Why is it ...

[Shifty Geezer]

But these game threads are in the console games subsection, not console technology.

So whatever interesting tech may be going on, this is strictly not the place to discuss them per se.

Despite being a games forum, this is a tech site. For people just wanting to talk games, there's a zillion other forums. The major populace here is here for more than game-speak, and their interests will affect what they look at. I came to B3D to find out about PS2 and Cell. The game side I nose around in with an interest in what's going on. I haven't much interest in visiting game threads and leaving a one line 'I can't wait for this!' or 'looks good' which is what the majority of games forums are like. If I'm to talk about a game, there has to be something there to discuss, like is it doing things well or poorly. If it's just doing what other games are doing, there's little scope for discussion. So I think the audience here is different, and tech is still a major component even if not in a labelled tech subforum.

 

[cthellis42]

Do a poll and include PS2 and see what that tells ya.

Dude, that's like polling people and asking who owns a car. There are just some things you can't help but own!

 

[habbe]

Hehe.. now i'm going to say something i will regret...

I would actually prefer the old days when the one we don't say his name was downplaying everything.. He actually had some knowledge about the platforms.

There just ain't no technical about the trolling these days.

 

[RobertR1]

A lot has to do with justification of your purchase. The PS3 was the most expensive console in history at $599. The justification of this price tag came from Sony constantly hammering the "WAIT TILL YOU SEE THIS! Next gen starts when we say it does...etc..etc.." over and over. Eventually, people started to believe such and really why shouldn't they? After all, a $600 machine *should* be superior to a $400 one on a routinely basis.

Then the PS3 launched and with very poor results in contrast to the hype that was created. However, people were already in the mindset that "yes, it HAS to be superior!" so the waiting game started. Any CGI trailer that would be shown would get these people out and cheerleading in an attempt to justify and declare this supremacy.

On the 360 side, it routinely delivers and the software sells a ton. The console speaks for itself and does not need this sustained hype game after game. That right there is the difference.

One thing you can also notice is how the threads deflate quickly if a once assumed PS3 game is also coming to the 360. That clearly shows the bias of needing to have PS3 exclusives and declaring them "superior to anything on the 360" "the 360 could NEVER do this!" and so on comments we hear over and over.

It's a shame really. All these people are doing is depriving themselves of a good experience across both platforms in arguably the best gaming timeframe throughout console history.

 

[Carl B]

But these game threads are in the console games subsection, not console technology.

So whatever interesting tech may be going on, this is strictly not the place to discuss them per se.

I can understand the interest in the Heavenly Sword thread, even if it's a new, unproven game (and sales may reflect that, regardless of the merit) since there are developers who are participants in the forum.

But why does Lair or Uncharted threads have such huge number of views? Again, new games which you wouldn't expect to sell nearly as well as Halo 3.

I guess one thing is, for at least a couple of years before launch, the architecture of the PS3 (specifically the Cell and the rumored new graphic synthesizer) was discussed ad nauseum.

I think Lair, Uncharted, Heavenly Sword, and now Killzone... are discussed to the extent they are because they're held up as proxies for whatever theoretical advantages PS3 might have. Discussion of these games is discussion of the platforms themselves in an abstracted manner for many that participate in the back-and-forths.

Lair's devs claim "only on PS3," and that's the tone that gets set. The discussion around Killzone of late should be obvious; it was sort of judgement day for what Guerilla had (or had not) been able to achieve, on a point of debate that has been a festering sore-spot since 2005 for a lot of people.

I don't follow this section of the forums very much, precisely because it's slightly radioactive IMO, but Uncharted probably because it's the creation of tech powerhouse Naughty Dog, and Heavenly Sword due to the participation of hometown favorites Dean and Marco.

 

[Darkon]

Hehe.. now i'm going to say something i will regret...

I would actually prefer the old days when the one we don't say his name was downplaying everything.. He actually had some knowledge about the platforms.

There just ain't no technical about the trolling these days.

You don't mean the legendery superkyro dude.

 

[nAo]

To be fair, I don't think any of us have seen enough of Halo 3 (campaign) to really say one way or another. According to several people who have seen the behind closed doors demos, the trailer really didn't do the game justice.

it's not about being objective, as I wrote in my first post it's about perception, and perception often has no connection with reality.

 

[rabidrabbit]

One thing you can also notice is how the threads deflate quickly if a once assumed PS3 game is also coming to the 360. That clearly shows the bias of needing to have PS3 exclusives and declaring them "superior to anything on the 360" "the 360 could NEVER do this!" and so on comments we hear over and over.

