Nintendo's next gen strategy for home & mobile

can powervr scale like kelper ?

It can scale as much as Nintendo's console is capable of handling at the cost that it expects to sell at.

PowerVR has had scalable GPUs since 1999 that could go up to 32 GPUs...using standard DRAM. Of course nobody ever made a home console or arcade machine that had 32 GPUs running in parallel. NAOMI 2 only used two PowerVR GPUs in early 2000 but the results were fantastic. I doubt Nintendo's next console will have more than a few GPU cores if they want to price it competitively.
 
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i think iwata wanted to share the same hardware architecture on both home and handheld console so that they can released different versions of the same game which will significantly ease up developement time on the developers end and will help to avoid the software drought after the launch.
Although not an original vision, one has to question its value in this day and age when they could run the game on some OS layer? With only two hardware configurations to worry about, they won't have the sort of compatibility nightmares as supporting a wide range of differing devices. If they go the hardware-compatible route, they'll be tying their home console to limited mobile performance and difficult cross-platform development. That'd mean more of the same IMO - Nintendo hardware for Nintendo software, no-one else releasing on the platform, and the box hampered in performance relative to what many gamers want.

Hardware synergy would IMO be more beneficial for a docked hardware design - the game will run distributed across available hardware, so when you plug your Kepler tablet into your Kepler base unit, it expands the experience seamlessly.
 
x86 has tons of legacy garbage in its ISA, and it's inherently less efficient because of that and because of fewer GPRs and so on. Why go with x86 when it quite literally has zero advantages to ARM and other ISAs and a number of drawbacks?

Yes, that was the predominant argument some 6 years ago.

Except that now the smallest x86 cores are ~100M transistors big. That's about 100x more transistors than the Intel 486 so the proportion of die space dedicated to what you call "legacy garbage" is probably a lot less than 1% of each CPU core.

And the CPU cores tend to occupy less and less die space in a SoC lately, especially in mobile SoCs.

I guess their efforts could be about survival for AMD and Intel some years ago, but now the performance/watt and efficiency is balanced.
Plus, not one but two new-generation consoles are happily carrying the "legacy garbage" you spoke of, and they're considered the most balanced and efficient consoles we've ever had.
 
Although not an original vision, one has to question its value in this day and age when they could run the game on some OS layer? With only two hardware configurations to worry about, they won't have the sort of compatibility nightmares as supporting a wide range of differing devices. If they go the hardware-compatible route, they'll be tying their home console to limited mobile performance and difficult cross-platform development. That'd mean more of the same IMO - Nintendo hardware for Nintendo software, no-one else releasing on the platform, and the box hampered in performance relative to what many gamers want.

Hardware synergy would IMO be more beneficial for a docked hardware design - the game will run distributed across available hardware, so when you plug your Kepler tablet into your Kepler base unit, it expands the experience seamlessly.

if one os for different hardware is nintendo's vision then they have to keep the features same across their products . Like if they bring 4ds with 2 screens , then for compatibility they have to include a wii u gamepad in wiiu2. Or they may go to single screen only handheld.
 
if one os for different hardware is nintendo's vision then they have to keep the features same across their products . Like if they bring 4ds with 2 screens , then for compatibility they have to include a wii u gamepad in wiiu2. Or they may go to single screen only handheld.
It's the same issue if they want hardware cross-compatibility though. If the are choosing hardware to drive both mobile and home consoles because they want uniform codebases, then they'll have to worry about hardware feature being common, or compatible, across both. If the handheld and home-console aren't going to be running the same games then it doesn't matter if they are based on the same hardware or not..
 
