WiiGeePeeYou (Hollywood) what IS it ?

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. . .considering its affects (not effects) in . . .
Something inside me just died. </OT>


Dregun, you completely ruined your own argument when you said the GBA failed because of DS. LOL. That's like saying Windows 2000 failed because of Windows XP.

Edit: Also, note that the DS (nov. 21, 2004) was released just a little while before PSP (mar. 24 2005)... yeah, the DS was definitely rushed to the market to compete with PSP!
 
What games have you been playing? Seriously how many games can Mario be featured in, what did they bring new to the game of Mario Golf, Mario Tennis, Mario Kart Racing? Those are the same games we have been playing for a long time..a kart racing game is still a racing game. The Wii remote isn't near as significant because it has just as many limitations as advantages..nothing has changed. I can list vast improvements in games from the original Wolfenstein3D to Half Life 2 when it comes to FPS that couldn't be done without stronger hardware. Do you honestly think the only thing better about HL2 compared to Doom1 is the graphics?? NO! With stronger computers and graphics cards came better animation, better facial animation, better AI, better physics (HUGE considering its affects (not effects) in games. More power allowed for VAST areas, GTA or Jax and Daxter for example are the result of BETTER hardware which can also be seen in todays FPS. They wouldn't even have considered putting vehicles in FPS if the hardware wasn't better then what was available for Doom1. More advances have been made through stronger hardware then has been with new controllers, or did you forget about the Power Glove??



Thats wrong, with increased power does not only come better graphics..thats Nintendos thinking which you have swallowed up too easily. Better hardware means larger worlds, better animation, better AI, better physics..you might be able to see all of it but its what you dont see initially thats so important. Wouldnt it be nice if during a football game you can tackle someone and depending on the speed, angle and position of the players the animation of them being hit would look different? Granted the goal in Nintendos eyes are the same ...you tackled someone because thats just how they see it. For the player they see the same animations over and over and over, no fancy controller is going to magically make you visualize it any different and bring you closer to the game. Dont EVER bring up Japan's gaming habits again, its the most illogical assumption you can make or do you want to play Dating Sims too? Its always been known that Japans impressions of games is vastly different then the rest of the world. Have you even seen half of the games that come out over in Japan, obviously you haven't or you wouldn't have subjected yourself to using "That is one of the reasons why the gaming market in Japan stopped crowing".



Again you fail to see the real issue at hand. Its the same with the Wii if the Wii and PS3 and 360 were the same price the Wii would be dead. People dont buy a Double Cheeseburger from MC'ds because they like the taste they do it because if they only have 3 dollars 3 double cheeseburgers is a better deal then a 4oz steak. I wonder if you ever had to choose between something you wanted and something you could afford? Don't tell me you think a $200 CRT is better then the 400 LCD because Nintendo told you so?



Once again Nintendo's PR has you, who do you think REALLY wants its customers to be happy? Nintendo who is making profit off of the console off the bat, or the other 2 companies who are losing money off the bat to give people something better for their money? EVERYTHING nintendo has released in the last decade has been crappy products because they wont compete with anyone and only want to focus on profits! The GBA using SNES hardware when the PSP was around the corner with PS2 type hardware? How about the N64 using Carts when obviously CD's were around the corner? What about the Cube using a closed format when DVD's were becoming cheap and were superior in capacity? What about the lack of 3rd party support, that a nintendo short coming. Nintendo is the LAST company that should be praised for NOT ripping off its customers, otherwise they would take less financial gain to please its supporters!.



All my arguments go against the PR that Nintendo has been pushing for the last decade! Its why the Cube failed, its why the GBA failed (rushed life cycle because of the introduction of the DS to compete with the PSP) and its why the Wii is going to fail. I'm all for innovation but not at the cost of higher profit due to cost that is Nintendos philosophy. Make the Wii with an advanced controller just at least put some DECENT hardware inside the machine so gamers can have both things they want...Nice graphics and good controls. Im really starting to wonder if you Wii supporters would have bought the Wii if it had the same hardware but new controls (ala Wii) for $250 because thats the REAL CRIME!

