XBox One, PS4, DRM, and You

[Cyan]

After all the reading in forums and such I am still a bit unclear on how the 24 hour check would work. If you go for vacation for a few days and unplug all your devices Xb1 included and then when you get back, would you have lost your whole library all will at all be there once Xb1 would have "called home"?...

That feature needed lots of touches to become polished.

I was fully supportive of the DRM policies. Now it is time to move on, lick the wounds, swallow my pride and admit that perhaps, those who were anti-DRM were right and I was completely wrong. :neutral:

I was fighting a lost battle without realising it.

Now, looking back, it was for the best, imho.

I don't want to play online with just 4 people -yes, maybe Cliff Blessinski would be there but who knows-.

Additionally, playing on an elitist console maybe wouldn't be that amazing.

With those tight and rather not very elegant measures -like the 24 hours check- the Xbox One could become a bit complicated to use, and most people don't like that.

Life is simple. People LOVE!! simple things. Think about those gadgets which succeeded worldwide, we all know what gadgets I am talking about. :smile:

They're simple, Xbox One wouldn't be. I remember a girl telling me a few months ago something really interesting.

She said to me: "You use Windows because you are very intelligent. Everything Apple is simpler and easy to use. I am not as intelligent as you and that's why I don't use Windows as much". It certainly makes me think a lot!

And now those words of hers, that life is simple and so on, resound more than ever.

If Microsoft want something like that to work, make it simpler! make it better to use and make it smart. Then there will be more chances to succeed.

 

[Rangers]

I saw this poster apparently made on Reddit outlining many of our same arguments. I like it cause it's civil for a change! And seems like a good summation of complex issues.

 

[Rangers]

Also a good exchange I spotted on twitter

Seems like family sharing was as good as advertised (I cant believe this though) and also seems like it will come back eventually for digital purchases.

 

[MrFox]

You see? You didn't lose shit. It was only delayed because they have to rework it. The only thing lost was the disc based sharing, but you guy wanted an all DD solution anyway. Nothing was lost (technologically). Everybody wins.

Whatever they allow you do to with your DD will be their business choice, and it's completely unrelated to the disc choice added.

 

[ERP]

You see? You didn't lose shit. It was only delayed because they have to rework it. The only thing lost was the disc based sharing, but you guy wanted an all DD solution anyway. Nothing was lost (technologically). Everybody wins.

Whatever they allow you do to with your DD will be their business choice, and it's completely unrelated to the disc choice added.

No I personally wanted to play games with no disk in the drive regardless of whether I bought it on physical media.
I personally couldn't give a shit about sharing or trading anything.
It is what it is, but please don't tell me what I did or did not lose or which featured I valued.

 

[MrFox]

No I personally wanted to play games with no disk in the drive regardless of whether I bought it on physical media.
I personally couldn't give a shit about sharing or trading anything.
It is what it is, but please don't tell me what I did or did not lose or which featured I valued.

Sorry, that came out wrong. I was talking the the ones arguing that the point was to make discs disappear. So I guess you lost the ability to use a disc as a transfer method. They did say you can still use any retail disc to install the game and then buy it DD to unlock it.

 

[3dcgi]

No I personally wanted to play games with no disk in the drive regardless of whether I bought it on physical media.
I personally couldn't give a shit about sharing or trading anything.
It is what it is, but please don't tell me what I did or did not lose or which featured I valued.

I agree with ERP.

 

[AzBat]

I'm with ERP & 3dcgi. I wanted the ability to choose disc or digital. If I chose disc, then I wanted the ability to play without a disc check. Say if the game was large & expensive I probably would have opted for the disc. That way I could have gifted to a friend or sold it back to Gamestop(if the publisher supported) after I was done. If it was small & cheap then I would have bought it digital & kept the title on my hard drive. Just like I do today with XBLA & XBLIG. I never did care about the online check. It would have never affected me. But losing the ability to play without a disc sucks. However, I'm not going to get upset over it. "It is what it is." Agreed!

As for family sharing, I liked that feature too. Sad to see it go at launch, but it looks like it might make it back later. That would be cool. It was something I was really excited about. I probably would have used it with a couple of people. And it would have been easier to convince other family & friends to buy a system if it supported that feature. Let's hope it makes it back.

They did say you can still use any retail disc to install the game and then buy it DD to unlock it.

I have never seen that posted. Have a link? That would be cool, but how would you get a disc without paying for it first? Get it at a retailer as a free or cheap demo disc? Bring it home to play the built-in timed demo & then unlock it via purchasing it through the XBox store? That could be interesting.

Tommy McClain

 

[MrFox]

I guess I agree with AzBat, 3dcgi and ERP about the issue of discless play when you bought a license to install a disc based version, not everybody has fast pipes

I have never seen that posted. Have a link? That would be cool, but how would you get a disc without paying for it first? Get it at a retailer as a free or cheap demo disc? Bring it home to play the built-in timed demo & then unlock it via purchasing it through the XBox store? That could be interesting.

I was very sure someone said that here... until you asked for a link.
Maybe it was just an earlier discussion and my mind is playing tricks on me.

But it makes so much sense. The whole game has to be installed either way, whether it's a disc or a DD version. It could be the same binary, and the security code could try both a disc check and an online xbl check, whichever results in a success. It can't be difficult to make it work the same way as what we have right now with a demo unlock "patch".

