[360] Forza Motorsport 3
- Thread starter Arwin
- Start date
Correct. Almost everyone noticed that. It's a result of fixing an issue where in FM2 the cars would spin out far too easily under some circumstances. I think now they've decided to err on the side of accessible rather than err on the side of near impossible to drive ...
We will see how all the cars feel (I have played a lot of sims where spinning out isn't super easy) as well as how that decision holds up when racing other AI cars / online. One thing I did notice is that while you slide out less often you do bleed a lot of speed if you don't take a good line.
I would be interested what a professional, or someone who has raced a specific car a lot at high speeds (Phil?), could relate how it compares. Comparing one sim to another sim to another sim doesn't relate much.
I would guess that it is much like graphics: finding a sweet spot of compromises. You could have an exceptional physics mode for tires and aerodynamics but impact and shocks may be off which may make the end result less than the sum of the parts. Ditto some racers seem to do really well hotlapping with no other cars but the second you add a variable (racing along non-optimal lines, contact, going slightly off road, etc) the experience changes a lot.
One thing I have seen in FM3 is it is a looooot more forgiving for giong off course (no radical slowdown or spin outs) but since the game really rewards driving well losing a second or two is huuuuuge. Ditto oversteering. It isn't a guarantee spinout (while still quite possible!! it isn;t like that part of the game is gone) you eat up speed like there is no tomorrow. FM2 had these elements but "losing traction" from contact or a bad corner (oversteer to compensate for coming in too hot e.g.) felt like you were fighting to "get off the ice" so to speak. FM3 seems to have a bigger range between "losing speed" and "losing traction."
How realistic that is I don't know because I cap off at 65mph in real life
I would be interested what a professional, or someone who has raced a specific car a lot at high speeds (Phil?), could relate how it compares. Comparing one sim to another sim to another sim doesn't relate much.
I would guess that it is much like graphics: finding a sweet spot of compromises. You could have an exceptional physics mode for tires and aerodynamics but impact and shocks may be off which may make the end result less than the sum of the parts. Ditto some racers seem to do really well hotlapping with no other cars but the second you add a variable (racing along non-optimal lines, contact, going slightly off road, etc) the experience changes a lot.
One thing I have seen in FM3 is it is a looooot more forgiving for giong off course (no radical slowdown or spin outs) but since the game really rewards driving well losing a second or two is huuuuuge. Ditto oversteering. It isn't a guarantee spinout (while still quite possible!! it isn;t like that part of the game is gone) you eat up speed like there is no tomorrow. FM2 had these elements but "losing traction" from contact or a bad corner (oversteer to compensate for coming in too hot e.g.) felt like you were fighting to "get off the ice" so to speak. FM3 seems to have a bigger range between "losing speed" and "losing traction."
How realistic that is I don't know because I cap off at 65mph in real life
Dude, use the assists
Manual makes better racers even faster in my experience (downshifting is great for braking late). Making them go Auto is what you should do
.(((interference)))
Veteran
We will see how all the cars feel (I have played a lot of sims where spinning out isn't super easy) as well as how that decision holds up when racing other AI cars / online. One thing I did notice is that while you slide out less often you do bleed a lot of speed if you don't take a good line.
I would be interested what a professional, or someone who has raced a specific car a lot at high speeds (Phil?), could relate how it compares. Comparing one sim to another sim to another sim doesn't relate much.
I would guess that it is much like graphics: finding a sweet spot of compromises. You could have an exceptional physics mode for tires and aerodynamics but impact and shocks may be off which may make the end result less than the sum of the parts. Ditto some racers seem to do really well hotlapping with no other cars but the second you add a variable (racing along non-optimal lines, contact, going slightly off road, etc) the experience changes a lot.
One thing I have seen in FM3 is it is a looooot more forgiving for giong off course (no radical slowdown or spin outs) but since the game really rewards driving well losing a second or two is huuuuuge. Ditto oversteering. It isn't a guarantee spinout (while still quite possible!! it isn;t like that part of the game is gone) you eat up speed like there is no tomorrow. FM2 had these elements but "losing traction" from contact or a bad corner (oversteer to compensate for coming in too hot e.g.) felt like you were fighting to "get off the ice" so to speak. FM3 seems to have a bigger range between "losing speed" and "losing traction."
How realistic that is I don't know because I cap off at 65mph in real life
As i've said before some of the sim veterans at GAF think it's due to the elevation changes in the track, because it hardly seems likely that Turn 10 would dumb down the physics just to make the game more accessible. If they did, they would be significant backlash.
Certainly in my time with the demo while I definitely noticed it was harder to induce oversteer than in F2, it certainly was still there (with TC and STM off) especially in the RWD California and GT3. I even managed to drift the Mini.
(((interference)))
Veteran
Digital Foundry has an article up on the demo:
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-tech-analysis-forza-3-demo
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-tech-analysis-forza-3-demo
The California is "easy" to oversteer for a commercial car, the GT3 is a R3 and like R3 is not made for Drift without some tweak.
FM3 correct some "problem" in FM2 grip.
And now in FM3 I'm personally more capable to estimated if I'm push more to grip limit a car or if I'm able to keep it on track.
