This is a wealth of information I glossed over. Great link
Next Generation Hardware Speculation with a Technical Spin [2018]
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Apparently nvidia is making RTX version of their 'Real-Time Global Illumination using Precomputed Light Field Probes' paper, should be interesting.
For N-bounce GI from ping/pong shaded/light samples from frame to frame to propagate light, adds some latency but extra bounces are very important. (Basically what some voxel based lighting methods do.)
Simplified geometry for further away, simple Doom like sectors could be enough in many cases. (Perhaps a lightprobes converted to geometry.)
Simplified/baked shaders where possible. (Even Starwars demo had simplified shaders in reflections.)
Also, store shading to textures and reuse when multiple rays hit samples them. (For high quality directional information would be preferable. texture space shading could be interesting fit.)
For N-bounce GI from ping/pong shaded/light samples from frame to frame to propagate light, adds some latency but extra bounces are very important. (Basically what some voxel based lighting methods do.)
Simplified geometry for further away, simple Doom like sectors could be enough in many cases. (Perhaps a lightprobes converted to geometry.)
Simplified/baked shaders where possible. (Even Starwars demo had simplified shaders in reflections.)
beyondtest
Newcomer
I didn't know this. Apparently it even has 256MB Ram of it's own. The SoC seems to be for low powered tasks/speep?
It'd definitely be interesting if they expand on that next gen.
I wonder if it's possible to get a good and efficient design where they just use something like 11 "big" core CPU (12-1 for yields?) where the 10 cores are for the games, the last core just is for the OS.
The popular ways seem a mix of big and low power cores (mobile) or a separate ARM.
XBOne has an ARM SOC also. I think they exist to handle downloads and tasks run in sleep/rest mode only and games don't have any access to them.
The ARM chip was supposed to handle downloads in PS4 but it doesn't. I don't know what the processor actually does. Control charging over USB in sleep mode or something.
http://www.psdevwiki.com/ps4/Aeolia
http://www.psdevwiki.com/ps4/Aeolia
Tkumpathenurpahl
Veteran
I liked Shifty's idea of using an SoC. It could run apps - web browser, YouTube, Netflix etc - concurrently with the game, in order to facilitate greater user convenience i.e. quick swapping between a game and the web browser; overlaying a YouTube walkthrough in the corner of your screen whilst you game.
In the day and age of 65"+ TV's (calm down, politicos, that's not a movement for you to join/disparage,) and if the SoC was capable enough, I daresay it would be quite desirable to have the option to window off 80% of screen space for the game, and to run a few apps along the top and side: web browser, news feed, Twitch, notifications etc.
Similar to the current quick menu for the PS4 (I know there's something similar on the XBoxOne, but I've barely used it so I'm unfamiliar with its intricacies,) but leaves the main image fully exposed, just scaled down.
More importantly IMO, it would stop things that happened this generation, such as PS4 developers being given access to another half a core, resulting in a compromised UI. Or XBoxOne developers being given something similar, at the expense of the snap functionality.
If there's any truth to the PlayStation tablet, I think it'd be sensible of Sony to use some derivation of the same SoC in both devices, thereby ensuring key apps for said tablet. It just needs to be PlayStation's equivalent of Amazon's Fire tablet IMO: a cheap way of getting to network content.
In the day and age of 65"+ TV's (calm down, politicos, that's not a movement for you to join/disparage,) and if the SoC was capable enough, I daresay it would be quite desirable to have the option to window off 80% of screen space for the game, and to run a few apps along the top and side: web browser, news feed, Twitch, notifications etc.
Similar to the current quick menu for the PS4 (I know there's something similar on the XBoxOne, but I've barely used it so I'm unfamiliar with its intricacies,) but leaves the main image fully exposed, just scaled down.
More importantly IMO, it would stop things that happened this generation, such as PS4 developers being given access to another half a core, resulting in a compromised UI. Or XBoxOne developers being given something similar, at the expense of the snap functionality.
If there's any truth to the PlayStation tablet, I think it'd be sensible of Sony to use some derivation of the same SoC in both devices, thereby ensuring key apps for said tablet. It just needs to be PlayStation's equivalent of Amazon's Fire tablet IMO: a cheap way of getting to network content.
XB1 had that feature exactly. There must have been good data on how used it was, and they pulled it. But a good system would be very flexible and wouldn't need the snap-like functionality removed, as you say, even if only a tiny minority use it.
Tkumpathenurpahl
Veteran
I didn't realise - I thought it was more of a PIP approach. It's a shame that MS removed it - developing it further for the X1X would surely have been better than throwing out the baby with the bathwater?