Dregun

I will say something that hardcore gamers will hate me (and I'm an ancient hardcore gamer came back :smile: ) : Wii Sport is the perfect thing that demonstrate the philosophy of Nintendo and it's way better than games with larger worlds, better AI and everything else. I'm not sure that gaming only needs better physics, AI, worlds to be better. I see the power of Wii at christmas, all my familly looked at that and some people even said : "i will buy one because i can play that, unlike playstation". My 4 year old cousin was better at golf (with some help :D ) than his dad! And i love spend time on creating Mii, on the virtual console (oh shit those games with 2D graphics :LOL: ).
So Wii is not a failure, it's already a success : enlarge gaming population ! :cool:
 
Quote:
. . .considering its affects (not effects) in . . .

Something inside me just died. </OT>

I'm sorry, did you not know Effects and Affects had different meanings?
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/affect = Definition of Affects
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/effect = Definition of Effects

Unless I was taught incorrectly the difference is that Affects are the "cause" and "Effects" are the result. So therefore the advanced physics would affect the way water is effected by a stone thrown into it.

Dregun, you completely ruined your own argument when you said the GBA failed because of DS. LOL. That's like saying Windows 2000 failed because of Windows XP.

Edit: Also, note that the DS (nov. 21, 2004) was released just a little while before PSP (mar. 24 2005)... yeah, the DS was definitely rushed to the market to compete with PSP!

I think you are misunderstanding what my whole argument was about. The GBA was a failure (for Nintendos strategy) because it did not last as long as they WANTED it too. They milked the GB&GBC for how many years? They were on track to milk the GBA for how long? Then rumors surfaced that Sony was thinking of entering the handheld market and THEN Nintendo came up with the DS because the Sp was just a face lift. Nintendo only released the DS because they feared Sony would take away the only real cash cow Nintendo has. Besides its not like the DS was anywhere near as hard to manufacture compared to the PSP, they threw the DS together VERY fast. The GBA failed because it showed how greedy Nintendo is and what it really takes to make them embrace new technology.

Dregun
 
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I'm sorry, did you not know Effects and Affects had different meanings?
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/affect = Definition of Affects
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/effect = Definition of Effects

Unless I was taught incorrectly the difference is that Affects are the "cause" and "Effects" are the result. So therefore the advanced physics would affect the way water is effected by a stone thrown into it.

You didn't even read the definitions you linked!

I'll make it simple for you.

Generally speaking -

To affect is a verb.

An effect is a noun.

From your first link -

—Usage note Affect1 and effect, each both noun and verb, share the sense of “influence,†and because of their similarity in pronunciation are sometimes confused in writing. As a verb affect1 means “to act on†or “to move†(His words affected the crowd so deeply that many wept); affect2 means “to pretend†or “to assume†(new students affecting a nonchalance they didn't feel). The verb effect means “to bring about, accomplishâ€: Her administration effected radical changes. The noun effect means “result, consequenceâ€: the serious effects of the oil spill. The noun affect1 pronounced with the stress on the first syllable, is a technical term in psychology and psychiatry. Affect2 is not used as a noun.




I think you are misunderstanding what my whole argument was about. The GBA was a failure (for Nintendos strategy) because it did not last as long as they WANTED it too. They milked the GB&GBC for how many years? They were on track to milk the GBA for how long? Then rumors surfaced that Sony was thinking of entering the handheld market and THEN Nintendo came up with the DS because the Sp was just a face lift. Nintendo only released the DS because they feared Sony would take away the only real cash cow Nintendo has. Besides its not like the DS was anywhere near as hard to manufacture compared to the PSP, they threw the DS together VERY fast. The GBA failed because it showed how greedy Nintendo is and what it really takes to make them embrace new technology.

Dregun


You don't know for sure what Nintendo's original plan was for the GBA. Neither do I. Nobody does. DS was clearly in the works long before PSP's announcement... you can't just cobble together a system like that.

If anything, DS cost Nintendo money because they wound up scrapping their "GBA2" development due to its insane success.

Oh, and the handhelds aren't Nintendo's only cash cows, lol. They profited off Gamecube from day 1->onward. Maybe not immediately after certain price drops, but overall GCN hardware was pure profit for Nintendo... and if you think they didn't also make money on the games, I'm certain you're mistaken.
 
The Wii remote isn't near as significant because it has just as many limitations as advantages..nothing has changed.

If you ever hold a wiimote you would have noticed things did change. You definitly experiance the games in a other way than with a traditional controller.

