Was the minimum framerate in Halo single player <30?

I can pull up quotes from some Capcom big wigs if you want to see backing to this
You mean, from Mikami's radio interview where he whined because his latest GC game (RE:remake) sold poorly compared to Square's 'inferior' Kingdom Hearts, and then proceeded to openly bash Sony? That was pretty funny and pathetic in the same time :LOL:

and they even managed to ship a dead AV cable to me with my latest purchase(again, things that have all been covered
And behold - they shipped their every product that my friends and I own, in a completely perfect condition! :oops:

My anectotal evidence is stronger than yours!
 
bullshit cybermerc, bullshit. There's a difference between patching a game, and patching a utility you have to install anyway to connect to the net.
 
More patching:

http://ina-community.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=250597

Hi folks,

I just wanted to drop you guys a note on the planned update (fixes for exploits) and thereby opening an option for other fixes as well that we have for you.

Although Unreal Championship can be patched to fix exploits, this is not by all means an easy task. I will not go into detail here other then saying that it is not the same situation like updates for PC based games. I will also go on and say that we do listen to our public and are in fact working hard to make sure that you have an awesome time playing our games.

So, I will have you know that there is some substantial work put into the upcoming patch that will fix some exploits that people have listed on this board. Some things were known (stats for instance) and some things just came up through the woodwork.

I will list the things that we are looking at right now.

- Exploit: Stats. Yes we know that it was a flimsy solution and that people would of course take advantage of it. Time constraints worked against us here.
With the upcoming patch, first time players against bots will give get a certain amount of points (fairly low). As your skill improves bots will start to give you less and less points. See it as you're leveling up in the game. So at first the bots will give you points so that you're at least ranked enough that you don't have to be ashamed of your skills, later on this will become a very very small amount. At this point you can play all you want against bots instead of real players in an attempt to get your rank higher but that will be an utter waste of time.

- Exploit: Balancing of teams. Again coming from the PC where split screen does not exist which means this code had to be written from scratch over top of the Unreal code, these issues of teams not being balanced in certain situations fell in-between the cracks. This is being worked on as we speak. This has proven to be somewhat hairy but we are cutting it neatly for you guys.

- Exploit: Crazy moves like getting outside of boundaries of maps (you have no idea how long we tried getting out of maps in our attempt to close all holes) and TAG Rifle exploits. These seem logical and do not require further explanation other then these things do suck and will be fixed.


Here is the adjustment list that we are working on. In fixing the exploits, we also got presented with the opportunity to adjust some of the other issues that people had.

- Adjustment: Frame rate issues. Even though we went to great pains to give you the best frame rate possible by redesigning the levels that were shared with UT2003 (not dumbed down!!) among many other things, when there are intense battles with lots of bots on screen things do get a bit hot under the hood. These are consequences that come with a high detailed worlds and stem from the problem that a) the bots are using a fair amount of CPU time. Hey if you want them to be smart they need some CPU time. I see you walking around with just 3 neurons... b) overdraw. This happens when many many particle effects/decals get drawn over and over and over top of each other. Even 2gig machines will bog down when this happens. Together with Anti Aliasing where the scene gets a special treatment to reduce the jagged edges this works even less in your favour. We are planning for players to have an option (a controller key combination) to turn AA off. Plus there are also smaller (but they do help!) optimizations that together will give you a fair amount of boost in your performance.

- Adjustment. Real-time voice control. We are looking into it. Remember that we will not allow the game to be lagging because some guy is spamming the pipe with useless info. If 16 players talk at the same to each other time the bandwidth usage is just massive, hence the implementation of the channels. Again, I am not going into the nightmare technical detail of this problem.


So here you go, I hope that these things will ease your mind although I am sure you are just as impatient as me and can’t wait to get this stuff to get in there.


-P

Still going to make ridiculous excuses Quincy? This patch will even adress performance issues like any other PC game. M$' true face is showing more and more for each passing day. Sad to see so many get fooled.
 
Who the fuck was making excuses? Cybermerc, if you weren't such a troll, you'd be able to see things a clear as day. Internet games get patches or updates to fix ways people exploit the games. Why don't you spend some of your precious time digging up articles about the bug fixes made to final fantasy online for PS2, as well as Phantasy star on the dreamcast.

Of course you won't do that becuase you're a troll, nothing more.