What threads? Assassins Creed might be one (though I think it's just because there's been little new info of it lately, apart from the [unimpressive imo] E3 showing), any others?
MGS4? But that thread hasn't deflated, on the contrary. Is that because of the new trailer or that the latest word is it'll be PS3 exclusive.
I can't think of many such threads, so as to say there is a clearly showing trend.

What threads did you have in mind?

 

[Neb]

One thing you can also notice is how the threads deflate quickly if a once assumed PS3 game is also coming to the 360. That clearly shows the bias of needing to have PS3 exclusives and declaring them "superior to anything on the 360" "the 360 could NEVER do this!" and so on comments we hear over and over.

Yes I noticed it aswell and if the game goes from being multi-platform to being only xbox360 then the game is not impressive anymore.

 

[RobertR1]

What threads? Assassins Creed might be one (though I think it's just because there's been little new info of it lately, apart from the [unimpressive imo] E3 showing), any others?
MGS4? But that thread hasn't deflated, on the contrary. Is that because of the new trailer or that the latest word is it'll be PS3 exclusive.
I can't think of many such threads, so as to say there is a clearly showing trend.

What threads did you have in mind?

Assassin's Creed was on my list and it already got but on the back shelf as of last year when it was announced to be multiplatform.

*IF* MGS4 does get announced I expect a similar deflation. If Epic came out tomorrow and said UT3 is a PS3 exclusive throughout it's life, we'd be talking about how great UT3 looks! and it does but no one really wants to talk about it because it's crossplatform.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The PS3 was the most expensive console in history at $599.

That's not true, and that's part of why PS3 threads expand (not Sony threads, because the mobile forum isn't rich with PSP threads). As well as hype in PS3 threads, there's more misinformation thrown out about PS3 than any other machine, which means more input to correct people. This ties back in with the tech. We can't much discuss Xenon as it's a CPU that gets no coverage. Whereas Cell is talked about all over the shop, which brings out people who say 'it can't do that' and then others who say 'but it can' and plenty of wrong ideas in between.

 

[rabidrabbit]

Well, then. I think this can be seen the other way round too if one wants so.
A xbox360 game that's gone multiplatform, or is rumoured to go on a rival console too, is not considered impressive anymore.
Oblivion, Dirt, Bioshock, Fallout 3,...

Really, I think the lack of xbox360 threads, or them falling out of the top 10 of B3D console forums currently is more just because there really hasn't been really new info on any of those "2007" games lately.
Nothing to be too much worried about.

 

[rabidrabbit]

*IF* MGS4 does get announced I expect a similar deflation. If Epic came out tomorrow and said UT3 is a PS3 exclusive throughout it's life, we'd be talking about how great UT3 looks! and it does but no one really wants to talk about it because it's crossplatform.

Are you saying the game is not worth downplaying any more when it's no longer threatening with it's platform exclusivity?
The threads could be long in part because of the noise platform enthusiasts generate, when a game is no longer on the "war zone" of console exclusivity, the war trolls leave it alone.

But how else could a thread about some trailer showing cinematics of a game and maybe a snippet of gameplay survive that long?

In my opinion, MGS4, Uncharted, LBP, Lair, Killzone 2... generate discussion because they leave quite a lot open to speculation, technology and gameplaywise.

Yes, crossplatform games are generally less interesting technologically.
They do have an aura of being less advanced graphically, and an exclusive game "could do so much more graphics and technology wise.

Which I think is true, and a natural cause why games that remain exclusive to one platform generate more interest and more discussion.

I don't think this needs to be twisted as something purely f*anboy driven.

 

[betan]

Why most write in the PS3 threads, becouse words like "best ever", "better than CGI", "better than reality", "only PS3 is capable of it" and so on attracts the attention. And if things are not like the comments said then hefty long discussions are created.

Good point. Now:

Didn't you call PGR4 best racer?
Did anyone troll in PGR4 thread after that?
Did you nitpick GT5 trailer?

I think it is no secret that number of clueless PS3 fanboys increased.
But the number of 360 hidden trolls are no less making a good match.

So I guess you are right, PS3 fanboys bring out the 360 trolls, hence PS3 threads' statistics.

 

[zed]

just looked at last 5 pages all threads with 10,000+

killzone2 34,833
littlebigplanet 13,865
heavenly sword 57,758
GTHD 43,475
lair 60,938
ratchet + klark 13,554
naughty dog 33,449
forza 2 87,466
killzone2 10,704
bioshock 14,233
motorstorm 76,187
gt prolouge 16,889
halo3 17,039

true overwelming ps3, but funnily to note the least impressive graphically (forza2) has the most views.
some mightly impressive looking games there

 

[AlNom]

but funnily to note the least impressive graphically (forza2) has the most views.

