XBox One, PS4, DRM, and You

[eastmen]

What I was saying was that if a publisher opts to disallow used games then there is no used games market for that game. This is something which doesnt gel well with me at all.

Mabye but what if Battlefield 5 comes out Digital Download only on the ps4 . Then what ? Does that not sit well with you ?

What if Battlefield 4 requires you to check in every 24 hours on the ps4 just like the one ? EA will surely have their own servers and will be able to enforce the same system. Hell I bet ms will help them with it


Sony is between a Rock and a hard place. They are trying to beat around the bush of whats going down but it seems like at any point a developer can do something to completely blow the lid off this thing.

Imagine the first publisher to announce DRM on a ps4 title. I wonder how the internet will rage or if they will just accept it

 

[ERP]

Publishers could block used games on PS4 if they wanted. Sony just isn't providing a unified system for doing that.

All a publisher requires to block used games is a unique ID and a server. Even if Sony don't give them a unique ID they can just print one on the disc, or in the packaging.

I personally don't think you'll see it commonly done on X1, but a friend of mine has a slightly different view and thinks at least the major Japanese publishers will do it. The danger then for used games is if those publishers see a rise in new sales.

It always seemed like a pointless battle to fight to online distribution is just a matter of time, and the problem just goes away.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

What I was saying was that if a publisher opts to disallow used games then there is no used games market for that game. This is something which doesnt gel well with me at all.

And if a publisher opts not to release a game on PS4 then you don't have a used market for that game either.

There's a lot of ways this could play out.

I'm sure all the pubs are looking at this to see how it plays out. And sales of software will determine which console gets preferential treatment. Hardware install base won't matter. If it did, we'd have seen far more development dollars invested into Wii. But development dollars followed software sales.

This generation will likely be no different.

Potentially if software sells better on Xbox One (including any potential software resale publisher fees) then that console will get preferential treatment. Which might just be timed exclusives or outright exclusives.

So, those people would still have their used games, they just wouldn't have as many games to choose from.

But, not saying that'll happen. It's far too early to say. But it's certainly one possibility. And certainly could be a reason there are a lot more 3rd party exclusives for Xbox One than PS4.

And while they could be timed exclusives, it's also possible that if sales of multiplats end up favoring Xbox One that those become permanent exclusives.

Again, might not happen. But is a possibility.

Another possibility is if a publisher just decides to only release a game digitally on PS4 but has both physical and digital copies for sale on Xbox One. I'm not sure Sony would allow that though, in which case we're back to potential exclusives or the publishers themselves making a game have resale restrictions without going through Sony.

Regards,
SB

 

[kots]

Better content is subjective. Some will prefer what PS4 has and some what Xbox One has, no need arguing that one. However...
Both consoles will have used games. Except...
On one of them you'll be able to trade in your digitally purchased game while on the other, you won't. But on that other one, you'll be able to give away physical disks without restriction.
So it's a bit of a give and take on that. Since I buy everything digitally now a days, that makes one method of used games more attractive to me than the other.
And variety was pretty much the same with both consoles dominated by shooters/action games.
Regards,
SB

So calling the Big Brother every 24h to prove you're not a criminal is ok by you ?

 

[Brad Grenz]

All a publisher requires to block used games is a unique ID and a server. Even if Sony don't give them a unique ID they can just print one on the disc, or in the packaging.

Right, but they can only do that if the PS4 licensing terms don't forbid it. I wouldn't take it for granted publishers will simply "roll their own" DRM to match Xbox One.

 

[eastmen]

So calling the Big Brother every 24h to prove you're not a criminal is ok by you ?

you think the ps4 wont be calling big brother everytime its connected or sitting on a connection ?

Or is only MS evil ?

 

[-tkf-]

sounds like a crappy system when a game is 50 gigs instead of 1-4 gigs.

Wait wait you are going to buy your xbone games on a disc?

 

[Betanumerical]

you think the ps4 wont be calling big brother everytime its connected or sitting on a connection ?

Or is only MS evil ?

MS is the only who mandates having a connection to them to prove you aren't stealing games.

so yes, only MS is evil, because Sony isn't doing that.

 

[eastmen]

Right, but they can only do that if the PS4 licensing terms don't forbid it. I wouldn't take it for granted publishers will simply "roll their own" DRM to match Xbox One.

at the last conference sony stated it would be up to the publisher didn't they ? If so I don't see sony going back on that .

Wait wait you are going to buy your xbone games on a disc?

Well you know sometimes your at a place with a slower or limited online connection. So for example when I go on vacation I have a lte hot spot limited to 20gigs per month of data. If a new game comes out I want to play or if for example its pouring rain at Disney and we decide we want a new game , we can buy the disc load it , authenticate on the one with my hot spot and then enjoy all my games including the new one without having to blow a data cap or wait a long time for a download. Afterwards I can actually destroy the disc if I don't want it or it can just go in the attic with the few pc games I've bought on disc. (also I get 20% off at gamestop)

 

[ERP]

Right, but they can only do that if the PS4 licensing terms don't forbid it. I wouldn't take it for granted publishers will simply "roll their own" DRM to match Xbox One.

No I don't think they will, as I say I actually am not even convinced it will be common on X1.
Publishers like the idea, but I'm not sure the majority of them want to live with the backlash without some evidence it actually increases sales.

 

[eastmen]

MS is the only who mandates having a connection to them to prove you aren't stealing games.

so yes, only MS is evil, because Sony isn't doing that.

