Anand has the details about r520,rv530,rv515
- Thread starter tEd
- Start date
Sorry, perhaps I should have mentioned - my source is an AIB that owes me a favour, but wishes to remain anonymous. I have no way of verifying these comments. 
Maybe this has been posted already, not sure. Found it a good read.
http://66.224.5.66/board/showthread.php?t=33829134 - link
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Posted by oozz77 in R3D
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Hopefully this may add a little more "REALITY" light to the whole saga.
Also look at what they say about the 520 performance!! Interesting!!
""" Traditionally, I don't post in this forum.
Although I have massive respect for the work that goes on with Beyond3D - I always feel that the forum is best left to enthusiasts in the general public as well as the hardcore technologists from ATI and other organisations.
However, the ‘Hardware Analysis thread’ brought up several issues that I am not about to ignore and I want to set the record straight.
Firstly, at ATI we always try to work to the highest standards of professionalism and honesty possible. We have an open relationship with all of the press across the globe and we never shy away from tough questions.
Briefings
We have invited over 100 of Europe’s top press to our R520 Tech Day which takes place at the end of September.
Even with so many places, we cannot invite everyone.
The question remains - how do we brief the press who cannot make it on the day.
From the time that our Tech Day, we will be working with the regional press that we missed to ensure that as many technical journalists as possible have access to the relevant information.
Journalists who have seen and tested the final product themselves, can then be certain of the facts, should write EXACTLY what they feel.
If they love what they see – great.
If they are not happy with what they see – also great.
All we ask for is honesty in the copy itself... that they 'write it as they see it'
Having read through enough of Dave’s reviews over the years – it is pretty clear that Beyond3D forum members have the same mind set as ATI…
JUST GIVE US THE FACTS & LEAVE THE FICTION AT THE DOOR - WE WILL MAKE OUR OWN MINDS UP THANK YOU VERY MUCH
CONCLUSION: When it comes to R520 results, you should only believe journalists who have established a reputation for being trustworthy
Not Invited
Sander has 'presented the reasons' why he was NOT on the list of 100 press for our R520 Tech Day.
However, he has conveniently left off the actual reason - which he and I have discussed at length in various emails. I am not talkning about a snatched comment - these were full blown conversations - going back and forth - that clearly detail the logic behind the decision.
Not inviting him to this Tech Day is a direct result of his response to the last invitation that I sent him
I am not going in to detail here - but it was that categorical refusal to engage that led to his being left off of this list. He knows exactly what I am talking about.
Remember, he would still have been briefed before the NDA lifted - just not at our Tech Day.
Let me say this clearly, there is no 'ATI black list for press who do not write nice stories'.
We want an open and honest press who report the facts as they see them - based on their own testing - rather than second hand gossip and fairy tales.
There are a number of reasons why any company would stop engaging with an individual - but writing honest copy is not one of them.
Honest reviews serve the vendor just as much as the customer - and anything less should be rejected.
CONCLUSION: If you choose NOT to work with a vendor - don't cry 'foul' when they decide NOT to work with you
Email conversations
As I have pointed out, honesty is crucial.
Emailing several people at ATI to explain that you are very important, that you have a series of specific demands that must be met as soon as possible and then going on to explain just how bad a job we are doing of keeping you happy is one thing.
However, including ATI's direct competition on 'cc' in such an email is another thing entirely.
To then 'jump to the moral high ground' when your 'threats' have been exposed is laughable.
CONCLUSION: Once you pick the rules of engagement - don't get upset when your true character is revealed later on
The Figures
When considering the performance of our next-generation products, you need to ask yourself one very simple question:
"Would ATI seriously bring 100 of Europe’s top press to a Technology Day where they can run whatever benchmarks they choose if we thought that we were going to lose?"
Sander claims that these numbers were given to him by a trusted source.
The numbers shown do not match any pattern that we have for our next generation products.
CONCLUSION: Either Sander lied - or his 'trusted source' set him up to look stupid on a global stage for printing made up results
Edits
Intelligent readers also need to be aware that the first version of the story he posted seemed to accuse every site who attends the ATI Tech Day of a fundamental inability to be independent in their testing and copy.
Needless to say that I am sure several sites have 'web-wacked' that original version and will be considering taking action to defend their names.
CONCLUSION: If you are going to accuse the largest independent publications in Europe of being bent - make sure you have enough money in the bank to retain good council
Logic
The whole thing has clearly been engineered - to what purpose no one can say for certain.
Maybe he is trying to force ATI to offer an invitation to Tech Day... which is not going to succeed as we refuse to be strong-armed.
Perhaps it was a simple tantrum at not being taken seriously... when, in fact, that was not the case at all.
Cynical people might say that it was to generate hits... but we cannot be sure of that either.
Whether it was one of these reasons - or a completely different twist of logic - one thing is for certain - it has certainly acted as an appetiser for ATI's next generation launch... and for that I have to say 'Thanks Sander !'
Having corrected several of the 'inaccuracies', I am not going to say any more on the subject because the real strength of the Beyond3D forums is their focus on technology.
How open are we going to be with our Tech Day ?
Simple, in addition to the top news & reviews sites, we have also invited one of the largest nVidia fan sites in the world to come along, get briefed and benchmark R520 however they choose - along with the best of them.
The world's top press will have hands-on our latest products in less than two weeks and you can all decide then if you prefer facts or fiction.
