Microsoft gets serious about expanding demographic reach
- Thread starter Carl B
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Johnny Awesome
Veteran
I think some people on this forum are too young to know how these conversations actually go:
Dad: I think we should get little Jimmy an X360 for Christmas
Mom: Sounds more like a present for you. Little Jimmy can't play Gears of War.
Dad: But look! Viva Pinata! Kameo!
Mom: Ok.
That's why these games are a good idea for MS even at the $400 X360 price point. Remember that Dad plays video games. He just needs a reason to justify the purchase to Mom. Hence: Viva Pinata!
Dad: I think we should get little Jimmy an X360 for Christmas
Mom: Sounds more like a present for you. Little Jimmy can't play Gears of War.
Dad: But look! Viva Pinata! Kameo!
Mom: Ok.
That's why these games are a good idea for MS even at the $400 X360 price point. Remember that Dad plays video games. He just needs a reason to justify the purchase to Mom. Hence: Viva Pinata!
standing ovation
Regular
Ah, but there's a catch. In order for your-better-half-without-the-gaming-habit to recognize the series, it would have to be insanely popular with kids. 
As badly as Microsoft wants to, I doubt they have the wherewithal to manufacture a fad.
As badly as Microsoft wants to, I doubt they have the wherewithal to manufacture a fad.
standing ovation said:Ah, but there's a catch. In order for your-better-half-without-the-gaming-habit to recognize the series, it would have to be insanely popular with kids.
As badly as Microsoft wants to, I doubt they have the wherewithal to manufacture a fad.
I dont think it has anything to do with wherewithal, (and if by wherewithal you mean 'a ton of money and resources' i would disagree) its about the concept and the subsequent marketing and execution of that concept. Now i don't necesseraly think that Viva Pinata is a concept just waiting to burst into a fad, but if it isnt, it wasnt because MS (or anyone) didnt have the stomach to see it through.
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We shouldn't be thinking in terms of system sellers, since those are rare and uncontrollable (and requires attaching the cost of the system with a single game). Instead, this seems to be purely about "fleshing out" the Xbox demographic. It's also an obvious attempt by MS to create a new IP, especially one with wide product appeal (in fact, I'm surprised we haven't seen a Halo cartoon yet. Would be awesome on Adult Swim...)xbdestroya said:
Adult Swim is too indie in my opinion to cheapen the experience with a Halo cartoon. (unless of course it's truly action packed and violent)
But yeah a system seller probably isn't the best way to look at it. In the end, it's really an anti-Nintendo weapon of sorts, trying to get a piece of that younger revenue stream. There's a number of different one-off scenarios we could envision I guess, but in the end it's just a smart move for MS.
We'll see how it does, I think a lot will depend on the quality of the cartoon.
Still I have to wonder which households this would appeal to; households where the father owns a 360 and they want a game for their child? Until the 360's price comes down - and IPs like Viva Pinata take off - I think for parents shopping for a video game system for their younger child, Nintendo will still hold an edge in terms of being 'child friendly.'
I know when we (my girlfriend and I) were shopping recently for her nephews, Gamecube was the clear winner in terms of which console to buy them.
(unless of course it's truly action packed and violent)But yeah a system seller probably isn't the best way to look at it. In the end, it's really an anti-Nintendo weapon of sorts, trying to get a piece of that younger revenue stream. There's a number of different one-off scenarios we could envision I guess, but in the end it's just a smart move for MS.
We'll see how it does, I think a lot will depend on the quality of the cartoon.
Still I have to wonder which households this would appeal to; households where the father owns a 360 and they want a game for their child? Until the 360's price comes down - and IPs like Viva Pinata take off - I think for parents shopping for a video game system for their younger child, Nintendo will still hold an edge in terms of being 'child friendly.'
I know when we (my girlfriend and I) were shopping recently for her nephews, Gamecube was the clear winner in terms of which console to buy them.
This thread is a classic example of gamers thinking the world revolves around them.
Do you actually think the video game is the main focus of Viva Pinata? Do you really believe MS is doing all of this, the cartoon, game, etc... all to sell a video game?
FOOLS!!!