And that is evil ? So gakki from sony is evil ? Netflix ? all my ios / android / windows phone games that require a connection although its not actually needed are evil ?

I'm sorry i'm not seeing the line on what makes something evil.


I say having to get up to change discs is evil. So does that make Sony evil ? This is all so stupid . In 5 years people will laugh at all of this as they download the newest ps4 game

 

[Silent_Buddha]

So calling the Big Brother every 24h to prove you're not a criminal is ok by you ?

It's a non issue because I'm not a criminal. I don't lose sleep over it. I don't worry about it. It doesn't affect my life.

Do you get paranoid whenever you enter a department store or grocery store because there's a camera with someone potentially watching you to make sure you don't shoplift?

Do you get paranoid when a car dealership wants to make a copy of your driver's license before letting you take a car out for a test drive?

Do you get squeamish if a store clerk asks to see photo ID to make sure you are the owner of the credit card you are using?

Does it bother you that in order to visit another country you have to produce a Passport?

Do you refuse to provide your social security number (if living in the US) when signing up for a bank account or applying for a job?

If you live in the UK, do you avoid driving on most of the roads there because they have cameras making sure you don't break the law by speeding?

Etc.

It's not intrusive, so it doesn't bother me. If some guy kept knocking on my door demanding to see my registration papers, I would have a problem with that.

And I've been notified of it. So it isn't even like it's being done without my consent.

Steam verifies my game ownership everytime I start a game. Doesn't bug me one bit. I and every single person I know personally has never put a Steam game into offline mode. It really is a complete and total non-issue.

Regards,
SB

 

[Betanumerical]

And that is evil ? So gakki from sony is evil ? Netflix ? all my ios / android / windows phone games that require a connection although its not actually needed are evil ?

I'm sorry i'm not seeing the line on what makes something evil.


I say having to get up to change discs is evil. So does that make Sony evil ? This is all so stupid . In 5 years people will laugh at all of this as they download the newest ps4 game

Its the part about it requiring a connection to prove that you aren't stealing games, IE they automatically assume you are then require you to prove you aren't.

This is way different to gaikki and Netflix which provide a service which is reliant on the Internet.

The XBONE without this DRM wouldn't have a internet requirement.

 

[trainplane]

MS is the only who mandates having a connection to them to prove you aren't stealing games.

so yes, only MS is evil, because Sony isn't doing that.

You can call MS evil but with Steam taking over the PC and Apple taking over everything else, I'm resigned to the fact that non-DRM and used games are going the way of the Dodo. I'm on your side with DRM but it's a losing battle. The PS4 won't initially have restrictions but if there is a PS5, it's almost guaranteed to do it. And if the PS4 has the mechanisms to do it, they might still implement it in the future.

 

[eastmen]

Its the part about it requiring a connection to prove that you aren't stealing games, IE they automatically assume you are then require you to prove you aren't.

This is way different to gaikki and Netflix which provide a service which is reliant on the Internet.

The XBONE without this DRM wouldn't have a internet requirement.

I also wouldn't be able to buy a game and install it and then put the disc some where else and not bother about it .

But these things happen on many other platforms . You haven't answered my question. If Apple evil because you have to connect to play certain games ? How about android developers ?

its really stupid that this EVIL thing keeps coming up at this point , its tired and boring . People are hypocrites when they willingly buy DD games from sony and cry fowl at publishers being able to limit or rid themselves of used games on the one. People are hypocrites when they claim MS is evil for requiring an internet check evey 24 hours and not complain about steam or ios / android and the likes.

 

[ERP]

Its the part about it requiring a connection to prove that you aren't stealing games, IE they automatically assume you are then require you to prove you aren't.

That clearly isn't what they do it.
They need a mechanism to revoke a license if you sell the disk. The only other ways to do it is to require the disk in the drive to play the game or have some mechanism where the user is expected to revoke their own license before selling the disk.
MS clearly doesn't want to require the disk.
The latter has a number of loop holes that leave purchasers with unusable disks.
They could I guess checkin when ever you start the game, but checking in at some reasonable interval seems less objectionable to me.

 

[Tap In]

MS is the only who mandates having a connection to them to prove you aren't stealing games.

so yes, only MS is evil, because Sony isn't doing that.

since when is making sure someone is not stealing your intellectual property evil?

I'm not following... Ill even go as far as to say sharing games like my step son does is stealing and he and his friends (teenagers) are ruining the market


but I could be overstating, Ms seems to be trying to compromise... I think this 10 family member thing needs to get fleshed out

 

[Betanumerical]

since when is making sure someone is not stealing your intellectual property evil?

I'm not following... Ill even go as far as to say sharing games like my step son does is stealing and he and his friends (teenagers) are ruining the market

When does it stop being 'controlling your IP' and start being 'screwing consumers' ?.

 

[Tap In]

When does it stop being 'controlling your IP' and start being 'screwing consumers' ?.

have people who buought games on steam gotten screwed?

they can not share nor get credit for DD


edit
but I could be overstating, Ms seems to be trying to compromise... I think this 10 family member thing needs to get fleshed out

 

[Betanumerical]

have people who buought games on steam gotten screwed?

they can not share nor get credit for DD


edit
but I could be overstating, Ms seems to be trying to compromise... I think this 10 family member thing needs to get fleshed out

Do you really think people like EA and the other big publishers aren't going to screw people? it seems to be EA's job these days and it seems to me like Microsoft is making it as easy as possible for them to do.