Long term future of console gaming, its last days *spawn

Silent_Buddha said:
While currently a game that is streamed is built on X consumer platform (console or PC), that wouldn't necessarily be the case in some future where streaming gain an equal or dominant share of the gaming market.
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Microsoft have some really good virtualisation tech in Hyper-V and if streaming PC games really takes off you can see them making a variant designed for a new generation of server architecture to run a cut-down WinDirectX environment which is just designed to host games. They are 95% of the way there already - you just need a hardware schema that allows hooking these up to accompanying racked-graphics cards. If just wouldn't make sense to have remote PCs in the way they are designed now.
 
iroboto said:
No. Local hardware won’t leave until cloud reaches parity in terms of latency performance.
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I personally got the same feeling, but then again, when people can play CoD on their phones, while others swear to k+m or it is a no go. I would think that latency requirements also can be diluted.
 
Shifty Geezer said:
I'm not clear on what your saying though. You talk about APIs and PC where they aren't the same thing, and you haven't mentioned any order of events. We all agree consoles will one day disappear. We agree all computing will likely go to the cloud. Where does 'PC' fit in with that? What does it even matter? Even if Windows PCs are around, people who used to game on consoles who now game on thin-client HDMI sticks plugged in the back of their TV will be using cloud builds.

I don't think at any point I've disagreed with what you've said. I just really understand what your argument is and am pointing out some particulars to the probable future. ;)
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I think it matters.

-Build one central build using the same codebase (PC/Server)
-Less platforms to support
-Ability to deploy everywhere
-Perpetually high potential user base for your game (no "generations" starting from zero)

Of course it also matters to console/PC owners who don't want that cloud future, who want to game natively on local hardware.

I know people are saying "but they'll just deploy on server, and your PC would just be a client streaming the game as well"... but I disagree... because the way they target everyone, is to ALSO deploy that native PC version, that runs on local hardware. And that ties back into what I said about consoles becoming generic pre-build PCs by Sony and MS.

You have a large group of people, who will resist cloud gaming, or simply live in areas which don't have the infrastructure for it... and thus you still serve that market by deploying the native PC build.

Dev releases game
-Streaming via the Cloud (Mobile, PC, Consoles, TVs, Tablets)
-Natively on PC (PC, Consoles, Laptops, Portables)

That way, they hit literally every device possible, and serve both the native and streaming markets.. with only having to build around one central codebase.

There are a large number of people who like the console form-factor, low price point, comfy couch, aspect of console gaming and don't want a traditional PC... and Sony/MS releasing a small form-factor generic PC "console", would do all of that. So all the markets would essentially be served well. From the person who only wants their phone and streaming, all the way up to the person who has a $5000 rig and wants to buy their game full price and play natively.

And like I said... with the PC.. you have entire industries which have a vested interest in designing/creating/selling hardware and components. Consoles have been drifting ever closer to being PCs anyway... this is the next logical step IMO.
 
Consoles are clinging to just gaming. PC platforms are invested in so much more than that. The steam deck is a pure gaming device, however thats also a different market positioning in the hand-held sector, but still encompassing pc gaming (on the go).
 
Remij said:
... and Sony/MS releasing a small form-factor generic PC "console", would do all of that. So all the markets would essentially be served well.
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Nintendo and Sony releasing a generic PC removes the whole point of owning a platform. A generic PC will be just a PC running PC code, PC digital shops which makes Sony and Nintendo redundant and destroys the whole point of profiting from digital content/software/royalties and accessories. Consoles have the benefit that they are designed with efficiency and having a common specification to target on. A generic PC will be less performant for the given specs too. They will want a perfect economic substitute and a generic PC isnt one.
 
Nesh said:
Nintendo and Sony releasing a generic PC removes the whole point of owning a platform. A generic PC will be just a PC running PC code, PC digital shops which makes Sony and Nintendo redundant and destroys the whole point of profiting from digital content/software/royalties and accessories. Consoles have the benefit that they are designed with efficiency and having a common specification to target on. A generic PC will be less performant for the given specs too. They will want a perfect economic substitute and a generic PC isnt one.
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Publishers are going to move on whether Sony and Nintendo and Microsoft like it or not... When cloud streaming takes off... it's every man for themselves. Sony and MS either have their own cloud service for their own games + 3rd party games... or they don't. Which is why you have MS buying up developers like crazy, and Sony starting to buy more and get more into live services.. It's because they know that eventually... they're going to have to rely on themselves more than anything else. The BIG 3rd party developers will have their own streaming platforms, and stream everywhere.