The money here is in tie-in product sales. Viva Pinata is going to be marketed by the same people who handle Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, Cabbage Patch Kids, and G.I. Joe. They're going to ahve T-shirts, bath towels, lunch boxes, backpacks, toy figures, trading cards, pretty much anything they can slap a logo on. This is set to be a major childrens product franchise, and the video game is only one small piece of the overall product.
And if it takes off like Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, or G.I. Joe, then MS will be sitting on a gold mine, regardless of what some 20+ year old video gaming geeks on an internet forum think.
Do you actually think the video game is the main focus of Viva Pinata? Do you really believe MS is doing all of this, the cartoon, game, etc... all to sell a video game?
FOOLS!!!
The money here is in tie-in product sales. Viva Pinata is going to be marketed by the same people who handle Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, Cabbage Patch Kids, and G.I. Joe. They're going to ahve T-shirts, bath towels, lunch boxes, backpacks, toy figures, trading cards, pretty much anything they can slap a logo on. This is set to be a major childrens product franchise, and the video game is only one small piece of the overall product.
And if it takes off like Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, or G.I. Joe, then MS will be sitting on a gold mine, regardless of what some 20+ year old video gaming geeks on an internet forum think.
standing ovation
Regular
expletive said:
I was not talking about the viability of a concept as much as the persuasiveness of an argument.
In order for Johnny Awesome -- err, "Dad" -- to be convincing, Viva Piñata will need to have faddish appeal. (How else will he persuade his greatest skeptic to buy another Xbox?)
Think about it. If his little collaborators haven't got a clue what he is talking about, poor Dad may have to endure Mom's contemptuous glare ... and THAT will settle the matter for a long time. :smile:
standing ovation said:I was not talking about the viability of a concept as much as the persuasiveness of an argument.
In order for Johnny Awesome -- err, "Dad" -- to be convincing, Viva Piñata will need to have faddish appeal. (How else will he persuade his greatest skeptic to buy another Xbox?)
Think about it. If his little collaborators haven't got a clue what he is talking about, poor Dad may have to endure Mom's contemptuous glare ... and THAT will settle the matter for a long time. :smile:
Ah well thats differemt, and i know THAT glare!!
Personally, i think the show is a risky concept becuase it seems to be missing a key ingredient pokemon and yu gi oh have - "the cool looking younger kid with powers beyond his age that regular young kids identify with and aspire to". That seems to be a common thread in the other shows 4kids does, i wonder why they didn't (or maybe they did) follow that formula here? Also, can anyone think of a kids SHOW that is CGI that has enjoyed any mass market success?
randycat99
Veteran
Hence was my post asking why bother with the risk of building a recognizable franchise, when they could simply buy an exclusive with an existing franchise that is well established and proven to draw the kiddies.
expletive said:Ah well thats differemt, and i know THAT glare!!
Personally, i think the show is a risky concept becuase it seems to be missing a key ingredient pokemon and yu gi oh have - "the cool looking younger kid with powers beyond his age that regular young kids identify with and aspire to". That seems to be a common thread in the other shows 4kids does, i wonder why they didn't (or maybe they did) follow that formula here?
They are targeting a younger and broader demographic than the 10-13 year old males.
For instance, my 4 year old daughter has already fallen in love with the trailer and has made me play it for her at least twice a day for the past week.
Off the top of my head, Jay Jay the Jet Plane.
randycat99
Veteran
Never heard of it...
I just don't understand this notion that the kids need to serve as a 'stealth' vehicle for the father to justify a 360 purchase to his wife however. I mean - c'mon guys, are you men or what?
We're talking like a $400 personal purchase here; is clearance from on-high really required?
Anyway Powderkeg you make a good point that the cash generated from this whole thing would be primarily on the toys/swag/cartoon side of things if it takes off - and it could definitely be a lot a lot f money if it ever even approached Pokemon proportions - but it's all still framed in the context of Microsoft's leveraging this effort in order to expand the XBox target demographic. I mean it'll just come down to whether or not the show is successful, that's really the biggest unknown.
We're talking like a $400 personal purchase here; is clearance from on-high really required?
Anyway Powderkeg you make a good point that the cash generated from this whole thing would be primarily on the toys/swag/cartoon side of things if it takes off - and it could definitely be a lot a lot f money if it ever even approached Pokemon proportions - but it's all still framed in the context of Microsoft's leveraging this effort in order to expand the XBox target demographic. I mean it'll just come down to whether or not the show is successful, that's really the biggest unknown.
