What, no thread about the official Wii U release date and prices?

[Sonic]

Being different is a good thing, I'm tired of endless clones...
Offer me something new, I've been a gamer for over 20 years now, doing yet again the same things are getting old

(I'm also a PC gamer so the console must offer something unique my PC doesn't.)

You'll find larger variety of games on PS360 than the Wii had to offer, and probably a wider variety of games on MS and Sony's next consoles compared to Wii U. Nintendo does bring out interesting and unique games for its systems, but then it gives us rehash after rehash of Mario and Zelda to go along with it. Even though those sequels are usually worth playing.

 

[Grall]

It's Nintendo.

Online is not a priority to them.

While it's an easy conclusion, I just can't make myself accept that nintendo could be that isolated. They KNOW that people value online stuff, that it's an ever increasingly important aspect of everyday life. Simply intoning to themselves that they're going to pretend that this aspect of gaming - and society as a whole! - doesn't exist, and then hope for the best is going to be very problematic at best. Particularly in the coming years; Wuu is going to be the main platform for nintendo for the foreseeable time after all unless there's a virtual boy-like fiasco waiting for wuu around the corner (which I think is unlikely.)

Beginning with the SNES? I take it you mean them no longer having a quasi illegal monopoly on the market?

While SNES may have outsold the Megadrive, it did not outsell the NES. The SNES era also set a new high bar record for nintendo arrogance and contempt, which directly led to the double whammy of the arguable partial failure of the N64 on one hand, and Sony taking nintendo's gaming king cake away from them and eating it on the other.

I'd say their downfall began with the idiotically designed N64(Not referring to the processors, rather the lack of disc drive and that ungodly fucking controller).

Eh. While the three-prong design wasn't the best of ideas (and neither was the design of the analog stick itself which tended to slowly wear down into plastic dust), the N64 controller was still way easier to use when playing first-person shooters than a dual analog controller. I've handled way, way worse controllers, starting with the Intellivision, onwards to Atari Jaguar, and others...

When talking N64 weaknesses, personally, the controller isn't the first complaint I'd make.

 

[fearsomepirate]

I almost bought a Wii. Then Nintendo abandoned it to pursue the 3DS (another vanity product; it only exists because Miyamoto is obsessed with 3D), and it was clear to me the console had peaked already.

Wii U is just continuing the decline. Hopefully the failure will make them reexamine what works and what doesn't, why Wii Sports was a smash hit and why Nintendoland is DOA.

While it's an easy conclusion, I just can't make myself accept that nintendo could be that isolated. They KNOW that people value online stuff, that it's an ever increasingly important aspect of everyday life. Simply intoning to themselves that they're going to pretend that this aspect of gaming - and society as a whole! - doesn't exist, and then hope for the best is going to be very problematic at best.

Nintendo is making online a priority. They're not making online multiplayer a priority. See, you have to understand that some of their top people consider themselves super-geniuses. So to them, the true potential of the Internet hasn't been realized yet because they haven't thought of some "innovative," wacky idea for it yet. Furthermore, the things people are already doing with the Internet are pedestrian and lame, destined to be launched into obscurity once their super-genius game gods do their work. How do they know? Simple. Was online multiplayer Miyamoto's idea? No. Is anyone surprised when a game can be played online? No. Therefore it's not that big a deal.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Being different is a good thing, I'm tired of endless clones...

Being different != being good in itself. Some standards exist because they are the best implementation, and deviating from them is just causing hassle. There's no benefit to using wired headsets, so Nintendo should have learnt from the rest of the industry. I can see how operating in deliberate isolation can help avoid picking up other people's ideas, but it seems as if Nintendo are more burying their head in the sand. The expectations are such that they'll use things like randomised Friend Codes when everyone else is using singular network identities, and that I can't trust their online solution will cater to my and most other conventional gamers' needs. The best Nintendo could do would be to combine their original thinking with the best the rest of the industry has to offer.

 

[Rodéric]

Sure different is not necessarily good, and I'm surprised about the headset thing, but I'll wait to know how it really goes.
But yes Nintendo does things a bit oddly at times, not sure why...

 

[tuna]

If Nintendo can offer accessable fun for the whole family (which is what I think they should aim for) they might find a market. But in a time where a hardcore portable gaming machine (PS Vita) does not sell, maybe WiiU will not sell either.

But it is not like Nintendo really has any choices. They could make a push for online, but what would that get them? Their priority is offline multiplayer, and the WiiU is quite uniquely positioned for that.

 

[(((interference)))]

If the Wii U bombs, maybe Nintendo will end up like Sega and just become a games publisher for MS and Sony consoles. Then everyone wins.

See if the Wii U isn't a success, I don't think Nintendo will be able to easily change tack and adopt MS/Sony's strategy to compete head on. As I'm not sure they'd be able to build a console competitive with Sony and MSs offerings as they've been out of that race for too long now.

Especially given how everything is trending towards convergent devices that are part of complex ecosystems, and which Microsoft (and to a lesser degree) Sony both have, unlike Nintendo, which lacks any kind of business other than games.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

If the Wii U bombs, maybe Nintendo will end up like Sega and just become a games publisher for MS and Sony consoles. Then everyone wins.

