Microsoft Roadmap, the XBox 720 and more - Leak

[Grall]

Still not certain how MS intend to marry kinect with REAL gaming. Waggle gaming, okay. We've got that bit covered thank you, but if you don't want to swing at thin air to hit baseballs or golfballs, or look stupid dancing badly in place to music, HOW will it work?

You still need buttons to interact properly with a game more complex than simple waggle.

 

[Rockster]

Yukon is gonna be either ARM or x86 ? Is this why AMD licensed ARM ?

Good question.

64 ALUs @ 1 GHz + 48 ALUs @ 500 MHz. Is this 360 style ALUs ? That seems low, how many ALU did Wii U have again ? But their target power consumption is really low, too.

I'm reading that as the 48@500MHz would be 360-ish for back-compat event though they separated them out of that functional block, since in non-back-compat mode they seem to serve background system resources (ie. possibly os, dash, dvr, etc.) The 64@1GHz I don't think would necessarily have to be similar. Though it's unclear how the eDram would be wired up so who really knows.

The glasses and licensing the architecture to other OEM's are the biggest surprises to me. Looks like the glasses might be cellular so you can watch TV / movies and possibly games on the go. Definitely also seems like an onLive model is in their future. I actually feel bad for Microsoft to have their plans all over the Internet. If you have a announcement you'd like to make to the world, I'd suggest putting it in a confidential doc at MS. LOL!

 

[MarkoIt]

So this is Yukon, then there is Durango. I wonder which project will win.

Yukon is gonna be either ARM or x86 ? Is this why AMD licensed ARM ?

4 GB DDR4 is nice. What's the spec of DDR4 ? Is it really fast because it's gonna be on 128 bit bus.

64 ALUs @ 1 GHz + 48 ALUs @ 500 MHz. Is this 360 style ALUs ? That seems low, how many ALU did Wii U have again ? But their target power consumption is really low, too.

I guess they're expecting cloud services to take off with this project.

What's the rumoured spec for Durango ?

DDR4 lower-end is 2133 MT/s.

Those slide are old, if rumors are true than Microsoft considerably improved those specs.
Right now, these are the specs rumored for Durango:
- Between 8 and 16 x86 CPU cores/thread
- Between 6 and 8 GB of DDR3 (12 GB in devkits, but it may become DDR4 in the retail units)
- 1.1-1.5TF GPU (Cape Verde in devkits)

 

[babybumb]

Epic and some 3rd parties freaked out over these specs.

But totally legit in 2010

 

[ERP]

Document looks like a product pitch to me.
If it is real, and looking at it, it might be based on the content/style, it could easily be one of many.
Technical slides should not be taken literally if that is the case.

I do know that one of the R&D groups did show demos of AR glasses to the XBox group. And that MS fairly recently ramped up a hardware group to look seriously at them. The fact they appear in the presentation lends some credence to it being "real".

 

[Dominik D]

Yukon is gonna be either ARM or x86 ? Is this why AMD licensed ARM ?

I think there was a news some time ago they got ARM for the crypto part of their chip (something to do with TPM IIRC).

Fortaleza codename seems plausible. Also Todd Holmdahl (final slide) would probably ask questions for this kind of presentation. Seems old though - late 2009 or so. WP7 device is using the "generic WP7" phone image and there's a Froblins demo screenshot (2009 DX10.1 showcase) on one of the slides.

 

[Rangers]

Epic and some 3rd parties freaked out over these specs.

But totally legit in 2010

not really, on the 64 alu's main gpu...

 

[DieH@rd]

5 more rumors like this, and we will finally get official word from MS.

 

[dagamer]

from september 2010?
fake then

nukezilla should remember change ATI logo to AMD logo next time

We really have to remember that this document is from September 2010, specifically after the Apple announcement when the Apple TV 2nd gen was announced. AMD was still using the ATI logo for GPU graphics. It didn't switch over to a pure AMD brand until the Radeon HD 6000 series which launched in December 2010.

I've read these documents and there is no smoking gun that screams fake. Things are bound to change in 2 years, there are a lot of concepts in here that are actual products now and sound plausible in the future.

 

[Rangers]

LOL, detective GAF is on the case, they fished some kind of path out of the images, stuff like this

37: \nkachroo/Documents/Work/Project 10/Finished Frames for Monday/Finished Frames for Monday/Frame 08.jpg

40: \nkachroo/Documents/Work/Project 10/Finished Frames for Monday/Finished Frames for Monday/Frame 07.jpg

41: \nkachroo/Documents/Work/Project 10/Finished Frames for Monday/Finished Frames for Monday/Frame 08.jpg

42: \nkachroo/Documents/Work/Project 10/Finished Frames for Monday/Finished Frames for Monday/Frame 09.jpg

43: \nkachroo/Documents/Work/Project 10/Finished Frames for Monday/Finished Frames for Monday/Frame 10.jpg

And out of that nkachroo name, traced it back to a possible author (actually two, but this one seems more likely)

http://www.slideshare.net/naveenkachroo

Starting to think the whole thing is real just super early. It has the whiff of truth and reminds me much of the first X360 spec leaks, which was in a very similar timeframe. Something like this was likely to happen.