If you like sleeping in your own bed, yes. Some wives even withold "adult activities" for buying things that are more than 100 with out prior knowledge.xbdestroya said:I just don't understand this notion that the kids need to serve as a 'stealth' vehicle for the father to justify a 360 purchase to his wife however. I mean - c'mon guys, are you men or what?
We're talking like a $400 personal purchase here; is clearance from on-high really required?
Married men tend to have pretty good excuses for why they need/want certain things, and some wives don't know enough about the item to object.
Diamond.G said:
I really have to encourage these men to stand up for themselves though. I mean a lot of my friends are married, and I always find it aggravating when I'm the one standing up to their wives when they're being bossed around. I'm talking seriously treated like slave labor. Now it's all good because I have good relationships with these women and they don't take umbrage, but it's just sad seeing these people I've known for so long when they're whipped vs when they're not around these women.
I'm all for treating each other civily; I don't like it when I see a husband who bullies his wife, or a wife who railroads her husband. Frankly marriage is an abstract concept to begin with IMO, so truly this extends to all relationships.
My aforementioned girlfriend used to bug me about the time I spent on forums, playing games, friendships maintained with ex-girlfriends, time spent with friends, basically whatever time spent didn't involve her. And she'd be like: "I'm not going to put up with this so you better change your behavior," to which my response was essentially: "This stuff is important to me, and it's not changing. Make your choice."
Anyway, here we are down the line and everything is much better with the understanding that these are the people we are and it's better to focus on the things we like about each other, and even celebrate the differences, rather than try to change the things we might at first not like.
I truly feel that if you compromise on yourself and who you are in the beginning of a relationship, it's that much harder to get back to a point where you feel you're comfortable just being yourself again down the line.
This has been my public service announcement for the day.
randycat99
Veteran
What MS should be targeting is Oprah exposure, then! Get Oprah to advocate the product, and it will be like candy for the wife brigade.
My digression contribution- the way divorce laws have gone, you are pretty much signing your balls over to your "beloved" by entering a marriage agreement. She's got all the strings to pull and over time you will become whipped. Should you decide to stand up for yourself, it will always be at the risk of "sex sanctions", and if you attempt to circumvent that, then you simply transfer that risk to the hands of divorce law.
Get Oprah to advocate the product, and it will be like candy for the wife brigade. My digression contribution- the way divorce laws have gone, you are pretty much signing your balls over to your "beloved" by entering a marriage agreement. She's got all the strings to pull and over time you will become whipped. Should you decide to stand up for yourself, it will always be at the risk of "sex sanctions", and if you attempt to circumvent that, then you simply transfer that risk to the hands of divorce law.
randycat99 said:What MS should be targeting is Oprah exposure, then!
My digression contribution- the way divorce laws have gone, you are pretty much signing your balls over to your "beloved" by entering a marriage agreement. She's got all the strings to pull and over time you will become whipped. Should you decide to stand up for yourself, it will always be at the risk of "sex sanctions", and if you attempt to circumvent that, then you simply transfer that risk to the hands of divorce law.
Well, first of all my advice would be to try and find a woman that likes sex as much or more than you - certainly been my angle!
That way you can sort of worry less about sex sanctions...All my own relationships and the ones of my friends are dual-income also, where the ladies are doing very well for themselves, so I don't see divorce law as being a sword on a string in my own life - but I can see what you're saying.
Relationships are hard, and like I said marriage is sort of an arbitrary state of being; you feel the same for the person as you did the day before you got married as the day after, but in the eyes of the law and the state it's a totally different situation. And thus when you 'break up,' the ramifications are certainly more serious, almost needlessly so. And if you have kids, well...
It sucks, the best any of us can do is hope that we're with the right person. Personally I should have married this girl I dated through college, but that was my mistake and hey, life is still worth living. And that's really all I'm saying; if you're going to commit to life with someone, just make sure that they love you for who you are, rather than who you may have shaped yourself to be for their benefit.
PS - Is this an outsized representation of the UK men here on the 'whipped' side of the coin?
But yes yes, back on topic. Viva, Viva Pinata!