Do you honestly think the only thing better about HL2 compared to Doom1 is the graphics??

In the end playing doom or hl2 still comes down to exactly the same thing. Use your mouse and keyboard to move and shoot some enemies. Sure more things have changed but the basics of interaction are still the same.

More advances have been made through stronger hardware then has been with new controllers, or did you forget about the Power Glove??

I was already waiting for you to mention the power glove :) anyway you didnt read my post very good because I said at this moment nintendo feels there is more gain in a new controller method than in more processing power. And without D-pads and analoge sticks gaming wouldnt be what it is today, that had some big impact too.

Thats wrong, with increased power does not only come better graphics..thats Nintendos thinking which you have swallowed up too easily. Better hardware means larger worlds, better animation, better AI, better physics..

You should have read my post a little bit better. Like I said, nintendo feels that the things you mention are already able enough on current gen hardware. Sure you can always improve things. You could go as far as wanting every grain of sand to move realistic but you should wonder if that is something most gamers will care about. Nintendo feels that changing the way you interact with a game will have a bigger impact that improving on gfx, animation, physics etc.

Dont EVER bring up Japan's gaming habits again, its the most illogical assumption you can make or do you want to play Dating Sims too? Its always been known that Japans impressions of games is vastly different then the rest of the world. Have you even seen half of the games that come out over in Japan, obviously you haven't or you wouldn't have subjected yourself to using

The majority of games sold in Japan really isnt that different from what we play. Take a look at the top25 of games sold each week and that basically is more or less the same type of games that we play.

People dont buy a Double Cheeseburger from MC'ds because they like the taste they do it because if they only have 3 dollars 3 double cheeseburgers is a better deal then a 4oz steak.

So you are trying to tell me that people each year spend large amounts of money on MC'ds but they actually dont like the food and dont want to eat it? maybe Im just a idiot but if they dont like the food than why dont save the money untill they got enough to buy food they do like?

I wonder if you ever had to choose between something you wanted and something you could afford?

Yes, often. And if the product I could afford didnt get me what I want from it I would save my money untill I could afford the product that offerd me what I wanted.

Once again Nintendo's PR has you, who do you think REALLY wants its customers to be happy?

Uhm... yes? if nobody would be happy with the product they bought from nintendo than do you think nintendo would still be in business?

Nintendo who is making profit off of the console off the bat, or the other 2 companies who are losing money off the bat to give people something better for their money?

The only reason ms and sony are losing money on their console is because nobody would buy it at the price it would cost to make profit.

EVERYTHING nintendo has released in the last decade has been crappy products because they wont compete with anyone and only want to focus on profits!

So you cant have a good product if your not competing with someone? aha... pretty dumb dont you think?

The GBA using SNES hardware when the PSP was around the corner with PS2 type hardware? How about the N64 using Carts when obviously CD's were around the corner? What about the Cube using a closed format when DVD's were becoming cheap and were superior in capacity?

All those things you mention still dont make the product crappy. Besides that your arguments suck. GBA was out long before psp, n64 carts might be lower in storage but they were suppirior in loading times and the cube used small dvd disks (it isnt a closed format at all) to try and avoid piracy.

What about the lack of 3rd party support, that a nintendo short coming.

The lack of 3rd party support for the last generation has nothing to do with nintendo making crappy products. The GC is a solid piece of hardware wich offers good bang for the buck. The lack of software doesnt change anything about the quality of the product.

Nintendo is the LAST company that should be praised for NOT ripping off its customers, otherwise they would take less financial gain to please its supporters!.

Are you trying to say you cant make a nice profit and please your customers? the reason they are making profits is because apparantly they do please their costumers.

All my arguments go against the PR that Nintendo has been pushing for the last decade! Its why the Cube failed, its why the GBA failed (rushed life cycle because of the introduction of the DS to compete with the PSP) and its why the Wii is going to fail

Dude... the GBA still sells plenty and gets software support. Besides, they sold like 76million gba's, how can you argue it failed?

If you dislike nintendo so much just say the Wii isnt worth your 250dollars, dont say its a bad product or you are getting ripped of because you arnt. Nintendo sells quality hardware at a decent price. You know who is ripping you off? Sony. For still charging 175 euro's for a new ps2. I cant see how you can say you get ripped of with a wii for 250 euro while you get alot more power than the ps2, get 512mb of memory, wifi and a totally new controller.
 