Doubt that. With the hardware that is in that box they will still make money even if they only sell 20 ~ 30 million units. Even GC earned them money.

I don't agree with everybody winning if nintendo needs to ever go 3rd party. Nintendo came up with a lot of great hardware ideas and withouth them i'd probably be ms and sony going: moooaar powerrrr most of the time.

See if the Wii U isn't a success, I don't think Nintendo will be able to easily change tack and adopt MS/Sony's strategy to compete head on. As I'm not sure they'd be able to build a console competitive with Sony and MSs offerings as they've been out of that race for too long now.

Well they tried that and it failed so I don't think they will be trying that again. Anyway they could easily build a console much more capable than sony and MS. You and me can do that too. All it takes is a bag of money and ibm/amd/nvidia phones numbers.

 

[Grall]

Anyway they could easily build a console much more capable than sony and MS. You and me can do that too. All it takes is a bag of money and ibm/amd/nvidia phones numbers.

Coming up with a box filled with powerful hardware is probably the easiest part. Then you need a development system for it, firmware with APIs for graphics rendering, file system and all that jazz, online stuff with account login and voice communications (*ahem!*) and messaging and stuff, preferably solid middleware support and so on and on...all of it stuff that nintendo's been at best ho-hum at, and typically crap.

Looking at how nintendo handled software updates for the wii is enough to make a grown man cry. It stores multiple versions of its firmware in on-board flash, which is used depending on the software title you run. There's no support for patching game executables, when severe bugs are found in certain titles (like Metroid: Other M, or Skyward Sword) the available choices are recalling the game or releasing an app to repair game saves.

Are we to assume that all of these deficiencies have been solved with the wuu? If not, what's to say they would be with a theoretical superduper powerbox? A console is only as good as the sum of all of its individual parts, and a very powerful piece of hardware that did not have an awesome devsystem and awesome APIs and so on would probably NOT be popular with third-party developers, and sales of the system would show that.

 

[Prophecy2k]

Are we to assume that all of these deficiencies have been solved with the wuu? If not, what's to say they would be with a theoretical superduper powerbox? A console is only as good as the sum of all of its individual parts, and a very powerful piece of hardware that did not have an awesome devsystem and awesome APIs and so on would probably NOT be popular with third-party developers, and sales of the system would show that.

This hasn't been true until this generation. But I do agree in essence, given that MS' entrance in to the market with the Xbox has raised the bar siginifantly, and in turn developer expectations regarding dev tools supplied by a platform holder.

In my view Nintendo don't understand any market except Japan, and moreso aren't really interested in any other market other than their home territory. To Nintendo, the rest of the world is just a big cash machine. They throw out a product designed for themselves and their home market, and if it sells internationally great, and if it doesn't... they don't really care, because they don't take significant risks. They never lose money on HW and so they can survive solely off their game and HW revenue generated in their home territory.

It's one thing that puzzles me about western die-hard Nintendo fans, as they invest themselves and their emotions into a company that clearly cares nothing for them. It's like watching a teenage girl infatuated with her older lover, who cares nothing for her and slaps her around whenever he feels like it. S'a damned shame

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

That ofcourse isnt true at all. The EU/US market is 5+ times larger than the Japanese market. Even if, relative, they would sell much more in Japan than in the EU/US, lets say 1/3 of everything they sell, they would still be crazy to ignore 2/3 of the market.

Your posts doesnt make much sense. Sure nintendo will likely screw up on things like online but are they doing so on purpose or do they really think this is the best way? I doubt they do it just to angry fans.

Besides, bad online doesnt equal wiiu (games) will suck. Especially Nintendo fans will be buying the console for Nintendo games and most of those games don't benefit from online. Personally I couldn't care less. These days I actually care much more about SP than MP. If if want to game online I use my pc.

 

[almighty]

The only time I use voice chat is during clan matches, apart from that my mic stays in the draw.

 

[fearsomepirate]

Nintendo doesn't understand the Japanese market, either.

The problem is there are really two Nintendos. In the first half of the Wii's life, we saw a Nintendo that focused like a laser on what consumers wanted and needed. This is the Nintendo that also produced hit products like the Game Boy and DS.

The other Nintendo is what emerges as they get comfortable and start leading the market. It's the Nintendo of Shigeru Miyamoto and Eiji Aonuma--the Nintendo that exists solely to bring their "brilliant" ideas to market. If these ideas fail in the marketplace, it's because the consumer needs to be educated about how brilliant the product truly is. This is the Nintendo of failed products like Wii Music and Metroid: Other M.

The problem is we really only see the first Nintendo when their backs are against the wall, after the second Nintendo has almost driven them into the ground. And once the first Nintendo succeeds, Miyamoto says, "That's fine; I'll take over from here." And then he proceeds to destroy the company again.