I've seen alpha to coverage mentioned several times on DF in PS3 pieces as BW saving, which is slightly inaccurate, but more fitting this time since it's about the 360
("alpha to coverage" is generally not a low bandwidth method. Since memory granularity is usually not as fine as a single pixel, you'll still have to read-modify-write most blocks of pixels...
...unless your memory supports write masks like GDDR5, BUT: that only works if that block of memory is uncompressed, AND the bits you want to modify is a multiple of 8bits (AFAIK), unlike say a 10:10:10:2 where you might not want to overwrite the alpha bits.
A2C is much faster if alpha blending is half rate like on the RSX, which was probably done to save transistors.)
Anyway, on the 360 i believe that alpha blending is half rate for some formats because of a different BW problem, the BW between the shaders and the ROPS. So this time it's more accurate to talk about BW than usual, but it's still an oversight not to mention that it's not memory BW it's saving.
Next: Using negative LOD bias on road textures is generally less demanding than adaptive AF. It makes no sense to say that the developers choose negative LOD over AF because they had GPU time to spare, they wouldn't choose negative LOD over AF if it was BOTH uglier and more expensive. They choose negative LOD over AF even though it's uglier because it's cheaper.
An oversight.
But I do find in a lot of presentations not to texture thrash with neg bias. (32kB total for Xenos)So, so true.
The real problem comes from those without choices and need to feed their console selection e.p. We all have our reasons for the console we pick, and for me online in major genres including sim racing was a big factor for me, but in this scenario I think games on either console should be pretty pleased with the option they have. They are very similar, but at the same time very different in terms of their take on the genre and the stylistic and feature focuses. I am sure there is a lot of tit-for-tat and PD and Turn10 can learn from eachother and challenge each in the core experience (I am expecting a HUGE jump for FM4 to be honest) but this is one case where even the loser gets a AAA title.
Now I feel bad for Wii owners though ... has Nintendo ever had a real racing sim, ever? I remember getting a PS1 because of GT for that very reason.
The real problem comes from those without choices and need to feed their console selection e.p. We all have our reasons for the console we pick, and for me online in major genres including sim racing was a big factor for me, but in this scenario I think games on either console should be pretty pleased with the option they have. They are very similar, but at the same time very different in terms of their take on the genre and the stylistic and feature focuses. I am sure there is a lot of tit-for-tat and PD and Turn10 can learn from eachother and challenge each in the core experience (I am expecting a HUGE jump for FM4 to be honest) but this is one case where even the loser gets a AAA title.
Now I feel bad for Wii owners though ... has Nintendo ever had a real racing sim, ever? I remember getting a PS1 because of GT for that very reason.
ihamoitc2005
Veteran
Smoke
Is it true there is no smoke or dust for in-game crashes and sand driving?
One review says this and I wonder, if it is true, why?
I thought Xenos EDRAM lets extra smoke and even more smoke resolution.
Is this a developer mistake or unique to the engine? I know many 360 games with excellent smoke.
Is it true there is no smoke or dust for in-game crashes and sand driving?
One review says this and I wonder, if it is true, why?
I thought Xenos EDRAM lets extra smoke and even more smoke resolution.
Is this a developer mistake or unique to the engine? I know many 360 games with excellent smoke.
Does local MP have AI? I can only wish LAN had split screen + AI ... but I do want to know if local MP has AI or not.
Btw tried the Shift demo ... I am not sure what the fuss is about. For 30fps I thought PGR4 looked a lot better, and as far as a sim goes, I wasn't feeling the love at all. I like racing games, but I like my less serious racers in the GRiD/DiRT style, and my sims like GT/FM (or rFactor, etc). In terms of a middle ground I found that Toca is about as much as I can stomach. Shift just didn't appeal at all to me. Didn't feel right at all, very disconnected. FM3, on the other hand, I feel very conscious of how the wheels feel on the pavement.
Btw tried the Shift demo ... I am not sure what the fuss is about. For 30fps I thought PGR4 looked a lot better, and as far as a sim goes, I wasn't feeling the love at all. I like racing games, but I like my less serious racers in the GRiD/DiRT style, and my sims like GT/FM (or rFactor, etc). In terms of a middle ground I found that Toca is about as much as I can stomach. Shift just didn't appeal at all to me. Didn't feel right at all, very disconnected. FM3, on the other hand, I feel very conscious of how the wheels feel on the pavement.
Hmmm I thought I saw some of the lame dust in some of the videos. FM2 had some pretty poor particles (very sparse density, very uniform, don't longer long, not very interesting looking). This is one of the many things that could add a LOT of life to the world. Dynamic particles (smoke, debris, dirt, dust, confetti, trash, etc) adds a lot to the visuals. Would break up the clean look.
I hope it's not like in FM2 for slip-screen with no online.
For Shift I'm got the same feeling than you…and also preferred PGR4.
Josh,
There is AI in split screen but it might limited to 2 AI cars.
http://www.jeuxvideo.com/extraits-v...forza-motorsport-3-2-joueurs-catalunya-hd.htm
There is AI in split screen but it might limited to 2 AI cars.
http://www.jeuxvideo.com/extraits-v...forza-motorsport-3-2-joueurs-catalunya-hd.htm