Business ramifications of piracy *spawn

[Gitaroo]

I think Sony is just putting up a show for their 3rd party partners so it looks like they are actually doing something this time around after how things turn out for PSP. Doesn't matter if they win or lose at the end. They have to calm down all the investors and partners somehow. And theres also this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_prime

 

[Boxercide]

You can never say for certain what will happen, but this should be thrown out by the latest rulings.

 

[Brad Grenz]

I'm sorry, what was the profit motive for the jailbreak again?
I figured they go after copyright for the keys.

The creators of the original Jailbreak were selling it on USB devices for like $80. They were trying to rake in cash as quickly as they could before a free version hit the net.

 

[JardeL]

their obtaining and transmission of SCEA’s proprietary information (including but not limited to digital signature keys) also violates the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act (“CFAA”), 18 U.S.C. § 1030 et seq.

This is what I was talking about.

 

[RenegadeRocks]

http://n4g.com/news/678589/sony-suing-geohot-fail0verflow-others-over-ps3-hacking

Sony suiing everyone Failoverflow and everyone else too.

Update UPDATE- Charges include

18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(2)(C) – Confidential Information On Computer

18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(4) – Intent To Defraud And Obtain Value

18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(5)(A) – Knowing Transmission of Code

18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(5)(B) and (C) – Intentional and Reckless Damage And Loss

18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(6)(A) – Trafficking in Password

18 U.S.C. § 1030(a)(7)(B) – Intent to Extort

Does it mean, if they stay away from US its safe for them. Are these charges serious enough to demand extradition?

 

[RobertR1]

Perfect! Flood gates will open hard and fast. Hacking community is going to go all out against Sony now.

 

[Zaphod]

Does it mean, if they stay away from US its safe for them. Are these charges serious enough to demand extradition?

There are no "charges" as such, Sony is only seeking an injunction as of now.

Even if they were actually being sued (i.e. for damages), there would be no risk of extradition as it would be a civil suit.

Sony is (luckily) in no position to bring criminal charges by themselves, but the US (or whatever) is of course free to do so after investigating (either following a report by Sony or on their own initiative) whether or not they believe a crime has occurred.

 

[baten]

Perfect! Flood gates will open hard and fast. Hacking community is going to go all out against Sony now.

That was a bad move for Sony.
I have just read the "proposed order" and it's full only of wishful thinking from the part of Sony.
Their thinking seems to be: we cannot stop you, but we can make miserable your life and the lives of people like you.

UPDATE
After being served the legal papers, Geohot first removed the content from his site - but it seems that the content is now back online and the rumor is that he's been offered free legal support from some very good lawyers.

 

[-tkf-]

I guess the key is the key...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RealNetworks,_Inc._v._DVD_Copy_Control_Association,_Inc.

In particular, the court found that the removal of crucial CSS technology in DVD drive-locking, secure storage of content keys on DVD, CSS authentication and CSS bus encryption during the playback of copied DVD content from the hard dive is a circumvention of CSS, even though they are not needed when playback from the hard drive [6]. The court further explained that even though RealNetworks is a licensee of CSS technology, it does not shield RealNetworks from DMCA claim because the removal of CSS technology is a violation of DMCA [1].

 

[baten]

I liked the formulation "irreparable damage" in the text of the injunction.
If it's irreparable then why sue?

 

[-tkf-]

I liked the formulation "irreparable damage" in the text of the injunction.
If it's irreparable then why sue?

To open up the posibilty of screwing up their life for good? with a civil and maybe even criminal lawsuit.

 

[baten]

To open up the posibilty of screwing up their life for good? with a civil and maybe even criminal lawsuit.

But the cat is out of the bag.
It's hard for me to understand why - when you are in deep sh*t up to your neck, you feel the need to make waves around you.

What this lawsuit is doing is puting the romance/danger back into the whole hacking practice. It had become so boring lately, with hackers helding conferences and make powerpoint presentation and everything. Now we're back in the good old Kevin Mitnick days.