M$' true face is showing more and more for each passing day

Trolling... :rolleyes: yes, MS true face really came out when Final fantasy online went live with tons of bugs and problems on the PS2. :rolleyes:
 
anyway lies are just usual business practices for microsoft.

just from memory:

they used to claim IIS was the first HHTP server manageable using HTTP when netscape was doing that for ages.. they claimed xbox was the first console with 4 joystick ports, they produced faked video "evidence" at the trial...

how can one put much faith in their claims is beyond my understanding.
 
Generally I don't care for patches... but in an online game you're going to need to do some game balancing sometimes because you can't anticipate every situation and every play style.

And it's great that they are listening to their customers and putting in an option to turn off AA for framerate... a lot of UT players were pissed about that.
 
Some people here are the biggest hypocrites. They chastise MS for something in the console biz that other companies have also allowed or done in the past, yet it's always MS that's ruining the console biz.

Was MS the first to allow updates/patches for online consle games? No.

Regular offline consles games? no patches. Online console games, its needed. the day you see a offline consle game get patched, really IS the day they are lying.
 
Qroach:

> Why don't you spend some of your precious time digging up articles
> about the bug fixes made to final fantasy online for PS2, as well as
> Phantasy star on the dreamcast.

FFXI was patched and yes that was very unfortunate. PSO obviously wasn't. I'm not sure what Sega did with the DC version but the Cube version was replaced free of charge.

> Of course you won't do that becuase you're a troll, nothing more.

I am merely conveying the truth. I'm sorry your feeble, indoctrinated mind is unable to accept that. I feel for you, I truly do. You live your live with blinders on. Even horses do not have such cruel fates.

> MS true face really came out when Final fantasy online went live with
> tons of bugs and problems on the PS2.

Who's trolling? How about dealing with the issue at hand rather than levelling attacks at competing products?

The sad thing is that while you can name one product on a different system that has been patched there have already been three games for Xbox receiving similar treatment (that we know of).

Now I can appreciate that the process is fairly transparent on the Xbox and I'm not unwilling to admit that with online games it'll be virtually impossible to ship a product without weaknesses that can be exploited. But M$ is lowering the standard console owners have come to expect by also allowing performance fixes. I foresee that patching will be the norm with Xbox games rather than the exception and that it will also extend to offline titles.

The whole situation is even more absurd because of the fact that M$ reps (J Allard wasn't the only one) promised that they would never allow patching on the Xbox - hell, it wouldn't even be needed. In their desperate attempt to convince everyone that Xbox wasn't a PC they willfully mislead the public. Hardly surprising (to those with some common sense) but despicable nonetheless.
 
FFXI was patched and yes that was very unfortunate. PSO obviously wasn't. I'm not sure what Sega did with the DC version but the Cube version was replaced free of charge.

oh, so it's just unfortunate? It's not sony ruining the entire game industry with buggy games? PSO on the DC worked the same way. So, that's just as bad as not releasing the first version with the same fixes. The same thing you and others seem so intent on point out is MS "lying" as you like to foolishly put it.

I am merely conveying the truth. I'm sorry your feeble, indoctrinated mind is unable to accept that. I feel for you, I truly do. You live your live with blinders on. Even horses do not have such cruel fates.

LOL! ya know what's even funnier, a person like yourself (an obvious troll/fanboi) calling someone else feeble minded? :LOL: That is really rich! tell me, when you take your blinders off and end up with all three consoles in front of you. I doubt it will happen anytime soon.

Who's trolling? How about dealing with the issue at hand rather than levelling attacks at competing products?

Attacks at competing products? This is a prime example of how blind you really are! if you can't see the simularities in between other online console games that have obviously had problems and or upgrades to fix issues, then you are blind. once again, you clearly ignore what i've been saying. How is MS runing the game industry by releasing buggy online games when the same thing has happened on the other two consles that have attempted to go online in a big way? Answer the question.

The sad thing is that while you can name one product on a different system that has been patched there have already been three games for Xbox receiving similar treatment (that we know of).

Three? um, hello which three games are those? Actually don't btoher answering since you'll just make a game up more than likely.