I think your still a little confused about how the two words interact with each other.

af·fect1
–verb (used with object)
1. to act on; produce an effect or change in: Cold weather affected the crops.


ef·fect
–noun
1. something that is produced by an agency or cause; result; consequence: Exposure to the sun had the effect of toughening his skin.


An "effect" is a noun because its a person, place or thing...(As in special effects)
An "affect" is a verb because it gives action or state....(As in Physics affected the effects produced by the GPU)

I agree this argument has nothing to do with this thread at all and I apologize if my point of views regarding Nintendo's philosophy offends others. This like many other debates is one of "Personal Preference" and I should have known better then to argue my points with others who so strongly believe otherwise in their points.

Sorry to hijack the thread.


Dregun
 
...And still nobody knows exact Hollywood specs. (It's funny how this sort of turned into a Nintendo-bashing thread.)
No leaks? Non at all? I'm pretty sure some employee at EA (the department that worked on the Wii versions of certain games) might have some idea as to microcode and operating porceedures.

And another thing I want to know is the backward compatbility playback rumors: That GC games run/look better on the Wii than a standard GC. Does anybody have both a Wii and a GC (both with component cables, of course) to confirm this? (I'd prefer using Zelda: Twilight Princess for GC as a test game, seeing how the game can be used to benchmark both systems performancewise.)
 
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...And still nobody knows exact Hollywood specs. (It's funny how this sort of turned into a Nintendo-bashing thread.)
No leaks? Non at all? I'm pretty sure some employee at EA (the department that worked on the Wii versions of certain games) might have some idea as to microcode and operating porceedures.

And another thing I want to know is the backward compatbility playback rumors: That GC games run/look better on the Wii than a standard GC. Does anybody have both a Wii and a GC (both with component cables, of course) to confirm this? (I'd prefer using Zelda: Twilight Princess for GC as a test game, seeing how the game can be used to benchmark both systems performancewise.)

I did have both until today, just sold my gamecube. Can only really give anecdotal evidence that the games are running better (and possibly looking a bit better, in general the wii's display output, particularly component, seems higher quality than gamecube or xbox), but my suitemate has that Naruto 4 fighting game from Japan and it has some pretty bad slowdown when certain characters are used, as soon as I get an action replay that works on the wii I'll try it out and see if it's still there. Cube games in general used to be pretty good in framerates so I can't think of too many games where it would be worth it to try. Godzilla seemed smoother, as did the rebel strike demo (I had already sold the game by the time I got the wii, but even the demo had severe slowdown from what I remember), as does smash bros with a lot of pokeballs on the screen, but I can't say for sure. It doesn't seem unreasonable though that the wii could retain backwards compatibility without downclocking, since Nintendo really discouraged low level coding with the wii I'd doubt that very many devs did things that were timing dependent.
 
...And still nobody knows exact Hollywood specs. (It's funny how this sort of turned into a Nintendo-bashing thread.)
What's even funnier is that both "effect" and "affect" can be used as both nouns AND verbs. They just don't meant the same thing. :)
 
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but could there be more to it?

Hello i am extremely new to all of this but very interested on asking a few questions.
after looking into most of your post on hollywood i have to ask you is it possible that the chips them selfs can somehow be upgraded? let me explain.
first when nintendo code named their console revolution it was for a reason and it was not because of the controler the name was out out before the controler was a concept, the talk was nintendo console was to be more powerful without extra energy.
It was to be created for the programers ,that was about 3 years ago though.
than there was talk about the patent which was to use displace mapping and processing built into hollywood.
ati comes out and says themselves you just say the tip of the iceburg of what wii is able to do.
I also know for a fact there has to be 1t-sram embedded somewhere in the wii mosys came out themselves at a press conference after the wii was finalize, the brodcom on the chip ,and last iwata said in a article that the
 
But could there more to it? 2

Was cut off!
Iawata said in a article called ask iwatta ,wii is the first upgradeable system we have made .
This is just the history of the wii that i have been following for over 3 years .
I am coming to my conclusion that the revolutionary parts of the wii maybe the cpu or gpu if not both can be upgrated and remade to a virtual degree. just as a cpu can be overclocked maybe its more upgrading within the architecture
Thank you i hope you will help me kindly.
 
after looking into most of your post on hollywood i have to ask you is it possible that the chips them selfs can somehow be upgraded?
No.
first when nintendo code named their console revolution it was for a reason and it was not because of the controler
Yes, it was.
the name was out out before the controler was a concept
No, it wasn't.
than there was talk about the patent which was to use displace mapping
That was a misinterpretation by people who don't understand how to read technological documents.
 
