fafalada --- your opinion of APEX (Xbox racer)

Ug Lee said:
Hoo boy those movies are nice. Graphically this game looks to be the goods, but I'm more concerned about how the cars handle as well as the amount of tracks available in the game. Also from what I've seen in those movies it looks like Apex won't be offering any real-time damage, which is a shame but not a critical omission.

It does have realtime damage, in one of the videos a bumper is dragging and emitting sparks. As for tracks, from what I've read there are going to be a bunch with multiple mountain, racetrack, city, and stadium tracks. Looking at the website, there seem to be at least 20 tracks. For each environment there is USA, Europe, and Japan with at least three different tracks from each of those except for maybe the stadium tracks.

Roadster City<---Video showing the realtime damage


edit-just checked the game info on the site and it says "54 enormous tracks"
 
Dural said:
It does have realtime damage, in one of the videos a bumper is dragging and emitting sparks.

it will have realtime damage, but with zero consequence on gameplay.
 
54 tracks! Wow, I might just get this game.

It looks really good for a racer, and I haven't bought a racing game in such a long time. I think I'm ready for my next racing fix. 2k3 will be the year of the racing games!
 
I believe the new F-Zero is 60 fps.

cybamerc:
F-Zero will most likely be 60 fps for the simple reason that it's an arcade title.
Well... I wouldn't generalize it to just arcade titles, since quite a few arcade showings in recent times have run at 30 fps from some of the smaller arcade devs/publishers out there - some of the Konami dance/rhythm games, some Jaleco racers and Midway shooters I think, and more. However, it's a safe assumption to believe it's 60 fps because it's a SEGA arcade title - they've pretty much all been 60 fps for going on nine years now, since around 1994 and their Model 1 board (outside of 18 Wheeler American Pro Trucker.)
 
60 FPS is really a must for a fast racer in my opinion. It's nice to have a pretty picture, but that doesn't compensate for the rush I get from the smooth, fast motion. I can't even imagine how jerky F-Zero would look at those speeds if it's 30FPS (but I'm pretty sure it's not)
 
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:eek:
 
PC-Engine said:
I think everyone knows who's the stupid one around here. Go play SSBM and come back to me when you've been enlightened. ;)

The hell? SSBM has one graphic feature option, flicker filter on or off. It has ZERO impact on performance... it's just a matter of personal preference. I normally have it ON when in interlaced and OFF when in progressive (well duh, that's the whole point!). It's not like Flicker Filter ON results in halved FPS. :\ SSBM is 60fps at all times, I have yet to see any slowdown in it whatsoever.
 
The point I was trying to make and obviously failed somewhat was that a console game can also have graphical features turned on/off and isn't mutually inclusive to only PC games.
 
PC-Engine said:
The point I was trying to make and obviously failed somewhat was that a console game can also have graphical features turned on/off and isn't mutually inclusive to only PC games.

Yeah, but you were suggesting FSAA on at 30fps vs. off at 60fps. That's a bit more significant than flicker filter on/off.
 
Tagrineth said:
PC-Engine said:
The point I was trying to make and obviously failed somewhat was that a console game can also have graphical features turned on/off and isn't mutually inclusive to only PC games.

Yeah, but you were suggesting FSAA on at 30fps vs. off at 60fps. That's a bit more significant than flicker filter on/off.

That depends on the application though. Enabling FSAA does take a performance hit depending on the application.
 
I took a look at the website and from what I've read this game specs aren't something that can't be easily done on the GC.

The tracks consist of 500,000 polygons and cars 11,000, now if my calculations are correct. 500,000 polygons at 30fps brings that total on screen to 15mps plus an additional 330,000 from the cars.

The over all total becomes 15,330,000 polygons persecond.
 
I no the datasets for the Xbox will be larger, but in the end theres nothing that point to it being impossible. What I want to know is how much memory does 500k polygons take up before textures are added.
 
SSBM is 60fps at all times, I have yet to see any slowdown in it whatsoever.

Try turning off all items but Pokeballs, and then constantly pick them up and throw them on the ground (in a 4 player match). I'm sure you'll notice slowdown. BTW, this is the only time I have ever seen slowdown, and every other time, even with constant action on the scree, it runs very smoothly.


The tracks consist of 500,000 polygons and cars 11,000, now if my calculations are correct. 500,000 polygons at 30fps brings that total on screen to 15mps plus an additional 330,000 from the cars.

The over all total becomes 15,330,000 polygons persecond.

Let's make this a little more reasonable.
500,000 polygons on the track... we will probably see no more than 30% of the track (unless it's a really short track)

500,000 * .3 = 150,000

If we have 10 cars (unless this is daytona/nascar racing, we won't have to worry about 30 cars) that makes at the max...

11,000 * 10 = 110,000

110,000 + 150,000 = 260,000

260,000 * 30 = 7,800,000

Well within Nintendo's conservative estimate for the GC. Please understand that this would be the theoretical max if you only see 30% of the entire track, and you have 10 cars on the screen, and they don't have some sort of "not rendering what's not seen" algorithm going on. If they had that kind of algorithm, I'd have to say that only 75% of each car model would be shown at once, making the number from 11,000 to 8,250 and 110,000 to 82,500 and 7.8 million to 6.975 million. I'm assuming they are not doing this so I'd estimate 7.8 million polys per second.

Now if we look into bump mapping, fill rate, and other statistics, we might find something the GC might not handle well, but given the numbers, I'm pretty certain that the GC could handle the poly count.
 
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