But M$ is lowering the standard console owners have come to expect by also allowing performance fixes. I foresee that patching will be the norm with Xbox games rather than the exception and that it will also extend to offline titles.

bullshit. You have nothing to base that on at all, because there aren't any patches to fix problems in offline games, and never will be. They have only released add-ons for a few offline titles, and that's it. it's been over a year since xbox was released and yet NO patches forANY offline games.

The whole situation is even more absurd because of the fact that M$ reps (J Allard wasn't the only one) promised that they would never allow patching on the Xbox - hell, it wouldn't even be needed.

For one thing, he was talking about off line games. Everyone but a fe people I guess, knows that online games are the exception when it comes to patching/bug fixing. that is not going to change, doesn't matter what consle it is. I'm sure sony said the same thing when they released the hard drive in japan and said games could be installed. Who cares, perhaps you need to play some video games instead of bitching about things you don't even own.

also learn to use quotes! It's not that bloddy difficult...
 
Qroach:

> It's not sony ruining the entire game industry with buggy games?

When patching becomes as widespread on the PS2 as it is on the Xbox then we can talk about Sony ruining the game industry. I think it's worth pointing out that since Sony launched it's broadband adapter on May 16 last year (same day FFXI came out) only one game has been patched for PS2 while Xbox has had three patched games in less than two months.

> The same thing you and others seem so intent on point out is MS "lying"
> as you like to foolishly put it.

M$ said that games for Xbox would never be patched. That was clearly false. Sony in comparison has made no such claims.

> if you can't see the simularities in between other online console games
> that have obviously had problems and or upgrades to fix issues, then
> you are blind. once again

Only one console game prior to those on Xbox has been patched. But the discussion is not about Sony. You're simply evading the subject because your bias makes you unable to deal with criticism levelled towards M$.

> How is MS runing the game industry by releasing buggy online games
> when the same thing has happened on the other two consles that have
> attempted to go online in a big way?

What does AA have to do with a game being online and could stuff like voice control not have been implemented before the game shipped? Also, the Digital Extremes guy clearly states that they shipped the game knowing that there was a weakness that would be exploited. Ship now and patch later... just like on a PC.

> Three? um, hello which three games are those?

MotoGP, Ghost Recon and now Unreal Championship - and that's just what has slipped out. It's not like the fixes are documented online.

> You have nothing to base that on at all

Anyone with some common sense can see where this is leading.

> because there aren't any patches to fix problems in offline games, and
> never will be.

J Allard and others said no Xbox game would ever be patched and look where we are today. You can keep making excuses and say that it only applies to offline games but J Allard mentioned no such exception.

> For one thing, he was talking about off line games.

If so he was lying as he failed to mention that.

> I'm sure sony said the same thing when they released the hard drive in
> japan and said games could be installed.

No. And stop changing the topic. Sony's actions do not excuse M$'.

> Who cares, perhaps you need to play some video games instead of
> bitching about things you don't even own.

You clearly care or you wouldn't be making excuses or try to change the topic (first Sony and now me).

> also learn to use quotes! It's not that bloddy difficult...

This way is faster and has the added bonus of annoying you.
 
Sony of Japan I have more QC complaints with then any company in any country in any industry in the world. SCEA's software validation I don't have a problem with.

What gripes do you have Sony Japan?

Generally I don't care for patches... but in an online game you're going to need to do some game balancing sometimes because you can't anticipate every situation and every play style.

I gotta agree with Ozymandis on this one. Patches aside, persistent online games are also going to need expansions to keep and maintain player interests...
 
Someone want to explain to me why anyone would complain about the "patches"?

The "patches" so far as they exist on Xbox Live are painless and still nothing like the PC version. Before you connect, it just tells you an update is available, and a couple seconds (quite literally in the case of MotoGP, the only game I have that has been "patched") it's done and you connect.

It's also wise to note that the only games which have been "patched" have been patched for multiplayer purposes only, the main problems are sync issues. No one has done something like Xbox Live before, there are going to be issues, and being able to work around them is a strength of the design, not a weakness...
 
When patching becomes as widespread on the PS2 as it is on the Xbox then we can talk about Sony ruining the game industry. I think it's worth pointing out that since Sony launched it's broadband adapter on May 16 last year (same day FFXI came out) only one game has been patched for PS2 while Xbox has had three patched games in less than two months.

For one thing, get your bloddy facts striaght. So far NO patches have been released for xbox games and only two games are recieving any sort of patch, while one of those isn't even patching the game, it's patching the xbox live software. You wanna explain to me again how patching is so wide spread? You're spreading mor BS and FUD.