But how many threads were there of Forza 2? IIRC, the other games have many more threads. The Forza 2 thread covers a variety of off-topic discussions, and it's a wonder that people didn't start individual threads for those discussions. And keep in mind that in your list, FM2 and Motorstorm are the only released games, each with the highest counts (not counting GT because it's... not a full/complete game in the same sense).

 

[Tap In]

I think the technology angel to the discussion extends more in PS3 threads mostly because people choose to seek out that info and use it as some sort of proof of the PS3's capability.

In X360 games there just as many interesting technologies being used but the average 360 user on this forum are A) not as tech savvy as some Ps3 owners/devs here B) do not feel the need to find and post the technical info as much so as to prove the machines capability. PS3 owners (or those interested in Sony) outnumber MS/360 users here and the Sony slanted viewers could not care less to know what the 360 can actually do under the hood (evidently) and therefore add nothing positive to the 360 threads.

It seems Sony devs (in blogs and interviews) like to trot out more tech "tidbits" also in an effort to fuel the "power" angle (at $599 you need to prove a viable difference after all) and that info gets posted (repeated) here more often. if anyone really cared about "Game tech" instead of PS3 tech you could find some amazing technical stuff being done in X360 games as well (yes even Halo3 ).

Joshua Luna was about the only poster who would/could bring capable info from the tech side about 360 games compared to all the PS3 devs/owners/fans on the board who may have similar knowledge.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

true overwelming ps3

But with good reason though, no?

killzone2 34,833 : Popular because of the controversy
littlebigplanet 13,865 : awesomely unique game in style, technological application, and game
heavenly sword 57,758 : Our local boys work!
GTHD 43,475 : One of the most popular franchises ever, with a reputation for looking fantastic, and always turns into GT is the world's best/worst car sim
lair 60,938 : Controversial thanks to Eggbricht's hyping!
ratchet + klark 13,554 : Developer reputation and technical prowess
naughty dog 33,449 : Same, plus it showcases some good stuff

These games have reasons to be popular, no? Not least because of the controversy they've attracted. A game that doesn't have a reason to be popular doesn't get the hits. So what XB360 or Wii titles have the same amount of reason to investigate them and then talk about them? Halo 3 definitely, but after looking at screenshots there's nothing to say. If the devs were saying 'this is the greatest game ever and only the power of the XB360 makes it possible' then there'd be a lot more talk surrounding the title. Bioshock is on the list for it's merits as a game. Mario gets a look in, and everyone can nod at it's art direction, and then what else is there to say? The rest of the games, like the rest of PS3's library, don't make it because they're nothing 'special' with no room to either argue over the controversial aspects, or talk about the amazing new things being done.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

It seems Sony devs (in blogs and interviews) like to trot out more tech "tidbits" also in an effort to fuel the "power" angle (at $599 you need to prove a viable difference after all) and that info gets posted (repeated) here more often. if anyone really cared about "Game tech" instead of PS3 tech you could find some amazing technical stuff being done in X360 games as well (yes even Halo3 ).

If XB360 developers are providing such info, then it should be being brought into the forum by those who follow that. Either the devs are not saying anything interesting, or what they are saying isn't being introduced to the forum. I'd love to read more on use of Xenos and what Xenon is managing, but I'm not going to scour the 'net for it! B3D is my Reader's Digest of all things console-technology, and I hope whenever there is a worthwhile tech piece on XB360, it'll appear here.

 

[Neb]

Good point. Now:

Didn't you call PGR4 best racer?
Did anyone troll in PGR4 thread after that?
Did you nitpick GT5 trailer?

Didn't you call PGR4 best racer?

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1031163&postcount=106
"My opinion is that this race track (the ss above) with the weather effects including thunder is better than most if not all "BS" reeleased for this game so far.
The water effects on the car and the water puddles on the ground that react to the vechicle (dynamic fluid or simulation of it?) just adds to the game. Maybe some "BS" looked better since I haven't seen all ss of the game but doesn't change that I think this is the best looking car game so far."

Did anyone troll in PGR4 thread after that?

Someone was questioning if the ingame play video was real which it was and the video link is there!

Did you nitpick GT5 trailer?

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1031933&postcount=546
"Here are some more screenshots with several cars and one car in large size. BS shots but atleast they show some mighty impressive detail and several cars!"

So what was it you where asking about, and dont forget to check the post timedate!