Microsoft gets serious about expanding demographic reach

[Inane_Dork]

Viva, Viva Pinata!

Isn't that an Elvis song?


Hopefully GDC or E3 will show more of this game.

 

[Sis]

I just don't understand this notion that the kids need to serve as a 'stealth' vehicle for the father to justify a 360 purchase to his wife however.

Again, I don't believe it's about making this game act as a stealth vehicle or justification for buying the system--but it does do one critical thing, and that's round out the game library. If Dad has a choice between game system A and game System B, and both A & B have great adult games but B has a couple great family games, which system will he buy? Not to mention that it creates another marketing opportunity via that cartoon...

Anyway, I would argue that today Sony and Nintendo have MS beat handily in family oriented games. I would also argue that MS is doing a , ahem, 180, with this by offering Xbox Live arcade games that appeal to casual gamers (ie, girlfriends) and new family oriented IP that you can't get anywhere else.

 

[pipo]

I would also argue that MS is doing a , ahem, 180, with this by offering Xbox Live arcade games that appeal to casual gamers (ie, girlfriends) and new family oriented IP that you can't get anywhere else.

You do know Arcade was available for the old box too?

It didn't work for me, but it's not like they've done a 180...

 

[Sis]

You do know Arcade was available for the old box too?

It didn't work for me, but it's not like they've done a 180...

Er, yes. But offering something and meaningfully offering something are two different things. Xbox Live Arcade on the original Xbox was a trial run.

Seriously, show of hands from all the Xbox 360 owners who now must fight for control of the 360 because their significant other wants to play Bejewled or Zuma or Hexic.

Me: raises hand.

This expansion of their demographic reach is a 180 from the original Xbox, which fit a very narrow market of long time gamers.

 

[NavNucST3]

You do know Arcade was available for the old box too?

It didn't work for me, but it's not like they've done a 180...

Arcade for Xbox was merely a test for its implementation in the 360, yes, we know it is available, but not in the form that it takes on the 360. Especially, when considering ease of use.

 

[Carl B]

Again, I don't believe it's about making this game act as a stealth vehicle or justification for buying the system--but it does do one critical thing, and that's round out the game library. If Dad has a choice between game system A and game System B, and both A & B have great adult games but B has a couple great family games, which system will he buy? Not to mention that it creates another marketing opportunity via that cartoon...

Anyway, I would argue that today Sony and Nintendo have MS beat handily in family oriented games. I would also argue that MS is doing a , ahem, 180, with this by offering Xbox Live arcade games that appeal to casual gamers (ie, girlfriends) and new family oriented IP that you can't get anywhere else.

Well truly though, if the father wants a 360 - he should get the 360. If we're talking about family friendly systems, one game alone does not a child-friendly system make. Gamecube and it's titles are cheap enough that IMO there would be no reason not to put down the cash necessary to put a controller in your childs hands. For like $100 these days you get the system, a game, and an extra controller. It's crazy, and currently the 'better' choice if a child is the key determinent... or even prominent in the decision-making.

Viva Pinata is in a chicken/egg situation in that it will launch on a system where it will be the sole childrens title of note, yet at the same time is very much needed to get the ball rolling if Microsft ever wishes to achieve that. I personally don't think it will drive sales of the system lest the show itself become a runaway hit, but for those who already own a 360, I believe it might justify staving off the purchase of a competitors console (looking at GC and PS2, cheap systems) if they begin to have some compelling childrens content of their own. And from there, their reputation can build.

 

[standing ovation]

Well truly though, if the father wants a 360 - he should get the 360.

You are absolutely right ... provided, of course, that mom does not object.

When you love someone, the world does not revolve around you -- it spends a lot of its time orbiting around your beloved. In other words, their happiness and wellbeing becomes one of your most basic needs.

So while dad may want a new Xbox, he needs mom to be content.

Viva Pinata is in a chicken/egg situation in that it will launch on a system where it will be the sole childrens title of note, yet at the same time is very much needed to get the ball rolling if Microsft ever wishes to achieve that.

Apparently, kids aren't the only target for this one-size-fits-all breakout.

But that’s neither here nor there.

Whether Viva Piñata is a shoe-in or a long shot, letting Rare so much as breathe on the IP is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Johnny Awesome]

I couldn't disagree more. Rare is awesome.

 

[Carl B]

You are absolutely right ... provided, of course, that mom does not object.

When you love someone, the world does not revolve around you -- it spends a lot of its time orbiting around your beloved. In other words, their happiness and wellbeing becomes one of your most basic needs.

So while dad may want a new Xbox, he needs mom to be content.

I agree with you and I don't. The way I see it, if mom loves dad, what in the world would she have against him getting a 360 to begin with? I personally don't see that objection should come into a marriage whatsoever as long as the individuals are buying personal effects; shoes, video game consoles, etc...

