the thick headed.

You can't buy Apps for Smartphones except through the OS holder's storefront (without jailbreaking).
You can't buy Apps for Consoles except through the OS holder's storefront.

UWP is no different from Apple or Google in that respect.

On PC, NOTHING changes. A developer that offers a UWP app in the Windows Store is free to offer the same app in Steam (if they'll accept it) or Origin (if they'll accept it) or Gog (if they'll accept it), etc. It'll run fine on PC's (tablets included unlike Android or iOS) just like the Windows Store version. But if you want to run on a Smartphone or a Console, you'll have to go through the platform holder...just like every other company on the planet.

People don't have a problem with Apple or Google or Sony running things this way, but they get their panties in a twist if Microsoft does the same thing for apps that can run on Smartphones or Consoles? Yeah, I can taste the hypocrisy from here.

BTW - you can technically buy UWP apps through Best Buy, Amazon, etc. Just buy a Microsoft gift card. It has the same exact effect as buying a Steam Game through Amazon, as you still have to redeem it through Steam.

Regards,
SB
 
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People have always had a fear of MS for some strange reason.

Let them push their own store , some people can choose to buy from it but the great thing is there will still be steam and origins and gog . So if developers or consumers don't want the MS store they can go to there.
 
The issue is that if MS decides its store is the only way to install apps in Windows, it can then prevent any competing store from being installed, the end.
Now for that to happen, it doesn't take much, after all Windows 10 now installs updates and uninstalls programs against your will !
From there to believe MS would force its store through, and prevent any competing stores from being installed, there's only a baby step.
 
Silent_Buddha said:
And your point being?

Nothing stops developers from selling anything they make for Windows Store in other Stores.

When it comes to smartphones, it's no different from say Apple's store for iOS.

When it comes to tablets, what do you know it's just like regular PCs. Developers can sell anything they make for the Windows Store in any other store they want.

UWP's main benefit is being able to run on Consoles (already locked to Microsoft) and smartphones (already locked to Microsoft). On PC it's business as usual. A developer can release UWP in the Windows Store so it has access to smartphones and potentially consoles. On PC they STILL can release on whatever store they wish.

Yes, some UWP programs aren't sold in say Steam because Steam wouldn't want to sell most of that stuff anyway.

My god the paranoia of some people out there. :p

So for the thick headed.

You can't buy Apps for Smartphones except through the OS holder's storefront (without jailbreaking).
You can't buy Apps for Consoles except through the OS holder's storefront.

UWP is no different from Apple or Google in that respect.

On PC, NOTHING changes. A developer that offers a UWP app in the Windows Store is free to offer the same app in Steam (if they'll accept it) or Origin (if they'll accept it) or Gog (if they'll accept it), etc. It'll run fine on PC's (tablets included unlike Android or iOS) just like the Windows Store version. But if you want to run on a Smartphone or a Console, you'll have to go through the platform holder...just like every other company on the planet.

People don't have a problem with Apple or Google or Sony running things this way, but they get their panties in a twist if Microsoft does the same thing for apps that can run on Smartphones or Consoles? Yeah, I can taste the hypocrisy from here.

BTW - you can technically buy UWP apps through Best Buy, Amazon, etc. Just buy a Microsoft gift card. It has the same exact effect as buying a Steam Game through Amazon, as you still have to redeem it through Steam.

Regards,
SB
Click to expand...

Although what you state maybe true... developers and consumers still have the right to have a healthy amount of skepticism/paranoia when it comes to Microsoft (or any business), when previous efforts of anti-consumer practices have been established in the past. So if people are crowing loud (right or wrong), it's still up to Microsoft to be upfront and clear as possible. Sometimes it takes lots of time for consumers to trust and understand the new company business practices and philosophy before coming onboard. Specially when the old practices/philosophy are still hunting them.
 
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Rodéric said:
The issue is that if MS decides its store is the only way to install apps in Windows, it can then prevent any competing store from being installed, the end.
Now for that to happen, it doesn't take much, after all Windows 10 now installs updates and uninstalls programs against your will !
From there to believe MS would force its store through, and prevent any competing stores from being installed, there's only a baby step.
Click to expand...
Wait what? I haven't seen Win10 uninstall anything, ever, by itself.
Installing updates against your will is somewhat true, though
 
BRiT said:
Which was 15 years and several CEOs ago.
Click to expand...

People have long memories, so time is irrelevant to them. And it wasn't long ago MS tried (again) certain anti-consumer policies that's hurting a certain device now. So yes, consumers would (should) be skeptical of "any company" with a history of policies not being consumer friendly.
 
Its no mystery that owning your own distribution platform is the business strategy. MS is keen on turning every device Windows is on into a consumption platform by removing user control over the software stack (forced updates with ZERO documentation, forced telemetry and who knows what else in the future). Frequently I see these articles where the latest Windows 10 update did _________. Well no shit, its an OS where obfuscation is by design. This is the company that trojan horsed 10 on users who had autoupdates enabled on earlier windows builds after all.

I understand why MS is doing it but I don't have to like it (or use it).
 
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