Look at the difference between the Wii and the Wii U. When Nintendo explained the Wii, they were constantly talking about their research into why many people never played video games. The Wii remote happened because market research led them to the controller as the chief barrier. It really wasn't about some "amazing gameplay" idea Miyamoto had. With the Wii U, we are hearing once again about all these supposedly wonderful ideas Miyamoto has. Not once have we heard, "And our research has led us to conclude that the reason people didn't buy the Gamecube is because the controller didn't have a big ass screen in the middle." And that's because the Wii U doesn't exist to satisfy some glaring consumer need or solve some key consumer problem. It exists to delight Shigeru Miyamoto and give him a new gadget to play with.

 

[Prophecy2k]

That ofcourse isnt true at all. The EU/US market is 5+ times larger than the Japanese market. Even if, relative, they would sell much more in Japan than in the EU/US, lets say 1/3 of everything they sell, they would still be crazy to ignore 2/3 of the market.

Your posts doesnt make much sense. Sure nintendo will likely screw up on things like online but are they doing so on purpose or do they really think this is the best way? I doubt they do it just to angry fans.

Besides, bad online doesnt equal wiiu (games) will suck. Especially Nintendo fans will be buying the console for Nintendo games and most of those games don't benefit from online. Personally I couldn't care less. These days I actually care much more about SP than MP. If if want to game online I use my pc.

I didn't say that they ignore the US/EU markets. Rather they are completely incapable of figuring out the wants and needs of those markets, and how to effectively cater to those consumers in order to maximise their business in thse regions.

Unlike other japanese games companies who at least make attempts to do this, Nintendo simply seem disinterested in trying, and simply carry-on focussing on pandering to their home market, in the hope that something will click and take-off internationally.

 

[Arwin]

They had quite a lot of trouble getting the Wii U controller to work at all. I think they just didn't have the time - they managed to get the webcam on the Wii U to work and round trip to the console and back into the displayed graphics in minimal time. It makes sense to believe that the Wii U pad, having a built in mic and camera, can be used for these things by default and that online experiences can rely on the user havnig a Wii U pad for him or herself.

So personally, I don't blame them. As for the in-gmae voice chat not being implemented, that's just like Sony, isn't it? It both does and does not make sense, depending on where your priorities are. I personally think they'd be better off if they did include it by default, though, but I am not surprised. There's a very tiny window where 360 owners would buy a Wii U as a replacement for their 360 in the first place if you ask me (never mind that they'd then have to do so en-masse), let alone wonder about monthly fees or whatever to cover the cost of exensive online services.

 

[Blazkowicz]

When talking N64 weaknesses, personally, the controller isn't the first complaint I'd make.

The N64 controller had a fatal flaw with the joystick being unreliable, well it didn't fail but aged dramatically, even over just a year, it would make noises and have all that gravelly feel. The stick eroded and littered itself with tiny particles of plastic.
Had Nintendo spent one cent more on the joystick I'd might still be keeping an N64 around it was a nice console for multiplayer.

 

[tuna]

Nintendo doesn't understand the Japanese market, either.

The problem is there are really two Nintendos. In the first half of the Wii's life, we saw a Nintendo that focused like a laser on what consumers wanted and needed. This is the Nintendo that also produced hit products like the Game Boy and DS.

The other Nintendo is what emerges as they get comfortable and start leading the market. It's the Nintendo of Shigeru Miyamoto and Eiji Aonuma--the Nintendo that exists solely to bring their "brilliant" ideas to market. If these ideas fail in the marketplace, it's because the consumer needs to be educated about how brilliant the product truly is. This is the Nintendo of failed products like Wii Music and Metroid: Other M.

The problem is we really only see the first Nintendo when their backs are against the wall, after the second Nintendo has almost driven them into the ground. And once the first Nintendo succeeds, Miyamoto says, "That's fine; I'll take over from here." And then he proceeds to destroy the company again.

Look at the difference between the Wii and the Wii U. When Nintendo explained the Wii, they were constantly talking about their research into why many people never played video games. The Wii remote happened because market research led them to the controller as the chief barrier. It really wasn't about some "amazing gameplay" idea Miyamoto had. With the Wii U, we are hearing once again about all these supposedly wonderful ideas Miyamoto has. Not once have we heard, "And our research has led us to conclude that the reason people didn't buy the Gamecube is because the controller didn't have a big ass screen in the middle." And that's because the Wii U doesn't exist to satisfy some glaring consumer need or solve some key consumer problem. It exists to delight Shigeru Miyamoto and give him a new gadget to play with.

Thank you for educating us about the inner workings of Nintendo. It is always good to hear from someone who know who does what at Nintendo and similar companies.

And if you think that market research can lead to an integrated HW/SW product like Wii with Wii Sports, you are quite mistaken. Market research can tell you that a lot of people think that current input methods are very complicated and frightening. It cannot tell you what to design instead.

 

[Blazkowicz]

Voice chat is intrusive and brings insults, foul language and all kind of trash talk. Headset is another thing to buy too.
Why not a bit of keyboard chat on the Wii U.

 

[I.S.T.]

Voice chat is like any communication method(Including the internet): its quality depends on who you are chatting with.

 

[fearsomepirate]

Thank you for educating us about the inner workings of Nintendo. It is always good to hear from someone who know who does what at Nintendo and similar companies.