Geforce FX Bilinear Anisotropic Filtering Question ??

[Tagrineth]

Looks odd to me that in the AF test comparison, the Radeon (as expected) pulls inward at the 45º angle... while the GF4, while keeping most angles uniform, spikes at exactly 45º...

 

[Crusher]

ahhhh no...

Both sliders below move to the right and increase quality...the top one has to be moved to Application (left) for quality

IT'S NOT A SLIDER FOR QUALITY

Do you see the title above it? Does it say Quality? No. How is this so difficult to understand?

Do you have problems going between your stove and your refrigerator, because the dials both turn the same way going from low to high, yet one makes things colder and the other makes them hotter?

And before you reply, we all saw your point a long time ago. I know you view this as a trick to get people to lower the quality when they think they're raising it, just because they'd blindly move the slider to the right assuming it increased the anisotropic quality. You think it's all part of some diabolical master plan to trick their customers into thinking they're getting good stuff just because it's faster. However, only complete idiots who can't read where it says "PERFORMANCE" would make such assumptions, and such people probably aren't capable of finding the control panel to begin with, let alone know what anisotropic filtering is, let alone what to do with settings for it.

 

[Doomtrooper]

Yes it does control quality read the thread before posting, it affects alot of things doesn't it..look at the different MODES..STFU.

 

[Crusher]

Yes it does control quality read the thread before posting, it affects alot of things doesn't it..look at the different MODES..STFU.

I never said it didn't *affect* the quality, I said it's not titled "quality". The title of the slider is "Performance", and sliding it to the right should increase the PERFORMANCE. The fact that it does this by decreasing the quality doesn't change the fact that it's still a PERFORMANCE setting, and that moving it to the right increases the PERFORMANCE, which is PERFECTLY LOGICAL.

You, on the other hand, are trying to argue that moving a PERFORMANCE slider to the right should increase the QUALITY, which makes absolutely no sense. I know what the modes do, I've seen the picture, and I can read. Perhaps you're the one who should STFU and go back to school until you learn that PERFORMANCE is not a synonym for QUALITY, and that increasing one can, and typcially does, decrease the other.

 

[Doomtrooper]

Come back when you have a arguement, you have none Crusher...don't ruin another thread.
Makes no sense why the slider must be moved 'left' and set to application to get BEST IMAGE QUALITY..poor wording...confusing...while the other two sliders move right for BEST Quality

Look at the title of the thread, examing the NV30's AF, its not a defend the slider rant..go away.

 

[ninelven]

Why not just own up to the fact that that was some dumb sh*t.... right up there with suing the fast food industry cause you got fat eating thier products.

Ninelven

 

[Crusher]

Come back when you have a arguement, you have none Crusher...don't ruin another thread.
Makes no sense why the slider must be moved 'left' and set to application to get BEST IMAGE QUALITY..poor wording...confusing...while the other two sliders move right for BEST Quality

Look at the title of the thread, examing the NV30's AF, its not a defend the slider rant..go away.

It's not an "attack the slider rant" either, so what exactly are you doing here? I don't need an argument because it's right there in black and white. Here, I'll blow it up for you so you can see it easier:

See? PERFORMANCE. It's a setting for PERFORMANCE. Moving the slider to the right increases PERFORMANCE. The only one who is confused by it is YOU.

 

[Doomtrooper]

I don't need the blown up pic crusher...yes its labelled but why does the slider have to be placed on 'Application' vs a proper label i.e High Quality ?? And why would they invert the slider so left means High Quality filtering and Lower Filtering means right..when below its right for High Quality on the other two sliders.

Look at Anandtechs ARTICLE...he states:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=1779&p=4

The Performance - Balanced/Aggressive slider at the top controls the anisotropic filtering quality/performance settings. The Balanced setting offers higher image quality while the Aggressive setting offers greater performance.

They are not even aware that APPLICATION is the highest setting...probably from POOR LABELLING

 

[ninelven]

You're right.... apparently not even the huge pic showing the label of "PERFORMANCE" can help you.... give me a freaking break.
Maybe, just maybe nvidia was counting on thier consumers ability to read... I guess that could be a little far fetched.

Since when does increasing performance (fps) mean increasing picture quality?

 

[Doomtrooper]

Read the Anand Article and count how many 'Application modes were tested'.. then come back.

Performance = Low Quality on ATI sliders..opposite here..look at the filtering pattern of 'application'

 

[Doomtrooper]

 

[Crusher]

So you're saying ATI's drivers have conditioned you to the point that you can't comprehend a slider which is named "performance", and where moving it to the right, which is the natural, logical motion for increasing the value (which as we've already stated is "performance"), does in fact increase the performance? I pity you.