Maybe if someone goes out for a car or house or something, then it should be a team decision - but a console?

I find the described situation quite objectionable.

Pity for the men that find themselves in such self-imposed shackles. A woman who loves you doesn't care if you get a console for yourself, that's my take on it.

 

[NavNucST3]

Well truly though, if the father wants a 360 - he should get the 360. If we're talking about family friendly systems, one game alone does not a child-friendly system make. Gamecube and it's titles are cheap enough that IMO there would be no reason not to put down the cash necessary to put a controller in your childs hands. For like $100 these days you get the system, a game, and an extra controller. It's crazy, and currently the 'better' choice if a child is the key determinent... or even prominent in the decision-making.

Viva Pinata is in a chicken/egg situation in that it will launch on a system where it will be the sole childrens title of note, yet at the same time is very much needed to get the ball rolling if Microsft ever wishes to achieve that. I personally don't think it will drive sales of the system lest the show itself become a runaway hit, but for those who already own a 360, I believe it might justify staving off the purchase of a competitors console (looking at GC and PS2, cheap systems) if they begin to have some compelling childrens content of their own. And from there, their reputation can build.

Sole childrens title? After all the bitching and complaining about Kameo about it being kiddie, I would think you could at least include that in the mix, not to mention the slew of pickup and go games on XBLA, I think you are underestimating the number of "kid-friendly" titles that are currently available for the 360. I could give you a rundown, but it seems that outside of 360 owners, no one seems to count XBLA as "real" games. I'm sure, however, when N and Sony drop their versions of XBLA, their versions will automatically be counted in their stable of games by their proponents.

Kid-friendly to me includes games like: Ridge Racer, Burnout, Kameo, Feeding Frenzy, Zuma, Wik, Geo Wars:RE, all of the puzzle games (Hexic, Bejeweled, Jewel Quest), Marble Blast Ultra, and Crystal Quest. This is what is available today a little over 4 months into the system, you would have to suspect that XBLA is going to keep its pace of about 3 games/month and probably a lot more, going forward. So by the time Viva drops there could be 50+ "kids" games for the 360.

 

[Carl B]

Sole childrens title? After all the bitching and complaining about Kameo about it being kiddie, I would think you could at least include that in the mix, not to mention the slew of pickup and go games on XBLA, I think you are underestimating the number of "kid-friendly" titles that are currently available for the 360. I could give you a rundown, but it seems that outside of 360 owners, no one seems to count XBLA as "real" games. I'm sure, however, when N and Sony drop their versions of XBLA, their versions will automatically be counted in their stable of games by their proponents.

Kid-friendly to me includes games like: Ridge Racer, Burnout, Kameo, Feeding Frenzy, Zuma, Wik, Geo Wars:RE, all of the puzzle games (Hexic, Bejeweled, Jewel Quest), Marble Blast Ultra, and Crystal Quest. This is what is available today a little over 4 months into the system, you would have to suspect that XBLA is going to keep its pace of about 3 games/month and probably a lot more, going forward. So by the time Viva drops there could be 50+ "kids" games for the 360.

Ok, first of all I've never called Kameo 'kiddie,' quite the opposite - I feel it's a premier title. So I hope when you were refering to the 'bitching' you weren't talking about myself. Would I want my six or seven year-old playing it? I think honestly probably not, but that's personal choice. To me, it's on a different level of 'violence' than is the upcoming Viva Pinata. As for my take on Live Arcade, they're scattered throughout this thread; if you've read them you know my take.

If you think the 360 presents a strong argument for parents looking to buy a console for their children, well that's certainly your opinion to have. I think most would agree though that it trails in that area in terms of public perception, and that's really what the thread topic is about; public perception. Viva Pinata will get exposure like no Arcade Live game ever will.

 

[g35er]

Think of it like any other platform device, such a computer or DVD player. The main buyer is using the device for his own purposes, but it's great that computers and DVD players have content for others in the family, i.e. kids software and kids movies. Likewise, having a wide breadth of games can only help the console. Did you know one of the hottest selling games in Japan is a Gameboy brain game aimed toward older people? That's expanding your audience.

 

[NavNucST3]

Ok, first of all I've never called Kameo 'kiddie,' quite the opposite - I feel it's a premier title. So I hope when you were refering to the 'bitching' you weren't talking about myself. Would I want my six or seven year-old playing it? I think honestly probably not, but that's personal choice. To me, it's on a different level of 'violence' than is the upcoming Viva Pinata. As for my take on Live Arcade, they're scattered throughout this thread; if you've read them you know my take.

If you think the 360 presents a strong argument for parents looking to buy a console for their children, well that's certainly your opinion to have. I think most would agree though that it trails in that area in terms of public perception, and that's really what the thread topic is about; public perception. Viva Pinata will get exposure like no Arcade Live game ever will.