Games could comes with a DD code with the disc. They did exactly that with Sly Cooper and other PS3/Vita games. You were getting both a PS3 disc and the Vita DD, for $39. The DD was managed like a DLC, the disc only allows that operation once, so it's not transferable with the disc, that limits significantly the possibility of abuses. Because reselling the disc loses the DD part, it helps against used games, and it makes most people want to buy the retail version instead of a used version. Only the first time owner would be able to play discless, and still retain all advantages of the disc.

 

[RancidLunchmeat]

You'd need to share your password so they can access your library, and vice versa. You'd then gain all access to their content, and vice versa. Whoever you share with will need no second console already activated for their account.

Huh? That doesn't seem right. I've been told repeatedly in this thread and in others that nothing the One was doing was revolutionary or even different from what the PS3 already offers. Now you're telling me that in order to share games, they have to log in as my userID?

Well, that doesn't sound the same as what the One was offering at all.

 

[Strange]

I saw this poster apparently made on Reddit outlining many of our same arguments. I like it cause it's civil for a change! And seems like a good summation of complex issues.

See? We don't hate DRM, we hate how Microsoft implemented it with no pros and lots of cons.

Lots of people on this forum would accept it if it was like this picture.

 

[Strange]

Huh? That doesn't seem right. I've been told repeatedly in this thread and in others that nothing the One was doing was revolutionary or even different from what the PS3 already offers. Now you're telling me that in order to share games, they have to log in as my userID?

Well, that doesn't sound the same as what the One was offering at all.

That's when shared accounts came into play.

 

[Nesh]

We were screwed by one very well known publisher when tried to get our game published on the PC via them. T

I wonder who that was

 

[blakjedi]

See? We don't hate DRM, we hate how Microsoft implemented it with no pros and lots of cons.

Lots of people on this forum would accept it if it was like this picture.

Don't say no pros. There were plenty of pros.

 

[eastmen]

You see? You didn't lose shit. It was only delayed because they have to rework it. The only thing lost was the disc based sharing, but you guy wanted an all DD solution anyway. Nothing was lost (technologically). Everybody wins.

Whatever they allow you do to with your DD will be their business choice, and it's completely unrelated to the disc choice added.

So your saying I can still buy a disc at a store and load it onto my xbox one and have all the digital benfits and then toss the disc ? Cuase it doesn't sound that way at all. WE have no idea if any of these features are coming back or when.
The future once again is delayed.

 

[Tap In]

biggest loss to me is buying a new disc, installing it and it became digital, when I was done I could have traded it in for my next new game.

No finesse, or debate or counter-point will change that and the fact that if I buy a disc I have to keep the damned thing in the tray and can not do fast game switching or play a game while matchmaking is finding a match in another game etc... and so I lose the digital benefits and the ability to trade game for credit...

it is a joke that people created this outrage nonsense to hold up progress

 

[brasnial]

It is what if is now we lost a digital future that gave us nearly all the same benifits of disk based gaming .

Why did we lose this because of greed people .....you see two companies are fighting for profits .
Microsoft had leaks these leaks didn't contain the whole picture and were used by clever people to pander to peoples fears over there rights

A negative message designed to play on someones fears will always work and once the damage is done ,by that I mean lots of scared people jumping on the bandwagon its dame near impossible to get your positive message out .

There were just hours between Microsoft seemingly confirming peoples fears about there digital plans and Sony confirming everyone's fears with there little stunt on stage .
Once Sony went all in with that negative message it confirmed everyone's fears and backed up all the negative fears posted by the media and message boards before hand based of earlier leaks .

It didn't matter if all the negative messaging was true or just part of it .

The damage was done and in my opinion very few people where debating Microsoft's plans or looking at the fine details they were convinced it was all bad .

Only when the bad future was off the table did more and more people start to look at it from a non fearful point of view and start to discuss the whole thing through from a logical starting point .

There a lesson to learn here in my opinion and that is all fair n business even holding back progress if it will help your bottom line.
Even it its at the expense of public and suppliers .
Sony I'm looking at you .

 

[Tap In]

Even it its at the expence of public and suppliers .
Sony I'm looking at you .

yep Evilore on GAF confirmed that Sony shifted their stance to take advantage of the moment the week of E3, that they were going DRM and reversed leading up to that week

 

[dagamer]

yep Evilore on GAF confirmed that Sony shifted their stance to take advantage of the moment the week of E3, that they were going DRM and reversed leading up to that week

I think the alternative will end up being much better, publishers will screw Gamestop and give all pre-release incentives to digital purchases since those can't be resold. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if we see some games be released digitally a week or two before their physical release. Would it piss off Gamestop? Absolutely. Is there anything they can do about it? Nope. Saying "we won't carry your game" will have less and less power as time goes on in this generation.

The real genius part will come when games are automatically installed from disc when you go over to a friend's house. After they leave (taking your disc), you'll still see the data on your hard drive and the system will likely prompt you and say "Would you like to buy this game?" BOOM. Instant digital sale with no waiting PLUS it screws Gamestop. Ingenious.

 

[brasnial]

yep Evilore on GAF confirmed that Sony shifted their stance to take advantage of the moment the week of E3, that they were going DRM and reversed leading up to that week

The thing is Sony plans most likely would have been exactly like Microsoft's so they screwed there own customers out of the benifits of a digital future that worked like game disks work today .
In my opinion .