Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2020]

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They both have their own priorities. Its not a matter of cerny or ms having better or worse engineers
Sony had gaming as first priority while MS had 2 goals when they designed the XSX: gaming and data center. I remember when we talked about that back then some of us expressed concerns about that because XB1 was also designed with a dual purpose (TV + gaming). Well we were probably right.

The thing that’s interesting for us as we roll forward, is we’re actually designing our next-gen silicon in such a way that it works great for playing games in the cloud, and also works very well for machine learning and other non-entertainment workloads. As a company like Microsoft, we can dual-purpose the silicon that we’re putting in.

https://twinfinite.net/2018/12/phil-spencer-buy-ea-next-gen/
 
He might but don't you think MS does that too. They do complete SOC game performance simulations since the X1X project according to them which they gave as the reasoning for the great X1X performance. Obviously they applied the same to the XSX design.

In addition to their profiling tools you mention, Microsoft is a 3rd-party developer for the PS5 via Mojang. Would Sony have specifically kept details of the new hardware and dev kits from Mojang to try and obscure any competitive advantage from MS as a whole? If what we are hearing about developers getting PS5 hardware in late 2019, that would precede even the original announcement trailer for the XSX.

Just wondering what the timeline is relating to to when MS had hands-on with the PS5 hardware, in relation to their initial\continued marketing blitz of being "the worlds most powerful console." Point being, that these early DF results probably wouldn't have been a surprise for MS, yet they still doubled down on those marketing claims.
 
In addition to their profiling tools you mention, Microsoft is a 3rd-party developer for the PS5 via Mojang. Would Sony have specifically kept details of the new hardware and dev kits from Mojang to try and obscure any competitive advantage from MS as a whole?

Who knows when Mojang got devkits.
Devtools could have and most probably have been updated several times after release of the devkits.
Also MS has the world most powerful console if you look at the TF numbers.

But a monster truck has more bhp than a Tesla, but outside jumping and crushing cars or driving in an offroad environment, I think Tesla wins in other car aspects.
So as it has been discussed across this board, its the complete package that gives the correct picture, not just one off stat.
With that said, I think things are so close, that most people will not notice when playing and it will most likely stay like this for at least the first half of this gen.
Most likely closer to then end we will start seeing they diverge more, but again probably not enough for most people to notice. Which to me is the key, the boxes performance envelope is so close that its the games and other services which again will decide about the outcome.
But I also do believe, Sony and MS have their own success criterias and they do not match the avg console warriors success or win criteria.
 
BIG NAVI!! Delayed a touch owing to the next-gen console deluge, here's the Digital Foundry verdict on the RX 6800 XT and the RX 6800. Priced below 3080 and above 3070 respectively, AMD's pricing pretty much falls into line with rasterisation performance. There's some innovative engineering here, and full support for next-gen features including VRS and ray tracing... but just how well do the new AMD cards straddle the generational divide?

 
at luanch ps5 will just run ps4 pro versions and xsx will run xox version, nextgen console update early 2021

CDPR have said that there will be a day one patch that will have the game running better visually on nextgen consoles. The full monty patch, probably with ray tracing and other cool stuff, is what is coming at some unspecified point in the future.
 
CDPR have said that there will be a day one patch that will have the game running better visually on nextgen consoles. The full monty patch, probably with ray tracing and other cool stuff, is what is coming at some unspecified point in the future.
are you sure ? couse there was ps5 and xsx trailers confirmed to running ps4 pro and xox versions if I'm not wrong
 
are you sure ? couse there was ps5 and xsx trailers confirmed to running ps4 pro and xox versions if I'm not wrong
Yes, here is the Eurogamer article. There are two patches for nextgen. A day one patch next week (NEXT WEEK!!! :runaway:) will will deliver better visuals, which as BRiT says is likely just going to push out a few graphics settings - higher resolution, frame rate and probably draw distances (i.e. things that are easy settings changes) and a full on nextgen patch coming sometime in the future, 2021-2022. They're also bringing full-on nextgen patches for Witcher 3.
 
This is great. AMD did big progress but lag behind Nvidia but at least there is hope and it means if they continue to improve as fast as they have done from RDNA to RDNA 2 competition will be better on GPU PC market.
They definitely made good progress, but like we all suspected their RT performance is lacking.

If RDNA3 can improve RT a huge amount, whilst having a reasonable general performance uptick, RDNA3 could be when they are truly competing at every level. I'm assuming they'll have their ML upscaling ready by then also.

The fact that consoles also have low RT performance means that engines will be built that scales well though.
 
The fact that consoles also have low RT performance means that engines will be built that scales well though.
To me that is the most exciting thing out of all of this. Consoles will get lower quality RT, but at least the common denominator will be to have RT in some shape or form. And that is very good news.

I just hope the trend will not be to have a choice of RT or 60fps in next gen consoles, as that can be a tough decision!
 
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They definitely made good progress, but like we all suspected their RT performance is lacking.

If RDNA3 can improve RT a huge amount, whilst having a reasonable general performance uptick, RDNA3 could be when they are truly competing at every level. I'm assuming they'll have their ML upscaling ready by then also.

The fact that consoles also have low RT performance means that engines will be built that scales well though.

Didn't some news recently said that the amd upscaling solution was not based on ML ?

And for the RT part, some devs say that DXR is holding things back, so maybe consoles will do better than RDNA2 (PC) for a while...
 
Didn't some news recently said that the amd upscaling solution was not based on ML ?

And for the RT part, some devs say that DXR is holding things back, so maybe consoles will do better than RDNA2 (PC) for a while...
Isn't XSX using DXR?
 
Didn't some news recently said that the amd upscaling solution was not based on ML ?
Don't know, it will be interesting if they can come up with a non ML solution that competes in the same field. Just upscaling and sharpening probably won't be enough.
And for the RT part, some devs say that DXR is holding things back, so maybe consoles will do better than RDNA2 (PC) for a while...
It's still early days especially for DXR1.1 or whatever the DX12U update is.
It's what PC, XBSX|S use so they'll have to learn to make the best of it if they are having issues, or depending on the issues hope DXR api is updated to help.
But DXR isn't going anywere and Nvidia cards will out perform consoles in RT using DXR. (so no consoles won't do better than PC that's using DXR)
 
That's why I said rdna2 pc versions, not nvidia gpus.
Sorry, you did say that.

But xbox uses DXR also.
So in your point, guess that leaves PS5.

I'll be pleasantly surprised if we see a demonstrable big difference for PS5 compared to RDNA2 DXR on PC. Especially after early gen 1 launch titles
 
Judging by that game I would say the RT performance is pretty close, so it is a weird omission of DF to leave that out. Not saying it is a conspiracy or something
Watch Dogs legion is broken on RX/AMD hardware. It does not render many reflections that it should - that is why we do not test it.

That inevitably skews the performance comparison as AMD hardware is not rendering many reflection that the NV cards are.
 
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