At the time I didnt believe X360 spec sheet either...

 

[N2O]

We really have to remember that this document is from September 2010, specifically after the Apple announcement when the Apple TV 2nd gen was announced. AMD was still using the ATI logo for GPU graphics. It didn't switch over to a pure AMD brand until the Radeon HD 6000 series which launched in December 2010.

I've read these documents and there is no smoking gun that screams fake. Things are bound to change in 2 years, there are a lot of concepts in here that are actual products now and sound plausible in the future.

you should check the upload date of this doc

 

[DoctorFouad]

it is too fake, too much clarity and detail for a 2010 document. I doubt microsoft employees could produce such detailed document for the future of xbox even nowadays. For that sort of details and future vision, not until 2013. but nice one by the way, especially the glasses releasing after nextxbox and kinext2 not with the console itself, thats alone gave it away, if you want to develop a new commercially successful glasses it should be available the day of release of your hardware not long after lol

congratulations to whoever created it, he is now laughing in front of his screen lol

 

[XpiderMX]

LOL, detective GAF is on the case, they fished some kind of path out of the images, stuff like this



And out of that nkachroo name, traced it back to a possible author (actually two, but this one seems more likely)

http://www.slideshare.net/naveenkachroo

Starting to think the whole thing is real just super early. It has the whiff of truth and reminds me much of the first X360 spec leaks, which was in a very similar timeframe. Something like this was likely to happen.

At the time I didnt believe X360 spec sheet either...

Naveen Kachroo works in MSDN: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms978698.aspx

EDIT: More from him:

Game consoles and other fixed-function devices such as set-top boxes, cellular phones, portable entertainment devices, and many consumer electronics devices, generally are designed to perform a limited set of well-defined functions. Attempts have been made to virtualize capabilities on a fixed-function device. Virtualization enables a guest environment to execute on a host computing environment, thereby expanding the number of applications that can be executed on the host computing environment. In an operating system virtualization environment for example, a host computing device includes a host operating system that runs directly on the physical hardware of the host device. To achieve operating system virtualization, the host operating system can execute an emulator program that creates a guest environment sufficient to run a guest operating system.

In a virtualization system, the user interface of a host device, such as a game device for example (e.g., MICROSOFT.RTM. Xbox) is tightly integrated with a guest environment, such as a MICROSOFT.RTM. Windows operating system for example, providing a user experience that blurs the boundaries between host environment and the guest environment. Features of the guest environment are integrated with the host environment such that the complexities and incongruities of the underlying virtualization engine are hidden, providing a seamless, natural experience for end-users.

http://www.freshpatents.com/Virtual...user-interfaces-dt20080131ptan20080028400.php

 

[McHuj]

it is too fake, too much clarity and detail for a 2010 document. I doubt microsoft employees could produce such detailed document for the future of xbox even nowadays. For that sort of details and future vision, not until 2013. but nice one by the way, especially the glasses releasing after nextxbox and kinext2 not with the console itself, thats alone gave it away, if you want to develop a new commercially successful glasses it should be available the day of release of your hardware not long after lol

congratulations to whoever created it, he is now laughing in front of his screen lol

Would you say Kinect hasn't been commercially successful? It released long after the xbox.

 

[N2O]

well

https://twitter.com/Digital_Foundry/status/213966764197941249
https://twitter.com/Digital_Foundry/status/213968417181540352
https://twitter.com/Digital_Foundry/status/214041225932705792

 

[ninelven]

Apparently that'll be an MS-branded Windows 8 tablet.

I think the most interesting part will be to see if it has an MS designed CPU.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Digital Foundry is calling it a fake

https://twitter.com/Digital_Foundry/status/213966764197941249

 

[babybumb]

Digital Foundry is calling it a fake

https://twitter.com/Digital_Foundry/status/213966764197941249

What an earth is he talking about "next-gen". 50W is very possible for Amd Fusion SOC

 

[McHuj]

I think to many people are looking at this on the technical merits and assuming this that these are actual specs. This whole presentation reads like a business development/marketers vision of how they see the xbox platform evolving (with a limited understanding of the tech behind it).

I think this was real. (Apparently, it was also taken down by request from a legal firm that does work for MS.)

I think what people should take away from this is that two years ago MS was targeting a sub 150W console for under $300 with a modest gain in performance with a new Kinect. What's unreasonable about that? This was speculated by many, even here.

 

[upnorthsox]

So scribd has already been asked/ordered by MS Lawyers to take the document down. How long will it be before beyond3D is asked to do the same with Rotmm's posts to start this thread?