MS knows this... which is why they're trying to get out ahead of the competition and build up a stable of developers to have a constant stream of games releasing. If a 3rd party publisher has the ability to stream their game anywhere, what leverage does Sony or MS have? It comes down to their own games.

I've already said I think Sony/MS will still release "a gaming box"... with their own controller and accessories... but it will be a generic PC.. running PC code. There will be no sense in R&D'ing consoles and taking all the risks building up a user base from nothing anymore. Not when you're already building your games for the PC platform anyway.

What you're saying about it being less performant than a custom built console is meaningless... it will be plenty performant. They can also then release new upgraded boxes periodically as well.
 
Remij said:
Publishers are going to move on whether Sony and Nintendo and Microsoft like it or not... When cloud streaming takes off... it's every man for themselves. Sony and MS either have their own cloud service for their own games + 3rd party games... or they don't. Which is why you have MS buying up developers like crazy, and Sony starting to buy more and get more into live services.. It's because they know that eventually... they're going to have to rely on themselves more than anything else. The BIG 3rd party developers will have their own streaming platforms, and stream everywhere.

MS knows this... which is why they're trying to get out ahead of the competition and build up a stable of developers to have a constant stream of games releasing. If a 3rd party publisher has the ability to stream their game anywhere, what leverage does Sony or MS have? It comes down to their own games.
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Thats a whole different story
Remij said:
I've already said I think Sony/MS will still release "a gaming box"... with their own controller and accessories... but it will be a generic PC.. running PC code. There will be no sense in R&D'ing consoles and taking all the risks building up a user base from nothing anymore. Not when you're already building your games for the PC platform anyway.

What you're saying about it being less performant than a custom built console is meaningless... it will be plenty performant. They can also then release new upgraded boxes periodically as well.
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And this still makes no much business sense
 
Nesh said:
Thats a whole different story

And this still makes no much business sense
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I disagree. It ties into directly where the market is going. MS is literally pushing the industry in this direction, because they haven't been able to compete with Sony in the traditional console market.

We'll see whether I'm right or not ;)
 
Remij said:
I disagree. It ties into directly where the market is going. MS is literally pushing the industry in this direction, because they haven't been able to compete with Sony in the traditional console market.

We'll see whether I'm right or not ;)
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The market is going somewhere but your suggestion that a generic PC will be a solution for Sony is where I disagree.
 
BRiT said:
Then why else is Sony making more branded PC hardware?
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You mean Inzone? This looks nothing more than brand devices intended to appeal to gamers for things they already make, i.e. screens and headphones.
 
Its like saying why have a Playstation business if they are making Sony branded TVs, or Camera sensors or Sony branded Mobile phones or whatever else they are making.
 
BRiT said:
Then why else is Sony making more branded PC hardware?
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Sony got out the PC business years ago. If they are planning on ditching production of PS consoles to sell PC hardware, they'll need to start...um...actually making PCs to sell before then. ;)

There's a sane argument for Sony exiting console hardware and selling software, but arguing Sony's current actions point towards them migrating to a PC hardware provider is just arbitrary waffling for argument's sake. From Sony's position, they'll keep making and selling PS consoles as long as they can bring in billions a year from it. PS will die when the consumer moves on, which'll mean at least one generation, probably two, of significantly declining hardware and software sales. So long as PS's sell 100+ million units a generation, it'll remain, and nothing in Sony's positioning suggests any movements at all to abandon that trajectory.

Seriously, this argument is about long-term future. PS branded peripherals that work on PCs now isn't even the distant thunder preceding the weather front that'll introduce the depression that mingles with the hot air from the south that'll lead to creation of the storm. It's someone dropping a couple of metal trash cans sounding a bit like thunder! ;)
 
Shifty Geezer said:
Seriously, this argument is about long-term future. PS branded peripherals that work on PCs now isn't even the distant thunder preceding the weather front that'll introduce the depression that mingles with the hot air from the south that'll lead to creation of the storm. It's someone dropping a couple of metal trash cans sounding a bit like thunder! ;)
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I like that explanation lol :p
 
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