For clarification, no, I was not talking about you, it was a generalization. My four-year old plays Kameo and loves it, I think it is much less "violent" than the majority of cartoons on the air, so if you wouldn't allow your six or seven year old to play it, then...well, that goes towards your personal choice. I think the 360 presents a strong argument for a FAMILY to buy a console, it isn't just about am I going to buy this $400+item JUST for my kid. Its about what can I buy that I will play, that my son will play, and that my wife will play. Even my grandmother loves to watch my son play Kameo and Feeding Frenzy, I think Viva can do this and more, if my grandmother is walking through Target and sees a bookbag or a lunch box with one of the Viva characters, she is more apt to buy it for her grandson.

I guess what I am saying is, its not just about MSFT getting people to buy the console, expanding the demographic can be done through traditional retail outlets in the clothes section AND the video game section. Its possible that Viva the game is just a seed planter for more things to come, which is why it is coming so early in the consoles life.

But if I had to put money on something, that as it stands now and the positive previews that have been given about the game, I would bet it would outsell both Kameo and PDZ and the merchandising for it will make all parties involved a nice chunk of change.

 

[Carl B]

For clarification, no, I was not talking about you, it was a generalization. My four-year old plays Kameo and loves it, I think it is much less "violent" than the majority of cartoons on the air, so if you wouldn't allow your six or seven year old to play it, then...well, that goes towards your personal choice. I think the 360 presents a strong argument for a FAMILY to buy a console, it isn't just about am I going to buy this $400+item JUST for my kid. Its about what can I buy that I will play, that my son will play, and that my wife will play. Even my grandmother loves to watch my son play Kameo and Feeding Frenzy, I think Viva can do this and more, if my grandmother is walking through Target and sees a bookbag or a lunch box with one of the Viva characters, she is more apt to buy it for her grandson.

I guess what I am saying is, its not just about MSFT getting people to buy the console, expanding the demographic can be done through traditional retail outlets in the clothes section AND the video game section. Its possible that Viva the game is just a seed planter for more things to come, which is why it is coming so early in the consoles life.

But if I had to put money on something, that as it stands now and the positive previews that have been given about the game, I would bet it would outsell both Kameo and PDZ and the merchandising for it will make all parties involved a nice chunk of change.

Well I think we're both viewing things the same way then, it's just your 'activiation energy' - to borrow a term from biology/chemistry - is lower than mine in terms of considering 360 to be a family console. But I absolutely agree that the wider the breadth of games, the closer a console can get to becoming a family's one-stop-shop for gaming.

 

[NavNucST3]

Well I think we're both viewing things the same way then, it's just your 'activiation energy' - to borrow a term from biology/chemistry - is lower than mine in terms of considering 360 to be a family console. But I absolutely agree that the wider the breadth of games, the closer a console can get to becoming a family's one-stop-shop for gaming.

One of the reasons I am so hyped for Viva is because the entire life cycle of the Xbox, I searched high and low to find those kid friendly games, and they were only on PS2 and obviously Gamecube. The only games I would let me son play (he was two at the time) was ATV power quad racing (think thats the title) and Burnout. So now, having this many games available for him to play, that my wife and I also enjoy, is amazing, and its not even a year-old yet.
But for sake of full disclosure, I bought Kameo for me, and I will do the same for Viva, I just happen to let them play MY game(s), , also I was so enthralled with xbla, that I went and bought Torque/Torque Shader to develop a game for xbla (hopefully).

 

[standing ovation]

I couldn't disagree more. Rare is awesome.

You're right. Rare is awesome -- awesomely lethargic!

If Piñata development is anything like Kameo, then Xbox 720 will have stormed the marketplace before Rare finally gets around to a product release. :neutral:

The way I see it, if mom loves dad, what in the world would she have against him getting a 360 to begin with?

That's just it. YOU have a need to make sense -- a quality your better half doesn't always reciprocate. Sure, it would be nice to kinda understand how she's getting from Point A to Point Z, but it's not necessary.

As her "whipped" worse half, it would behoove you to keep things simple.

Mom may have a problem with getting another Xbox; and if dad persists, her fancy will eventually become his reality ...

So go ahead, get that 360 you thought you wanted. I guarantee you won't enjoy it.

 

[Carl B]

That's just it. YOU have a need to make sense -- a quality your better half doesn't always reciprocate. Sure, it would be nice to kinda understand how she's getting from Point A to Point Z, but it's not necessary.

As her "whipped" worse half, it would behoove you to keep things simple.

Mom may have a problem with getting another Xbox; and if dad persists, her fancy will eventually become his reality ...

So go ahead, get that 360 you thought you wanted. I guarantee you won't enjoy it.

Standing Ovation I pray that this is not your own world you are describing.

I dare say I live in a better place, figuratively speaking.