In the meantime, it is worth noting that Nintendo is beefing up its research and development budget, and that Mr. Iwata promises to surprise game players in the future. While there are plenty of unknowns, Nintendo isn’t saying game over to consoles just yet.
http://blogs.wsj.com/japanrealtime/2014/01/20/nintendos-woes-dont-mean-game-over-for-its-consoles/

Research and development is apparently getting some heavy support, with the Nintendo No.1 saying that the company is strengthening both the existing "development structure" as well as "new research and development activities." Will that entail Nintendo's next console, heavy-duty improvements to the existing Wii U or just a new fitness dongle? We don't know and Nintendo isn't giving us much for our imagination to run on just yet, but it sounds like the company's planning for a brighter fiscal future. Now, let the flights of wild fancy begin.
http://www.engadget.com/2014/01/17/nintendo-increases-rd-spending/

Iwata confirmed that the company is boosting the budget of its R&D sector, meaning that there’s an outside chance that a new console from Nintendo will happen sooner rather than later. One thing is for sure: the next console Nintendo creates must be a great departure from the Wii U, and a palette cleanser that justifies Nintendo’s long-standing commitment to its own devices.
http://gigaom.com/2014/01/20/nintendo-has-sobered-up-on-consoles-but-is-still-gun-shy-on-mobile/
 
I'd be willing to bet this means they're just going to re-re-re-release some very, very old games (pre-gamecube) in iOS and Android.
 
Mr. Iwata promises to surprise game players in the future.
N. have no trouble surprising game players. They have trouble appealing to them...

R&D only gets you so far. The tablet idea could have worked, but it was lousy execution, with ongoing lousy execution in software development and 3rd party relations, not to mention an uncompetitive price. R&D ain't gonna help with such issues.
 
Spending more without changing their ways is just going to do that: more money spent , higher operational expenses.
They nneed a massive re- org, spending more is not a way to address problems. Not to mention R&D is more a mid/long term effort, I would.not expect benefits soon.
If I were an investors I would be adverse to the news. They lose money already, no salvation in sight be it in the home or.handheld console realm, and they are to spend more without any structural changes in the company or re-org, bad news.
 
Yap. I'd be much more confident for Nintendo if they announced a drastic change of hardware development policies than just pouring more money on R&D.


If they maintain their line of reasoning, we'll probably see a Wii U successor in 2016 that is as big as an OUYA and consumes just 5W from the wall.
And then it's significantly more expensive than the xbone/ps4, requires lots of coding hours to develop multiplatform ports, its peripherals look like Fisher Price toys and ends up slower/barely-any-faster than a PS4.
And no one wants it. Again.


I couldn't care less for a home console that consumes 2W at the cost of underperforming at everything else.
For all I know, they don't even need to spend more money on R&D. Just go for off-the-shelf PC/notebook chips, design a motherboard to slap them together and call it a day.
 
Yeah, I would not invest into custom hardware design if I ran Nintendo. There's no point and you can leverage so much by going off the shelf especially in terms of development tools and developer's already existing experience.

I think price point is very important however. For mobile, I think their next handheld should be priced around $150 (they can probably offer an XL model for more, but the entry price shouldn't be much more). I would try to go with a highly integrated, but already existing mobile ARM SOC. Keep the cost down through integration and by buying a part that sells in volume.

For home console, I'd move to x86 and try to release one that's $75-$100 cheaper than PS4 (assuming PS4 is $299 when that next Nintendo console ships).

It's certainly possible that Nintendo could go with a high-end machine, let's say $399 in 2015/2016, but for that route to be viable, I think they really need a culture change to build a competitive network to PSN/Live and restore 3rd party relationships.
 
There was an article published in September 2008 on a blog called What They Play titled "New Wii due by 2011" that went into Nintendo's increasing R&D budgets over the prior several years.

Obviously this was right in the middle of the development period of Wii U (and 3DS).

The links to that article / blog are dead, but I felt it was a good read, so here it is, in its entirety:

New Wii due by 2011
By John - September 30, 2008


What They Play has heard from multiple sources in the game development and publishing community that Nintendo is currently showing early presentations of its next home console hardware. Apparently set to hit the market “by 2011” the new device is said to be the true “next generation” Nintendo console, and far more than a simple refresh of the current hardware. Unlike previous console transitions from Nintendo, the new system will be presented as a true successor to the Wii, and is being dubbed by those that have seen the presentation as “Wii HD.” There is no indication if this will be its eventual name, but the nature of the transition has been characterized as similar to “the shift from Game Boy to Game Boy Advance,” where familiar, key elements were left intact while the core hardware was made more powerful. It is expected by all those that we have spoken to on the subject that the new device will retain the Wii name in part.