Thank you for taking the time to read this
Kind regards,
Andrzej Bania
ATI Technologies """
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http://66.224.5.66/board/showthread.php?t=33829134 - link
------
Posted by oozz77 in R3D
------
Hopefully this may add a little more "REALITY" light to the whole saga.
Also look at what they say about the 520 performance!! Interesting!!
""" Traditionally, I don't post in this forum.
Although I have massive respect for the work that goes on with Beyond3D - I always feel that the forum is best left to enthusiasts in the general public as well as the hardcore technologists from ATI and other organisations.
However, the ‘Hardware Analysis thread’ brought up several issues that I am not about to ignore and I want to set the record straight.
Firstly, at ATI we always try to work to the highest standards of professionalism and honesty possible. We have an open relationship with all of the press across the globe and we never shy away from tough questions.
Briefings
We have invited over 100 of Europe’s top press to our R520 Tech Day which takes place at the end of September.
Even with so many places, we cannot invite everyone.
The question remains - how do we brief the press who cannot make it on the day.
From the time that our Tech Day, we will be working with the regional press that we missed to ensure that as many technical journalists as possible have access to the relevant information.
Journalists who have seen and tested the final product themselves, can then be certain of the facts, should write EXACTLY what they feel.
If they love what they see – great.
If they are not happy with what they see – also great.
All we ask for is honesty in the copy itself... that they 'write it as they see it'
Having read through enough of Dave’s reviews over the years – it is pretty clear that Beyond3D forum members have the same mind set as ATI…
JUST GIVE US THE FACTS & LEAVE THE FICTION AT THE DOOR - WE WILL MAKE OUR OWN MINDS UP THANK YOU VERY MUCH
CONCLUSION: When it comes to R520 results, you should only believe journalists who have established a reputation for being trustworthy
Not Invited
Sander has 'presented the reasons' why he was NOT on the list of 100 press for our R520 Tech Day.
However, he has conveniently left off the actual reason - which he and I have discussed at length in various emails. I am not talkning about a snatched comment - these were full blown conversations - going back and forth - that clearly detail the logic behind the decision.
Not inviting him to this Tech Day is a direct result of his response to the last invitation that I sent him
I am not going in to detail here - but it was that categorical refusal to engage that led to his being left off of this list. He knows exactly what I am talking about.
Remember, he would still have been briefed before the NDA lifted - just not at our Tech Day.
Let me say this clearly, there is no 'ATI black list for press who do not write nice stories'.
We want an open and honest press who report the facts as they see them - based on their own testing - rather than second hand gossip and fairy tales.
There are a number of reasons why any company would stop engaging with an individual - but writing honest copy is not one of them.
Honest reviews serve the vendor just as much as the customer - and anything less should be rejected.
CONCLUSION: If you choose NOT to work with a vendor - don't cry 'foul' when they decide NOT to work with you
Email conversations
As I have pointed out, honesty is crucial.
Emailing several people at ATI to explain that you are very important, that you have a series of specific demands that must be met as soon as possible and then going on to explain just how bad a job we are doing of keeping you happy is one thing.
However, including ATI's direct competition on 'cc' in such an email is another thing entirely.
To then 'jump to the moral high ground' when your 'threats' have been exposed is laughable.
CONCLUSION: Once you pick the rules of engagement - don't get upset when your true character is revealed later on
The Figures
When considering the performance of our next-generation products, you need to ask yourself one very simple question:
"Would ATI seriously bring 100 of Europe’s top press to a Technology Day where they can run whatever benchmarks they choose if we thought that we were going to lose?"
Sander claims that these numbers were given to him by a trusted source.
The numbers shown do not match any pattern that we have for our next generation products.
CONCLUSION: Either Sander lied - or his 'trusted source' set him up to look stupid on a global stage for printing made up results
Edits
Intelligent readers also need to be aware that the first version of the story he posted seemed to accuse every site who attends the ATI Tech Day of a fundamental inability to be independent in their testing and copy.
Needless to say that I am sure several sites have 'web-wacked' that original version and will be considering taking action to defend their names.
CONCLUSION: If you are going to accuse the largest independent publications in Europe of being bent - make sure you have enough money in the bank to retain good council
Logic
The whole thing has clearly been engineered - to what purpose no one can say for certain.
Maybe he is trying to force ATI to offer an invitation to Tech Day... which is not going to succeed as we refuse to be strong-armed.
Perhaps it was a simple tantrum at not being taken seriously... when, in fact, that was not the case at all.
Cynical people might say that it was to generate hits... but we cannot be sure of that either.
Whether it was one of these reasons - or a completely different twist of logic - one thing is for certain - it has certainly acted as an appetiser for ATI's next generation launch... and for that I have to say 'Thanks Sander !'
Having corrected several of the 'inaccuracies', I am not going to say any more on the subject because the real strength of the Beyond3D forums is their focus on technology.
How open are we going to be with our Tech Day ?
Simple, in addition to the top news & reviews sites, we have also invited one of the largest nVidia fan sites in the world to come along, get briefed and benchmark R520 however they choose - along with the best of them.
The world's top press will have hands-on our latest products in less than two weeks and you can all decide then if you prefer facts or fiction.
Thank you for taking the time to read this
Kind regards,
Andrzej Bania
ATI Technologies """
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Karma Police
Regular
I personally think that Sander didn't lie per-se, but was just given misinformation; an X1800XL instead of an XT. That would explain the Doom3 differences compared to an overclocked X850XT, and also why the AIB would have a working card.
Anyway, I'm glad the storm is back in the teacup.
Anyway, I'm glad the storm is back in the teacup.
