Microsoft Roadmap, the XBox 720 and more - Leak

[V3]

I don't think it's fake, but I don't think this thing is an engineering spec sheet.

This is more like internal marketing dept concept sales pitch power point. On what Xbox720 should be.

I am also sure, this is not the only one they pitched, normally company as big as MS will have a few of this, this are probably leaked on purpose because its rejected already. Just to screw around with the media and the rest. And it generates publicity.

 

[AzBat]

Not just DF, a site called Nukezilla posted parts of this document weeks or months ago. I laughed at it at the time. Now it seems a little more real.

However, for example there are those at Neogaf pointing out that MS supposedly took it down doesnt mean anything, they may just not want "BS with their name on it" and full of Microsoft trademarks floating around.

I think it seems more likely to be real now though.

LOL, I posted those Nukezilla rumors over a month ago. LINK Even though I questioned them at the time, I still feel a little bit vindicated considering some here didn't like the idea of me dirtying Beyond3D with such blatant fakes. hehehe

Tommy McClain

 

[(((interference)))]

Wow, that was some leak after all

Since Microsoft's lawyers have taken down the original doc, is there anywhere else I can look at it?

It certainly makes sense of all the dual GPUs and "MS is going batshit crazy" rumours

 

[Grall]

the same is true for this TOO OBVIOUSLY FAKE document.

Stop repeating this ridiculous statement. As already noted in this thread and elsewhere on the internet, MS lawyers have already tried to stop the spread of this "too obviously fake" document.

They don't bother to do that with fakes.

 

[N2O]

Stop repeating this ridiculous statement. As already noted in this thread and elsewhere on the internet, MS lawyers have already tried to stop the spread of this "too obviously fake" document.

They don't bother to do that with fakes.

actually fake or real they still need to do that

 

[DoctorFouad]

Stop repeating this ridiculous statement. As already noted in this thread and elsewhere on the internet, MS lawyers have already tried to stop the spread of this "too obviously fake" document.

They don't bother to do that with fakes.

are you sure that companies lawyers ask to remove only legit leaked documents and not fake ones ? are you sure at 100% ? I really doubt it. this is counterproductive, becaue as you said if lawyers remove only legit leaks, they would confirm all leaks which goes against the interests of the company, it is better to ask removing everything that seems as a leak, so people cant distinguish what is legit from whats not legit.

If someone here is a lawyer he could inform us as to what is the practice of lawyers in these cases (what I said is just logic, I have no knowledge on this issue).

it could be that even microsoft lawyers arent sure if the document is legit or not, so they just asked for its removal as a security measure (after all its a 56 page document who knows), you know its not as simple as : a lawyer making a phone call to microsoft officials and ask : is it ligit ? yes its is ! ask to remove it please ! lol)
or its just a misinformation marketing move from microsoft.

honestly I didnt know its a 56 pages document, I only looked at the 2 slides circulating in the internet and thought its the only thing available and based my judgement on these 2 slides. I should look at and read the whole document to make an informed judgement.

but calling nextxbox as xbox720 (allusion to an outdated 720p technology) is just amateurish. it could be that microsoft asked different groups to produce a vision, and this vision is one of many others. But I still believe the 2 slides I saw (i didnt see yet the document) are full of incoherency. so if it happens that the document is legit I will be very surprised. and if it is legit and the ONLY vision or the CHOSEN vision by microsoft, this could be the WORST LEAK that ever happened to microsoft or any console manufacturer in history. This would be destructive for microsoft. sony, apple, google, nintendo, steam...could all use this information to counter microsoft plans....

 

[Rotmm]

So, DF doesn't actually know if it's real or not. They just don't like it because it's called a 720.

I don't know if it's real or fake, but the "MS wouldn't call it the 720 so it MUST be fake" is a bit of a silly one.

If any of you have seen Reel Steel, you'll notice that MS paid quite a lot of money to have Xbox 720 advertised in it.

Sure, it may not (probably won't be) the final name of the Xbox3, but they are just as likely to use it as a placeholder as we are.

 

[XpiderMX]

it could be that even microsoft lawyers arent sure if the document is legit or not, so they just asked for its removal as a security measure (after all its a 56 page document who knows), or its just a misinformation marketing move from microsoft.

honestly I didnt know its a 56 pages document, I only looked at the 2 slides circulating in the internet and thought its the only thing available and based my judgement on these 2 slides. I should look at and read the whole document to make an informed judgement.

but calling nextxbox as xbox720 (allusion to an outdated 720p technology) is just amateurish. it could be that microsoft asked different groups to produce a vision, and this vision is one of many others. But I still believe the 2 slides I saw (i didnt see yet the document) are full of incoherency. so if it happens that the document is legit I will be very surprised.

Even Activision called "Xbox 720" on the Bungie contract. The "leaked" next gen Xbox document is an internal doc that is close to two years old.

 

[aaronspink]

are you sure that companies lawyers ask to remove only legit leaked documents and not fake ones ? are you sure at 100% ? I really doubt it. this is counterproductive, becaue as you said if lawyers remove only legit leaks, they would confirm all leaks which goes against the interests of the company, it is better to ask removing everything that seems as a leak, so people cant distinguish what is legit from whats not legit.

You need a legal basis to ask for documents to be removed.

If someone here is a lawyer he could inform us as to what is the practice of lawyers in these cases (what I said is just logic, I have no knowledge on this issue).

Unless you created the document, you have no claim over it and therefore no basis to ask for its removal. At best you can sue in court but you cannot use normal DMCA method to remove the document.

but calling nextxbox as xbox720 (allusion to an outdated 720p technology) is just amateurish.

No, not really. 720= 2x360. 360 is also a reference to degrees and a revolution. 720 is the second revolution.

it could be that microsoft asked different groups to produce a vision, and this vision is one of many others. But I still believe the 2 slides I saw (i didnt see yet the document) are full of incoherency.