It's the same with Kinect: they got rid, just as they had a device powerful enough to use it in conjunction with VR, which is the perfect combo IMO.
Hopefully they still like the ideas and iterate upon them next generation. It's fair enough that they'd need to streamline to a focus on games alone, considering the state they were in at the start of the generation, but as long as they don't shit the bed and try to turn gaming communist again (property is theft!) , they shouldn't start the next generation with such a terrible image.
MS always seems to have a lot of data/telemetry, the trouble is being able to correctly interpret it.
Their view was its not used a lot, not that its not used a lot because of the implementation.
It's something that they seem very bad at doing.
Leadership back then and leadership now are two completely different things.
Whereas With Balmer and previous executives, wall garden and the such, Windows was a 0 sum game. They were more interested in locking in users than trying to expand their ecosystem. Xbox Needed to find a reason to exist and they attempted to shoe horn content and TV into the console. The cost of studios and exclusives were high, do they bet on 3P being able to sell the system. They failed.
And like VR the tech is good but it’s a solution to a problem that doesn’t exist.
Regarding the Kinect, I think the data was pointing toward a consumer demand that had been extinguished by the 360's Kinect. They sold something like 25 million of them and it's in the Guiness Book of Records for being the fastest selling consumer electronics device, so there was clearly a demand, but just like the fidget spinner, one people got it, they realized they didn't really want it. If MS had Gamestop's analytics they would have known that it's one of the more traded in items of it's generation, for the least amount possible
beyondtest
Newcomer
Wasn't certain removals of the OS from OG XB also for releasing more RAM for games too?
As for AR/VR, I'm guessing MS also doesn't have near as much as an already intergrated controller like Sony. No gyroscope, accelerator and lightbar. No PS Move in their lineup from last gen where R&d was mostly done.
Then again they have the money for the development of a flat plane custom xbox for gamers with physical problems and the elite controller.
I guess they just felt like they have to calm down this gen because of the Kinect fiasco.
They are developing AR/VR in partnerships for a while now though.
As for AR/VR, I'm guessing MS also doesn't have near as much as an already intergrated controller like Sony. No gyroscope, accelerator and lightbar. No PS Move in their lineup from last gen where R&d was mostly done.
Then again they have the money for the development of a flat plane custom xbox for gamers with physical problems and the elite controller.
I guess they just felt like they have to calm down this gen because of the Kinect fiasco.
They are developing AR/VR in partnerships for a while now though.
There was no OS (Operating System) removed from the XBox One.
beyondtest
Newcomer
My bad I mean OS features.
As they optimised and scaled back, they did release CPU and GPU resources back to games. Originally, there was something like two cores and 10% of the six cores for games reserved. Then that dropped to 5%, then 0%, then one of the two cores reserved for the system was made mostly available for games that didn't use Kinect (i.e. everything).
There was also some GPU time reserved, and that got reduced over time too (think it's something like 98% for games under normal conditions now).
Also as CPU/GPU reservation was reduced, the amount of usable BW for games increased too, though not dramatically. MS actually gave the figures in one of the developer updates which got made public, but I can't remember the numbers.
Launch was rough for X1 games. It wasn't just the performance deficit of the GPU, the reservations were high and the DX11 based driver was not yet optimised. I don't see MS making the same mistakes with whatever comes next. I don't see Sony making mistakes like these either.
They both have two generations of complex console OSes under their belt now. The only justification for screwed up next-gen OS would be incompetence (that is, we wouldn't expect it but it can happen).
At this point in time, those can't be issues for MS. They will no longer leave windows 10 (across all of MS).
Their drivers are mature, there is no DX13 coming. DXR is out now, Direct ML out in spring of next year. K/M support will be this month. High frame rate support up to 120fps is out now. Freesync is now. All the things they need in place, will be or are in place before launch.
The same could apply for Sony, but I'm not as familiar with them or their desires.
I was thinking Sony wouldn't have any interest in 120 Hz as it's not a realistic TV standard, but then I remembered they already support it for PSVR! I guess they'll go with whatever realistic TV standards are expected. If they had any corporate sense, they'd make TVs with the best gaming features like Freesync and HFR and have a value advantage.
Edit: KB/M is already supported in games. There are vids on playing Fortnite on PS4 with KB/M, which therefore implies all UE games can support KB/M. Overall expect Sony and MS to be pretty feature comparable.
Edit: KB/M is already supported in games. There are vids on playing Fortnite on PS4 with KB/M, which therefore implies all UE games can support KB/M. Overall expect Sony and MS to be pretty feature comparable.
When will that hit for Nintendo?
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