Formula 1 - 2017 Season

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Dave Baumann, Nov 28, 2016.

  1. Bludd

    Bludd Experiencing A Significant Gravitas Shortfall
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    Funny, It Worked Last Time...
    Ah, the joys of people discussing one's joke :-?
     
  2. Tahir2

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    I suspect there will still be a clause written-in on a veto that would stipulate a Ferrari win for every race.
    Anyway it is very far-fetched Bernie would launch a new series due to a number of factors but if Libery Media threaten to spoil the status quo on revenue given to the top teams you could see the likes of Mercedes-Benz and even Red Bull pull out of the F1 World Championship. Toto Wolff has already indicated he will be ready to go back to the Financial Services market in a couple of years, this may just be grandstanding or it may be that he has had enough of the success of F1 (and the stress that no doubt comes with it) and wants to move on.
    What would Ferrari do in a situation like this? Probably demand an even higher fee to remain in F1. I believe the contracts are up for renewal in 2020 with Renault being the exception.
     
  3. Tahir2

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  4. pharma

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  5. Chris Lux

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    From the front and the back nice looking. From the side... the wheels look like taken from a Matchbox car.
     
  6. vjPiedPiper

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    Strange that Merc have gone for the much smaller "fin" behind the driver. most/all of the other cars shown so far have had much bigger "fins"
    Also it might be just me, but it looks like the sweep of their front wing isn't as aggressive as some of the others
     
  7. tongue_of_colicab

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    RBR is rumored to not have the shark fin either. Anyway Merc might have another body kit with shark fin that they just haven't shown yet. Personally I don't think it looks very good so as far as I'm concerned all teams can get rid of it.
     
  8. pharma

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    I think it is smaller compared with the Renault fin.
    [​IMG]


    Alonso's baby!

    [​IMG]
     
    #88 pharma, Feb 24, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
  9. Bludd

    Bludd Experiencing A Significant Gravitas Shortfall
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    Funny, It Worked Last Time...
  10. tongue_of_colicab

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    No surprises there. That car/engine has been unreliable and slow since the start. For this season Honda made big changes to the engine so wonder things went from bad to worse.
     
  11. Kaotik

    Kaotik Drunk Member
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    So, tests are done, looking good for Kimi (excluding total laps maybe) & Ferrari (including total laps)

    Fastest times per tyre type:
    Overall fastest times:
    Driver lap counts (those marked with * only drove during 1 test week)
    Team lap counts
     
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  12. Bludd

    Bludd Experiencing A Significant Gravitas Shortfall
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    :(

    How can Honda make an engine which doesn't work in a racing car? Don't they have test benches? :( :( :(
     
  13. Lightman

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    Exactly! You would think severe engine vibrations would be picked up by test bench and not only discovered after fitting engine into F1 chassis. Now I'm starting to understand why it took Honda over 10 years to finish designing new NSX ...
     
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  14. Bludd

    Bludd Experiencing A Significant Gravitas Shortfall
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    Alonso should buy a truck load of duct tape and present it to Hasegawa-san.
     
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  15. tongue_of_colicab

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    F1 and Japan just doesn't go well together.

    F1 is all about leadership, thinking fast, making decisions fast, taking responsibility and skilled individuals speaking their mind.

    If the past 5 years I've spent in this country are anything to go by that is exactly what the Japanese are not good at.

    They can't make decisions because they are scared of making the wrong decision because someone always has to be blamed (Japanese love finger pointing). That means leadership is weak and whatever gets decided is usually half assed.

    The guys and girls on the floor are usually plenty smart but they are thought from a young age to do as they are told so they never speak there mind whenever a manager comes up with some half-assed plan again.

    I'm sure something like that must be happening. I cannot believe Honda engineers don't know how to make a engine that is fast or at least reliable. The Honda is neither so something must be fundamentally wrong. McLaren had the Merc engine so if any Honda should have had a good example to work off.

    Yet they went ahead with their own appearantly rather strange engine layout. That was slow and unreliable. Now they copied Merc but somehow made it even more reliable. Who knows about speed.

    They just haven't been making any real improvements. Renault started off bad but they have continuously getting better. Something must be wrong at Honda and I don't believe it's all down to the engineers.
     
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  16. cjo

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    I saw a report linked somewhere that suggested (by a Honda engineer) the problem is that they never stop developing new features to work on making the ones they have reliable. It's always "how can we go faster".
     
  17. tongue_of_colicab

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    Ah yes that doesn't sound unfamiliar either. Except in the process of ''how can we go faster'' or ''how can we improve'' they forget often forget that if the basics aint there or aren't right whatever you are going to build on top of that probably isn't going to work that well either. But that all boils down to not wanting to make or admit mistakes again so they simply have the silent hope that by ignoring what what went wrong, or what is wrong, building on top of that somehow makes the problem go away.

    Obviously in most cases it won't and things will just go from bad to worse.

    Anyway in other news; Force India now has the best livery on the grid and its pink!

    http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/350566/force-india-presents-pink-livery-for-2017/

    Looks sweet if you ask me. They just need to add a hello kitty face somewhere. It's too bad Renault didn't stick to their all yellow car and that Mclaren didn't go for an all orange car. IMO this year's cars have way to much black on them.
     
  18. Dave Baumann

    Dave Baumann Gamerscore Wh...
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    Be careful. The initial design was actually imposed on them by McLaren wanting a "size zero" rear end, that forced them into a both a V angle and compressor layout that was different from the Merc (and others followed last year).

    Now it appears that Honda have said that's a dead end and McLaren need to compromise on aero for engine performance and they have gone with a layout that is closer to the better engines. But in some senses they are starting from scratch again.

    Sky Sports is hearing that the frequent stoppages were as a result of vibrations from the engine continually upsetting the electronics in the car.
     
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  19. Bludd

    Bludd Experiencing A Significant Gravitas Shortfall
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    But it shows a serious lack of integration between Honda and McLaren. Mercedes has shown how important such integration between chassis and engine is.
     
  20. tongue_of_colicab

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    All the teams are fully aware of that. That's exactly why for example RBR is so keen on getting in bed with an engine manufacturer.

    Even if McLaren imposed the size zero concept on Honda, they still did a terrible job. McLaren had the Merc engine so they should have had a good idea if it's packaging and performance. It shouldn't have been that hard to correlate the numbers that Honda was getting on the dyno with the Merc and what the effect of the tighter packaging towards the back would have brought in aero efficiency.

    Ferrari did the same, sacrificing engine performance thinking they could make up for it with better aero. Only difference is they didn't had a Merc engine to copy from.

    That's what I don't get. Surely Honda should have had fairly good idea of Merc engine performance. Then they should have known that their engine wasn't going to be anywhere near as powerful. If they gave that data to McLaren, I can't imagine they would have said being 50 or 100 HP down was okay because of better aero.
     
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