Sorry to disagree with you but i read an article on the revolution at the end of 2002

after looking into most of your post on hollywood i have to ask you is it possible that the chips them selfs can somehow be upgraded?
No.

Yes, it was.

No, it wasn't.

That was a misinterpretation by people who don't understand how to read technological documents.

Sorry to disagree with you but i read an article from cube magazine at the end of 2002 it was about how nintendo was making their next system and they were using a new ways of processing, the news about the controler was not until late 2003, by iwatta explanation.
And then why would hollywood take 5 years in the making?
 
after looking into most of your post on hollywood i have to ask you is it possible that the chips them selfs can somehow be upgraded?

Sorry to disagree with you but i read an article from cube magazine at the end of 2002 it was about how nintendo was making their next system and they were using a new ways of processing, the news about the controler was not until late 2003, by iwatta explanation.
And then why would hollywood take 5 years in the making?

a misprint on a patent?
Even all of yours post say you still don't know what hollywood does.
And what about the 1t-sram where is it? mosys say it is there?
 
about cube games running better in wii....
the first thing i did (after playing 6-8 hours of wii sports) was to see if i could find some BC issues. i played a bit of most of my games, spending a bit more time with the more demanding games. SW:RL still had slowdown in the same situations (exessive bombing, for example). rendering quality looked pretty much the same, well within tollerance of my setup (i have s-video cables for my GC, but composite for Wii). since i don't own 2 copies of the same game, i played a bit of RE4's assignment ada on each system, switching between them to see if i could tell the difference. they both had a bit of slowdown in similar situations, and other than the color differences (caused by the superior cables i have for the GC) looked identical. i'd love for it to be true that wii runs GC games at superior framerates or with superior image quality, but i haven't seen any evidence first hand. the only advantage i see to running GC games on wii (image quality wise) is the availability of component cables, and thus progressive scan.
 
Let me reintroduce my self

As i said i am new to this, That is why I not to egotistic took name my self the student, i am struggling on most of the technical meanings so if i make a novice mistake on this form please be understanding, my point is it possible for nintendo to have made a chip cpu or gpu so they could via download and or update it!
and why?
 
about cube games running better in wii....
the first thing i did (after playing 6-8 hours of wii sports) was to see if i could find some BC issues. i played a bit of most of my games, spending a bit more time with the more demanding games. SW:RL still had slowdown in the same situations (exessive bombing, for example). rendering quality looked pretty much the same, well within tollerance of my setup (i have s-video cables for my GC, but composite for Wii). since i don't own 2 copies of the same game, i played a bit of RE4's assignment ada on each system, switching between them to see if i could tell the difference. they both had a bit of slowdown in similar situations, and other than the color differences (caused by the superior cables i have for the GC) looked identical. i'd love for it to be true that wii runs GC games at superior framerates or with superior image quality, but i haven't seen any evidence first hand. the only advantage i see to running GC games on wii (image quality wise) is the availability of component cables, and thus progressive scan.


that makes sense. i mean, GameCube games running on the Wii really should not run at faster framerates. the games were designed to run on GameCube and not take advantage of the faster speed of the-then future Wii system. it's not like PC games which scale with better hardware.
 
that makes sense. i mean, GameCube games running on the Wii really should not run at faster framerates. the games were designed to run on GameCube and not take advantage of the faster speed of the-then future Wii system. it's not like PC games which scale with better hardware.

If the cpu and gpu are always running at full clock, it would eliminate slowdown in cube games, though it wouldn't allow them to exceed the intended framerate. That would only happen assuming Nintendo didn't include the ability to downclock its chips though.
 
a misprint on a patent?

Who said anything about a misprint? It's impossible to transfer new transistors over the Internet and add them to an existing chip. The Wii's GPU simply doesn't have enough transistors for super-advanced shader models, and we've seen one (badly translated) interview from Nintendo and one from Ubisoft saying that no, the Wii doesn't have advanced shader capabilities.
 
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