Vince, the first pass when doing shadow volumes is untextured so it does take advantage of the PS2's 2.4 Gpixel/s fillrate. And since the polygons are untextured, the EE can transform them faster than textured polygons. The performance hit is of course less than what it would have been if the PS2 only had 8 pixel units instead of 16.
ZOE2 tgs trailer
- Thread starter Tiberius
- Start date
rose tinted glasses
Just spent about 15 minutes playing with the Shenmue passport disc, definitely hasn't aged well... and the intro if anything shows texture aliasing problems much worse than most PS2 games....
The bouncer graphics blow this away ( though I wont say anything about the game itself... )
Well, time to rip the model files from the image and dust of the linux discs...
Just spent about 15 minutes playing with the Shenmue passport disc, definitely hasn't aged well... and the intro if anything shows texture aliasing problems much worse than most PS2 games....
The bouncer graphics blow this away ( though I wont say anything about the game itself... )
Well, time to rip the model files from the image and dust of the linux discs...
I think the texture shimmering has to do with mippmapping and that has to do with memory limitations. Also some games used both filtered and unfiltered polys ie HOD2 by choice. The texture shimmering wasn't a fundamental flaw in the architecture as most games didn't have texture shimmering. The shimmering isn't really much worse than those found in GT3 
BTW just saw that SH3 wmv trailer. From what I can tell the ingame stuff is really taxing the PS2 hardware. Theres slow down when there's only about 2 enemies on screen..unimpressive.
Also the supposed precedural textured blood doesn't look too impressive either. Cinematography for the cutscenes are nice though.
BTW just saw that SH3 wmv trailer. From what I can tell the ingame stuff is really taxing the PS2 hardware. Theres slow down when there's only about 2 enemies on screen..unimpressive.
Also the supposed precedural textured blood doesn't look too impressive either. Cinematography for the cutscenes are nice though.
marconelly!
Veteran
Uhhh... No. It actually is *much* worse.
There is absolutely no slowdown in that trailer *whatsoever* Are you starting to imagine things now so you can convince yourself that you are right? I have watched three different encoded versions of that trailer (highres QT, lowres QT and WMV) If there is any kind of slowdown in the WMV one, it's definitely because they used low bandwidth compression so it chugs when the big portion of the video changes quickly.
*Edit* I have watched the video again - What you are attributing to slowdown is actually blended muzzle flares when she shoots from the machine gun. If you watch the other trailers you can see that during that scene screen quickly flickers light/dark and you can better see action moving while the screen is light. Therefore the strobo effect of jittered motion. It actually looks really good.
marconelly!
Veteran
Read my addition to a reply.
Shimmering in Shenmue is one of the worst ever concieved on any platform. I've been playing the game for a while yesterday just so I can have a better impression of it again.
Shimmering in Shenmue is one of the worst ever concieved on any platform. I've been playing the game for a while yesterday just so I can have a better impression of it again.
marconelly!
Veteran
Hires QT trailer clearly shows what's going on, and it's just what I described. You can also see that same thing in the WMV trailer for the few seconds right before the compression blurred the flashes. You can clearly see the light flickering and illuminating scene for the moment.
Btw, there are three visible enemies in that scene. Third one is killed right at the beginning.
Johnny Awesome
Veteran
Well if it makes you feel better, I agree with most of your opinions on this matter.
Okay, I've downloaded the quicktime trailer and watched it a few times... it's pretty cool .
The characters are relatively high poly, I'd say 20-30 thousand triangles. Simple color textures, with transparency for hair; no mutlitexturing (bump, specular or such) is visible. That's really nothing special or innovative; technically the models aren't really different from, say, the DOA3 characters. The texture art is however very nice, but it looks like 8-bit palettized stuff only.
The lighting model is quite impressive though. The shadows are free of any kind of artifacting. It does seem to be working differently than in Doom though; I mean that they are painted in, rather than 'blocking' light as in Carmack's engine. At least I think so There are a few other nice things like the rain on the car's window, too, but such things have been done before (like in MGS2).
So technically speaking, it's not that big of a leap except for the lighting, IMHO. But it still looks damn good, and a lot better than most games.
.The characters are relatively high poly, I'd say 20-30 thousand triangles. Simple color textures, with transparency for hair; no mutlitexturing (bump, specular or such) is visible. That's really nothing special or innovative; technically the models aren't really different from, say, the DOA3 characters. The texture art is however very nice, but it looks like 8-bit palettized stuff only.
The lighting model is quite impressive though. The shadows are free of any kind of artifacting. It does seem to be working differently than in Doom though; I mean that they are painted in, rather than 'blocking' light as in Carmack's engine. At least I think so
There are a few other nice things like the rain on the car's window, too, but such things have been done before (like in MGS2).So technically speaking, it's not that big of a leap except for the lighting, IMHO. But it still looks damn good, and a lot better than most games.
marconelly!
Veteran
Laa-yosh, my point from the very start was that the lighting model in this game is it's most impressive feature, along with the really good looking characters and well achieved realism. They did such a good job on lighting model that it would turn quite a few heads around even if it wasn't for the other good things about the game's looks. It's something I honestly though impossible on PS2, and I can only imagine how complex and taxing to hardware that thing is.
One question, though - how can you distinguish 8 bit paletized art from 24 bit textures? What if there is simply noo need for more than 256 color in a texture?
Multitextureing definitely exist if nothing, in scenes where you can see animated procedural texures overlayed over walls and stuff. I'm pretty sure developers even confirmed they are doing it that way. Also, aren't specual highlights visible at least in some places (I agree that faces look specular free, though) SH2 had specular mapping in many places so I assume this one will have them too.
One question, though - how can you distinguish 8 bit paletized art from 24 bit textures? What if there is simply noo need for more than 256 color in a texture?
Multitextureing definitely exist if nothing, in scenes where you can see animated procedural texures overlayed over walls and stuff. I'm pretty sure developers even confirmed they are doing it that way. Also, aren't specual highlights visible at least in some places (I agree that faces look specular free, though) SH2 had specular mapping in many places so I assume this one will have them too.
SH3 is impressive on any console
At the moment, SH3 ( and ZOE2 ) are excellent titles that look would look impressive on PS2, GC, or Xbox.. Konami have really pulled together an impressive game engine.
I still find it difficult to accurately see if a game is using 8 bit textures, it's not like the difference between 8 bit screens and 16/32 as shown in quake1
Hey, If Shenmue had turned up on PS2 instead of DC I would have been as impressed - the Xbox version of Shenmue 2 doesn't impress as much because time, and my expectations have moved on - but there are many Xbox games that are worse, just as there are many games on PS2 worse than SH3, and there will be many games on GC worse than RSq.
At the moment, SH3 ( and ZOE2 ) are excellent titles that look would look impressive on PS2, GC, or Xbox.. Konami have really pulled together an impressive game engine.
I still find it difficult to accurately see if a game is using 8 bit textures, it's not like the difference between 8 bit screens and 16/32 as shown in quake1
Hey, If Shenmue had turned up on PS2 instead of DC I would have been as impressed - the Xbox version of Shenmue 2 doesn't impress as much because time, and my expectations have moved on - but there are many Xbox games that are worse, just as there are many games on PS2 worse than SH3, and there will be many games on GC worse than RSq.
marconelly!
Veteran
Wazoo, where did you found that DVD?
lambchop ss
Newcomer
10 mins of some1 PLAYING zoe2 at TGS .... incl an amazing boss fight in the snow:
http://xlns.web.ctonet.it/zoe201.mpg
100megs
holy crap.
http://xlns.web.ctonet.it/zoe201.mpg
100megs
holy crap.
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