The document itself is perfectly reasonable as a roadmap and direction document that you would see in many many companies. Inconsistency and incoherency in small part of perfectly normal in pre-PR documents, even continuously reviewed documents/spec. A large part of that doesn't get caught and fixed until external reviews are done. You obviously have this view of company documents from publicly released, fully PR'd documents. This view is not the reality.

and if it is legit and the ONLY vision or the CHOSEN vision by microsoft, this could be the WORST LEAK that ever happened to microsoft or any console manufacturer in history. This would be destructive for microsoft. sony, apple, google, nintendo, steam...could all use this information to counter microsoft plans....

It is a pretty coherent and pretty reasonable extrapolation which shouldn't be foreign to anyone playing in the field. All are or have done directions into everything in that document. The basic idea of the central entertainment hub isn't exactly new nor different from the current public direction of many Microsoft properties. The next step in those documents basically amounts to rolling out Microsoft Mediaroom as an IPTV product for xbox 360 which shouldn't be exactly shocking. Many many Cable/IPTV services already use Mediaroom and already work with an xbox 360 as a STB. The AR aspects are currently being pursued by pretty much everyone in the industry.

I'll say it again, it is highly unlikely that any of MS competitors didn't have consideration of MS moving in the directions outlined by this document. This really isn't all that damaging.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Like others have said, it looks like a non-technical concept to me (fairly cursory glance). A general discussion point for deliberations, shown in a boardroom and discussed. There may have been other proposals, perhaps from the alternative "we need more POWER!" camp. It's not a design document telling us the make up of the next XBox, and was never meant to be. Looking at the content, the need to reach the XB ecosystem onto other devices, that's what some of us have been saying long enough. This doc suggests a hardware paltform, scalable, but I guess now MS have abandoned that and gone with a software platform (same as Sony). I might get surprised.

The important thing is I think, as the basis of lots of rumours, those rumours can be ignored now, as they aren't up-to-date.

 

[Grall]

actually fake or real they still need to do that

Need to do what? Are you suggesting MS (or possibly other hardware vendor) lawyers would demand the removal of fake docs from the internet?

That's not possible. You must own something to be able to demand its removal. You could ask politely if the other party would be so kind as to remove fake docs that you do not own, but of course the rest of the universe would be free to totally ignore the request, so companies basically never do that. It'd be a waste of $500+/hour company lawyers' time.

It would also be acknowledging rumors, which isn't in their interest to do.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

So you're saying this is a Microsoft leak? That's an interesting angle.

Just kidding. I'm pretty sure this is an internal development document as MS executives discussed business strategy before pinning one down and going to their engineers with a requirements.

 

[N2O]

Need to do what? Are you suggesting MS (or possibly other hardware vendor) lawyers would demand the removal of fake docs from the internet?

That's not possible. You must own something to be able to demand its removal. You could ask politely if the other party would be so kind as to remove fake docs that you do not own, but of course the rest of the universe would be free to totally ignore the request, so companies basically never do that. It'd be a waste of $500+/hour company lawyers' time.

It would also be acknowledging rumors, which isn't in their interest to do.

this is a document they are saying is from MS, I can totally see MS taking this down no matter what it said, real or fake, website will report this as a internal MS document.

but i did not said it's 100% fake,in fact,the future plan is pretty real
the only question is they plan to sold it for $299,and the cost even just $225(include everything),plus only 120w?

one more thing
i really hard to believe they would put 2 different GPU and CPU in one case anyway

i think they changed the plan about this,change to make the nextbox GPU and CPU support old 360 games

 

[Dominik D]

@DoctorFouad: You're missing one important thing. This is not a technical presentation, it's a marketing/management BS deck. Those rarely make sense. The higher the level, the more likely it is you could play bullshit bingo during the presentation and win.

 

[Rangers]

I wouldn't assume that just because of the technology proposals seem so odd that this is a fake.

I think it's real, but that it isn't a good prediction of the final product. To me, it feels strongly like a real slide deck that was put together by product designers/marketing, before engineering had a chance to impose some reality.

ditto, and thank goodness.

i'm guessing engineering insisted on at least a cape verde gpu. epic and other devs may have had a hand there too.

 

[Rangers]

LOL, I posted those Nukezilla rumors over a month ago. LINK Even though I questioned them at the time, I still feel a little bit vindicated considering some here didn't like the idea of me dirtying Beyond3D with such blatant fakes. hehehe

Tommy McClain

yeh well, the idea of a 64 alu main gpu (meaning like 64 xenos alu's ) you have to admit seemed completely preposterous, and in fact the system layout in general did. taken alone, i dont blame myself for laughing at it. taken with everything else, plus with the new tech info rumors, plus with the corroborating evidence, it suddenly is more believable, though still the main gpu/tech diagram is the most odd thing about it.

i look at it more like a brainstorming session now. dont know what to think of the gpu, guessing it was a suggestion by a non-engineer.

and yeah i had already seen them by when you posted, i'm sure gaf was fastest on the draw.

 

[BRiT]

Don't you know, it's obviously fake because of the slides concerning Blu-Ray. Simply read this thread here.

 

[Rangers]

Just had a fun thought, X360 GPU for "background services", wonder if that can be used SLI style with the main GPU for games (guessing so)

Hey it's not much, but it can help. Add another 250 gflops of processing power.

 

[N2O]

i really doubt they will put 2 GPU and 2 CPU in one case,whatever it's powerful or not
i bet the actual spec will drop this

 

[Brad Grenz]

PS3 did... It's basically like they are embedding a Roku inside the console. Its not that strange considering their always on, everything goes through the Xbox so we can overlay the Live experience on you regular TV concept.