Last of Us [PS4]

There's a big difference between animated pedestrians in a GTA game and a fully developed main character. The way a character moves isn't just the combined sum of his physical attributes. Unless we somehow manage to take a character's mind into the simulatio as well, procedural animations based on a bunch of rudimentary physical rules (or even complex physical rules) is not going to replace traditional animation.
Heck, I like the physics animations in R* games as well, but it's always painfully obvious when the "canned" animations end and Digital Natural Motion (I believe that's what it's called, right?) kicks in, especially with the player character.
 
Agreed. I was just saying natual motion's euphoria has its moments of glory too. The animation/physics system that I really find awkward at the moment is EA sport's one. That is still a couple of years of interation from really looking convincing to me.
 
Depending on what Shifty mean by behavioral physics, I don't think pure physics driven animation alone will work too. Say if they adopt the framework for The Last Guardian, the griffon's animation will have lots of nuances just because it's a wild animal.
 
It's funny how I've typed up numerous times on how a new Resident Evil today should be.

I remember talking about how it would be more of a survival game and less of a survival-horror or action title. I talked about focusing away from clunky controls and more on limited item management. And bringing it all together with some really great enemy A.I. for good measurement

Lo and behold instead of Resident Evil 6 following up on this idea, we get The Last of Us!

Seriously I never thought Naughty Dog would do this kind of game, especially something like this after Uncharted.
 
The best death animations wer ein KZ2. They were a mix of hit-detection reactions and mocap death animations. They blended superbly and looked chillingly real and fascinating ! That game was just surreal in that dept.
 
Indeed ! That KZ2 "Ballet of Death" trailer is permanently etched into my mind now. ^_^
Looking back at the 2005 Killzone 2 "in-game or faked" debate, Sony has come a long, long way.
 
Sigfried1977 said:
Unless we somehow manage to take a character's mind into the simulatio as well...
Click to expand...
That's what does happen, hence why it's called 'behavioural physics'! ;) The organism has a movement desire, such as to try to find its balance when hit, or to protect itself in a fall, and then reacts accordingly to its environment within the limits of its physical abilities. ND are clearly using that with their perceptually aware animation system, but to only select from a few canned options won't produce as smooth or realistic results as an ideal physical simulation of a person. eg. A punch on a man could send him stumbling backwards into a table where his hand might reach out to stabilise himself. There are quite a few ways that could happen. Prerecording them all and then selecting one is a lot of work, and then it won't fit quite right in a lot of cases, like Drake's hand passing through objects as he reaches out to them because his hand extends as far as the canned animation rather than as far as the object.

The Holy Grail of procedural animation would be completely open physical play, where any object could be wielded and swung, thrown, stacked, etc., rather than current random limits - you can hit enemies with a bottle or fish, but not with a chair or cantaloupe. I'm not expecting that this gen, but I'd like to understand why it's not happening. At the beginning of this gen we were led by some to believe procedural animation would be ubiquitous.
 
But what you are describing is still pretty much pure physicality. When I said mind, I was thinking more about a characters attitude or mood at specific moments for example. For example, a proud character doesn't move the same way a shy character would, even given the exact same body type while persuing the exact same goal.
 
Okay. I'm not expecting total behavioural physics - only certain interactions with the world which need to be more flexible than any form of canned animation. The day-to-day animation can be character specific, and the faces can be motion captured like LA Noire/Quantic Dreams.
 
Ah, okay. That said, I'm pretty sure the (overdone) touching animations in U3 aren't canned. Certainly not 100% canned at least. Whatever drives them just isn't sophisticated enough. The IK chain would have to extend all the way to the finger tips, but it seems like it ends at the palm in U3. The subtlety just isn't quite there.
 
Sigfried1977 said:
The IK chain would have to extend all the way to the finger tips, but it seems like it ends at the palm in U3. The subtlety just isn't quite there.
Click to expand...

What it seems like that indie game "datura" is doing - I haven't played but saw some interesting concept videos showing the hadn animation. Now the player character IS the hands, someday maybe, developers will have the luxury to adopt that kind of stuff in a fully animated character like drake, on an environment as expansive as an uncharted level. The current uncharted games probably don't even have detailed enough colision models for a finger-tip-level kind of animation to do much good.
 
Yeah, when you think about it games still have so much room for growth in all directions. People talk about the next gen being the last generation of consoles all the time, but I'm not so sure. I can see consoles lasting another 50 years easily, but I'm sure we'll see various stages of convergence and de-convergence happening during that time.
 
Even when games hit a level of diminishing returns in terms of processing power for better visuals, there will still be a lot of room for simulation of physics, behavior, animation etc. There was a lot promised this gen in terms of interactive worlds, but as always the processing power was mostly used to push pixels.
 
It should go beyond simulation.

If they take it in the LBP direction, then Last of Us should have user created contents, or ahem... product placements.

If they want to have a breakthrough in the game making craft, then the workflow and client platforms should be flexible and powerful enough to accept quick changes/editing. Changing story flow should be easy.

There are also natural interfaces, integration with Internet, AR, better 3D, and so much more !

EDIT:
To me, what's most interesting about The Last of Us is not the game, it's the workflow and run-time. How easy is it for NaughtyDog to transfer/share their knowledge and tech to say.... Team Ico to "redo" The Last Guardian. It's the closest thing to their final vision of a realistic catbird. I still don't know how they can make a game where the AI catbird can sustain your interest for 8 hours. May be shorten it to 2 hours like a movie, and charge $20 for a start ?
 
off topic: I always watch PS3 exclusives as a fan; but what I really would like for one day is watch it like the haters. To feel what they feel when they see it. Most of them will probably go the "not realtime!" route, or trying to look for things that could be better, even if no other game before it has attempted it.

For me it's natural to see console defying graphics because I believe that what PS3 is all about. K2 showed it in 2007 at E3, and from there on there has been a big distinction between exclusive games, and UE3 derived games, at least to me as a PS3 gamer. Last of US is no different, sure it beats other games in a lot of areas, plus it does things with the lighting that have never been attempted in realtime or in other games to my knowledge, but in the end, it's just another PS3 exclusive. We get the best voice acting, animation, production values, gameplay, and everything that is part of a game.
But it's still a PS3 game. :)
So while I am really exited for playing this AAA masterpiece early next year, playing AAA masterpieces is the only thing I do on my PS3. Well that and 1080P blu-ray goodness on the 60 inch.

ontopic / short version: It's looking good. Looking really good :cool:
 
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