So if someone wants to play FIFA and FIFA has DRM, they should go play some shooter instead? What should all those SimCity fans be playing instead of SimCity? Mass Effect? No DRM on that...
Entitled gamers, corrupt press and greedy publishers
- Thread starter patsu
- Start date
FreeCiv? Sim City 4. Any other world building game?
I've been playing the old Tomb Raider games lately. It's interesting actually having to play games again, instead of moving forward and pressing a button to win.
You may feel any generally similar title is an equivalent alternative, but plenty of people won't. Free Civ is a turn-based civ game based on Civilisation, and not a city simulator like Sim City. Sim City 4 has already been played by the Sim City fans who want something new and improved. If you're a Sim City fan who's been playing SimCity 4 since 2004 and want to play a new Sim City, there's no alternative except to suck up the DRM. If you're a Harry Potter fan and the books come with DRM, you've no choice but to suck it up or not read; no other book is a suitable substitute. If you're a Star Wars fan and SW: Battlefronts 3 releases on PS4 with always on DRM, you'll probably suck it up - certainly most people will. You're not going to go buy "Warzone", a Battlefronts clone set in the Second World War, even if gameplay is identical, and typically alternative games don't have the same gameplay. Tekken fans aren't going to boycott Tekken with DRM and go play DOA instead, despite it being a fighter. Nor are they going to play Animal Crossing or Halo instead. Diablo fans certainly didn't refuse to buy Diablo 3 and bought Guildwars 2 instead; it's no substitute.
General gamers, like general movie goers, can pick at the full range of games and be satisfied, but that's not appropriate at all for a lot of people who play games with specific tastes.
FreeCiv is graphically a joke with horrible AI and SimCity 4 doesn't support multi-gpu or multi-monitor and can be a bear to get working on any post XP machine. Cities XL has a memory leak and lacks ajustable camera angles (as does SC4) but is pretty decent if you exit and relaunch regularly to prevent memory leak from killing it. So about 1/2 an option.
That is how every market works. You can not get exactly what you want. Say I like swedish yoghurt (fil). I want the fil to be natural fat and organic. There is no producer that I know that makes this. I have to choose between natural fat OR organic. Why should gamers get EXACTLY what they want when it is not the case for any other market?
I think the analogies are wearing thin and wrong regardless. My point isn't that there aren't choices - that's a grey area since I can always buy a gameboy and play mario and that's technically a "game" right? - the point is, and I'm speaking not of opinions but facts - people like myself who pay for everything. but are pretty hardcore business travelers *will* pirate good games if they cannot play them when and where they want.
Many forms of phone home are tolerable, but always connected takes a reasonably significant demographic - particularly in terms of purchasing power - and tells them to fuck off and go play mario since it's a game too. Bad business to tell your customers such things.
Defend it all you want, but you only give your subjective opinion.
Since you obviously aren't logging >100,000 transoceanic miles per year coupled with being willing to spend a small fortune on software and hardware, you don't speak for the demographic I'm talking about. And to tell me that I should simply play some old crap game that I probably already played and that this is acceptable is just plain stupid. This isn't yogurt. But if you like that analogy I don't want to buy the yogurt I bought ten years ago today.
What if you couldn't run the next version of Office without an internet connection?
What if you couldn't watch a movie on your iPad without an internet connection?
Many forms of phone home are tolerable, but always connected takes a reasonably significant demographic - particularly in terms of purchasing power - and tells them to fuck off and go play mario since it's a game too. Bad business to tell your customers such things.
Defend it all you want, but you only give your subjective opinion.
Since you obviously aren't logging >100,000 transoceanic miles per year coupled with being willing to spend a small fortune on software and hardware, you don't speak for the demographic I'm talking about. And to tell me that I should simply play some old crap game that I probably already played and that this is acceptable is just plain stupid. This isn't yogurt. But if you like that analogy I don't want to buy the yogurt I bought ten years ago today.
What if you couldn't run the next version of Office without an internet connection?
What if you couldn't watch a movie on your iPad without an internet connection?