 

[BadTB25]

To open up the posibilty of screwing up their life for good? with a civil and maybe even criminal lawsuit.

Sony may feel the backlash (even more than they already have) of the hacker community. It's odd that the people that were sued are actually actively trying not to enable hacking with their CFW.

Others will pick up on the work already accomplished and will probably release their CFW/Homebrew a bit more anonymously from this point on.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Latest [strike]legal and[/strike] ethical episode moved here.
Edit: Scrub that, the legal battle is business talk. I extracted the moral outrage elements into the ethical debate.

 

[-tkf-]

Sony may feel the backlash (even more than they already have) of the hacker community. It's odd that the people that were sued are actually actively trying not to enable hacking with their CFW.

Others will pick up on the work already accomplished and will probably release their CFW/Homebrew a bit more anonymously from this point on.

More backlash? they are completely screwed on the security part, there is no more backlash to come.
Anger from those that can´t install homebrew? those amounts are so small they don´t count, anger from those that just bought a PS3 to play pirate games?
Nah..

 

[BadTB25]

More backlash? they are completely screwed on the security part, there is no more backlash to come.
Anger from those that can´t install homebrew? those amounts are so small they don´t count, anger from those that just bought a PS3 to play pirate games?
Nah..

Wasn't the removal of Linux the motivation for Geohot and fail0verflow to crack the PS3 in the first place? They have appeared to have taken some effort to ensure that what they have released hasn't made it easy to pirate games, the backlash could be that they release all of the exploits that they have held back on. Now that Sony has sued them, what's to stop them from releasing all of the keys and methods to obtain the keys if nothing else than to say "screw you" for the lawsuit.

These guys are pretty smart, I'm sure they can find ways to release everything either anonymously or through another group.

 

[obonicus]

I think Sony is just putting up a show for their 3rd party partners

Possibly for their shareholders as well. They need to make a show of protecting their own IP.

 

[Cyan]

http://n4g.com/news/678589/sony-suing-geohot-fail0verflow-others-over-ps3-hacking

Sony suiing everyone Failoverflow and everyone else too.


Does it mean, if they stay away from US its safe for them. Are these charges serious enough to demand extradition?

As far as I know, all the guys are from different countries and backgrounds.

Geohot is american, and I remember reading that Marcan (fail0verflow) is spaniard. He is also the guy who hacked Kinect. During the press conference when they showed how they managed to hack the PS3 you could see him and other guys who seemed to have a dutch or german accent. There were other two guys who I couldn't discern where they are from judging from the accent alone, but perhaps they aren't american.

I think Sony should try to fix and patch the exploit and avoid legal battles.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I think Sony should try to fix and patch the exploit and avoid legal battles.

Legal battles are part of the busniess solutions to problems of competition and perceived unfair threats to business operations. Clearly Sony's legal gurus think they have more to work with here than the other console and phone hacks that haven't been successfully prosecuted, otherwise they surely wouldn't bother because they haven't a leg to stand on as there's so much precedent supporting the rights of consumers to open up access to run software not intended by the hardware manufacturer on said hardware.

Also fixing and patching the exploit, if at all possible, generally only delays future hacks. A successful prosecution would be a warning to future hackers that they may think what they are doing is above board, but they may be liable. Of course that won't stop hacking, but would you sit back, do nothing, and say, "well we can't stop them, and we can't win, so we'll do nothing at all, not even pursue the moral victory of getting a couple of them prosecuted"?

Edit: As for nationalities, Sony has arms in every market and can bring about proceedings as needed; no need for extradition.

 

[Zaphod]

A successful prosecution would be a warning to future hackers that they may think what they are doing is above board, but they may be liable.

Well, the current court case is far from a prosecution. More like a plea for an injunction against the genie demanding he get back in the bottle, a seizure of all materials conjured up due to wishes granted while he was out, and a restraining order against everyone involved barring them from doing anything even remotely resembling any action described in One Thousand and One Nights.