While our sources are reluctant to be too specific about “Wii HD,” they have been able to divulge some (albeit predictable) generalizations. High definition visuals are assured, as is a greater emphasis on digitally distributed and backwardly compatible content, indicating that the new system will feature some form of local storage medium such as a hard drive or large flash memory solution. It has also been indicated that Nintendo’s emphasis is again on what the consumer will hold in their hands and interact with, rather than the “console” itself.


Nintendo has proven it can be extremely successful by leveraging processor technology that is not on the bleeding edge, and be more profitable and more innovative as a result. In a 2006 interview with Business Week, Nintendo visionary Shigeru Miyamoto stated, “The consensus [at Nintendo] was that power isn't everything for a console. Too many powerful consoles can't coexist. It's like having only ferocious dinosaurs. They might fight and hasten their own extinction.” Based on our conversations about “Wii HD” this attitude would seem to still prevail.

But why should you believe this? Everything stated so far could easily have been the result of educated guesswork or speculation. While a Nintendo representative provided the expected response that, “Nintendo does not comment on speculation or rumor,” there is additional evidence, outside this commentary, to suggest that something is going on.

In 2003, Nintendo declared that $34 million was spent on R&D. This figure steadily climbed to $103 million in 2006 and the following year bumped dramatically to $370 million.


Based on figures from Nintendo’s annual financial reports, the company is currently spending more than ten times as much on research and development as it was five years ago, and since the Wii was launched in 2006, R&D spending has more than tripled. While this could be attributed to any number of additional projects, the level of spending suggests that a large project is in the works. In 2003, Nintendo declared that $34 million was spent on R&D. This figure steadily climbed to $103 million in 2006 (the year that the Wii launched) and the following year bumped dramatically to $370 million.
When asked to explain the escalated spending, Nintendo representatives were unable to provide comment.


The current Wii hardware is based upon processors and graphics technology supplied by IBM and AMD. These two companies have a joint development agreement together, which is described by AMD as being focused “on delivering a range of integrated platforms to serve key markets, including … gaming and media computing.”


The joint development agreement between IBM and AMD expires on December 31, 2011 but “may be extended further by the mutual agreement of the parties.” This suggests that Nintendo will be leveraging research and development from the partnership in time to ensure that it’s new hardware will be compatible with the Wii’s current “Hollywood” and “Broadway” processors. As Microsoft learned in the transition from Xbox to Xbox 360, switching hardware vendors can make running older games on a new system a much more difficult proposition.

The dramatic bump in spending at Nintendo may also be reflective of Nintendo’s work on a rumored new DS, said to feature a camera and music player. Iterating on the DS in 2009 would certainly shake up the market, though given the incredible monthly sales of the device it hardly needs reinvigorating for the time being. When the Nintendo DS was launched in 2004, the worldwide installed base of the Game Boy Advance was 53 million (on top of the Game Boy’s incredibly huge 118 million.) So far, 80 million Nintendo DS units have been sold worldwide, and demand shows no sign of slowing.

It is unlikely that any official acknowledgement of Nintendo’s new hardware will come until at least 2009, however company president Satoru Iwata will be delivering his annual fall presentation this Wednesday.



There was also a Beyond3D thread where this was discussed:

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showthread.php?t=50098


Seems that article got a number of things right, almost 3 years before Wii U was revealed at E3 2011.
 
So Nintendo spent over $500M on R&D for the Wii U?

Oh my...
 
Sega spent about half a billion dollars in total for Dreamcast's launch, including hardware development, software development and marketing.

Quote from The Dreamcast Story published on Total Games Network:

In May, Sega gave its response with the official announcement of its new system, its specifications and that controversial name: Dreamcast. The marketing campaign began with the announcement of the marketing campaign and its $100 million budget for each territory: America, Europe and Japan. Sega boss Shoichiro Irimajiri put the cost of hardware development at $50-80 million, software development at $150-200 million, which with marketing added up to half a billion dollars.
 
Specs made no sense whatsoever, ill informed fanboy wet dream.

I'd love the idea of a super powerful Nintendo console, love to shake things up. Real odds of it happening, very very very low.
 
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