Who's saying that? The choice is the game you want with DRM or the game you don't really want without DRM. Most folk will choose the former. You were saying though that people can choose not to buy into DRM because they can play something else.
Running with your example, let's say the product SwedYog is organic, natural fat yoghurt. Mmmm, delicious! There's also Icecream which you don't like, Frozen Custard which you don't like, and Condensed Milk which you're allergic to. You buy SwedYog at $1 a tub and enjoy it. Then the manufacturer says you can only buy from them and they control when you can eat it with some crazy DRM system. If someone says to you, "just eat Icecream or Frozen Custard instead," do you nod and change buying habits? Or either grumble and give up the yoghurt and eat none of the options, or grumble and accept the DRM?
Well he did say... "That's only true in a fair market with suitable competition and/or consumer education", and that's probably the 2 biggest issues. You either have no suitable competition, or you actually do but no one really knows about them (aside from those who're actively willing to search for alternatives).
But that's sadly how most businesses work, and manage to succeed. How do you know about those other games? Because you're someone who actually stays on the lookout on gaming sites and forums for information on games. Don't get me wrong, these are PC-only titles so most users who play these are somewhat knowledgeable about PC gaming. However some people have never even known about SimCity 4 or Civ 5 prior to the current game, and may have paid money on it without knowing about the always-online restriction.
As Shifty said, most people will put up with whatever screwed-up issues affects the product until it's fix. Will you have people who will demand a refund online? Yes you will, but most people won't care until it just starts working properly for them. But hey, that's just the result mass consumer ignorance and further conditioning the user-base that games are a service.
I might buy/use another product (LibreOffice, Google docs, Android table) then. I would probably lose some features in available in the above products, but that might be acceptable to me.
I think we have a very competitive market and if people want alternatives they are out there. If people can look up torrents on shady sites they can look up alternative games.
Yes, is there a problem with this?
Suppose you only have one hand. You wouldn't be able to play most games produced today either. Would you also demand that all games should be made to be able to play one-handed?
I would of course buy Yoghurt from some other manufacturer. What is the problem?
Properly implemented online-DRM will make it extremely difficult to pirate the game. Has anyone managed to pirate Diablo 3 yet?
No, other than I'm saying most people will choose to put up with unwanted DRM because they alternatives aren't good for them
Way to go ignoring the rules of the rhetorical scenario. What if there are no other Yoghurt manufacturers? That's how it is for a number of games people like. There's no other manufacturer of SimCity yoghurt. Ergo it's daft to expect consumers of SimCity yoghurt to go and eat FreeCity custard or Call of Duty meat paste. Your mantra of, "stop playing games with DRM and go play something else," means for these people, "stop playing the thing you like playing and make a stand against a policy you don't have strong feelings over." Not many would be behind you on that, I reckon. But if they had an alternative, if there really was a FreeCity that was just like SimCity but without DRM, then they'd be more willing to make a change.
It's most likely just a question of time before there is "private" servers, just like WOW had. Unless there already is.
However Diablo 3 managed to piss down the backs of many Blizzard players, essentially making them more likely to avoid blizzard games where they can. And just like Simcity 5 Blizzard used a semi weak excuse on why the always on thing was needed, in this case because they wanted to milk even more money from their players with the real money auction house. I know at least one that just doesn't believe in Blizzard any more.
The positive thing there is to say about Blizzard is they have a history (Diablo 2 11+ years) of keeping their games alive for a very long time. Even when a new game in the series is out, but it still doesn't give us eternity like other games. I just bought Waverace and Pilot wings used for the N64, a grand total of 5 euro (plus shipping) for 2 games that are over 20 years old. The other games will be lost like tears in the rain, and all because of pure greed (profit optimization)
LOL. Spoken like someone who doesn't have to collaborate. Are you a student? Business person?
Also spoken like someone who would rather argue their position than think.
OMG, you are argumentative for the sake of arguing without any need for logic whatsoever.
The tactic of taking an argument comparison to the ridiculous just further demonstrates no need on your part to think or to do anything other than desperately defend your original position.
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