Performance = Low Quality on ATI sliders..opposite here

It is NOT the opposite here, HIGHER PERFORMANCE = LOWER QUALITY IN BOTH DRIVERS. The only difference is the direction you move the slider to raise performance. But, oh look, ATI DIDN'T LABEL THEIR SLIDER "PERFORMANCE".

Do you somehow think it would be less confusing to have a slider named "Performance" that decreased performance as you moved it to the right?

 

[Doomtrooper]

No the labelling is wrong, so wrong that NO online reviewers tested APPLICATION..even Anand states only 2 vs 3 settings....

Application is

1) The highest setting for texture filtering.
2) The closest to current Geforce 4 modes in quality.



Is that so hard to understand

 

[ninelven]

The Performance - Balanced/Aggressive slider at the top controls the anisotropic filtering quality/performance settings. The Balanced setting offers higher image quality while the Aggressive setting offers greater performance.

And how does that not mean balanced > agressive (quality wise)?
I'm pretty sure Anand understood what nvidia is indicating with thier use of the english language. I don't think there is any distinguishable paradigm for driver interfaces.....

Clarification: Application (highest quality/lowest perf.) - Balanced (good quality/better perf.) - Aggressive (lowest quality/best performace). I am pretty sure Anand didn't test Application because its not adaptive and nvidia stated balanced should be compared to quality ATI which would seem logical so that is what he did...

Anymore cheap shots on this forum, and I'll make sure your ass is gone for good...

Believe it or not, my joy comes from reading these forums not posting on them.

 

[Doomtrooper]

Thats nice...maybe after three pages..certain individuals will realise there is three modes...and the third was never used in reviews.

That is what this whole thread is about the 'mystery' application mode.

 

[Crusher]

[quote="Doomtrooper"Application is

1) The highest setting for texture filtering.
2) The closest to current Geforce 4 modes in quality.



Is that so hard to understand [/quote]

No, it's not, and nobody ever claimed it was. In fact, it's quite logical, since it's the left-most setting on the PERFORMANCE slider, and as we've already established, lower performance stems from higher quality in this context. It makes perfect sense, unlike you, who claimed multiple times, that the slider labeled "PERFORMANCE" was incorrectly increasing performance if you moved it to the right, when it should have been increasing quality instead. Now that it's been pointed out to you, however, you seem to be trying to change your argument, which isn't really suprising.

In fact, you sound a lot like David Kirk trying to cover his ass now that the FX hasn't proved to be the outright fastest card on the market. Yet I'm sure you'll be right here, flaming him to no end and smiling gleefully while you do it, taking no notice whatsoever of your hypocracy. Why? Because he's NVIDIA-kin, and therefore spawned from Satan himself, existing only to corrupt and destroy the world with his horrifically misleading, under-performing video cards.

 

[BRiT]

Are we sure in the NV30 control panel that "Application" really means High Quality, and doesn't refer to "Application Preference"? ie: The drivers do not force anything, and merely do what the application/program requests.

As for the direction of turning things, I feel Nvidia botched their UI. In the control panel, there are 3 different sliders. To increase Image Quality, you move 2 of the 3 sliders to the right, while you move 1 of 3 to the left. That right there is counter-intuitive. It is a perfect example of a completly non user-friendly interface.

 

[ninelven]

I am not sure if application does leave the level of AF to the program or not, but am fairly certain it isn't adaptive which would yield the worst performance results for any given level of AF in comparison to balanced and aggressive. Thus, the slider is accurately labeled with regards to performance (and should yield higher quality iff the AF used >= than that selected).

 

[Doomtrooper]

Crusher..

I stated from the begginning...

The Sliders below the Peformance/Balanced i.e Ansisotropic and AA move to the Right for increased IQ

I then Stated they should have lablelled the Peformance/Balanced from left to right... Aggressive---->Performance (quality)....so it matches what the other two sliders are doing (increasing IQ)

I then stated they didn't even test this mode...

Enough of this...

 

[Doomtrooper]

I am not sure if application does leave the level of AF to the program or not, but am fairly certain it isn't adaptive which would yield the worst performance results for any given level of AF in comparison to balanced and aggressive. Thus, the slider is accurately labeled with regards to performance (and should yield higher quality iff the AF used >= than that selected).

We are exploring what exactly Application mode does, hence the title of the thread before it was hijacked, I don't really care about performance since Anands tests show inferior image quality with balanced enabled, it should be tested.