M$ said that games for Xbox would never be patched. That was clearly false.

no offline game (obviously) would be patched. They didn't say anything about online games becuase online is a totally different story. At that point MS was talking strickly about offline games.

Only one console game prior to those on Xbox has been patched. But the discussion is not about Sony. You're simply evading the subject because your bias makes you unable to deal with criticism levelled towards M$.

the discuassion is about MS ruingin the quality of the game industry by allowing online games to be patched. Something that has clearly been done before MORE than once. I'm not 'evading anything" you're simply refusing to acknowledge something that is as plain as day. If any online games before xbox recieved patches (or sent users new disks) then it is CLEAR that MS isn't ruining or lowering the quality level of anything.

What does AA have to do with a game being online and could stuff like voice control not have been implemented before the game shipped? Also, the Digital Extremes guy clearly states that they shipped the game knowing that there was a weakness that would be exploited. Ship now and patch later... just like on a PC.

You're not making any sense. This is an online game, of course it's going to ship with some weaknesses, almost ALL online games ship with problems.

MotoGP, Ghost Recon and now Unreal Championship - and that's just what has slipped out. It's not like the fixes are documented online.

Um, and what patch has motoGP recieved? the only thing I saw is that the xbox live software needed to be brought up to the latest version. i didn't see anythign about a patch being released for this game. ghost recon (will be) the same story. they aren't patching the game , they are patching the connectivity software. look like you're down to one game that hasn't actually recieved a patch yet. jumping the gun as usual.

Anyone with some common sense can see where this is leading.

Well then that's not you, sinc eyou don't have an ounce of common sense.


And stop changing the topic. Sony's actions do not excuse M$'.

When sony also has problems releasing online games, they aren't lowering the quality of the consle biz. When MS also has problems they ARE lowering the quality in the console biz. I can see your fud clearly. little to no common sense at all.

You clearly care or you wouldn't be making excuses or try to change the topic (first Sony and now me).

I haven't changed the topic at all. the only thing I care about is when a troll goes about spreading FUD (like yourself). you always seem to have problems with xbox even though you don't own one or even use one. That's precisely why you shouldn't care.

This way is faster and has the added bonus of annoying you.

I just think it look idiotic, that all. You trying to explain how MS is lowering the quality level in the game industry and you can't even use a simple code to properly quote people.
 
Glonk, he's just a troll. I'm not going to bother responding anymore to his BS after this post. Anyone that complains about the quality of games on a console they don't own, should just be ignored.
 
What gripes do you have Sony Japan?

QC of their products. Dead consoles, my most recent experience with a new Sony console had a dead AV cable out of the box brand new(Christmas gift for one of my kids). I've also had multiple PSXs die on me. My ColecoVision still works for a bit of comparison on that front. Their controllers are shoddy also, at least for the PSX, although that wouldn't be a major issue if not for the rest of the console crapping out along with it.

TVs- although I haven't purchased a Sony TV in quite a while, one of my buddies picked up a new 32" Wega in the summer of '01, it's already dead. Sony, of course, wouldn't do a thing about it to fix it, it lasted a whole couple of months beyond the warranty. He brought the TV in to a repair shop and they told him it was going to run ~$800 to fix it, and that it was quite common with Sony's

Optical drives- Besides all of the problems with their consoles, I've also replaced several dead Sony optical drives out of PCs. I wouldn't consider this a major issue except for the age of them. Most of the units I've replaced were less then three years old.

VCRs- Again, frequently crapping out long before comparable offerings. Eating tapes, heads shot(require constant cleaning, even the ones with 'self cleaning heads'), and eventually failure regularly within a few years.

PCs- Don't have a lot of experience with them, but the one I've had to work on(well, I do it for people I know for free) for one of my friends had a shot power supply. This was a Vaio that had no upgrades at all and was a P3 GHZ PC- it wasn't that old. Also a lousy Win install with far too many TSRs at boot but that is normal for OEM boxes(just another gripe).

Surround sound system- Brand new DD/DTS setup I was hooking up for someone has the front right speaker channel shot out of the box under any Surround mode(it worked fine on the stereo modes however). This wasn't a real high end unit, cost the guy ~$600 IIRC, but at least it happened under warranty and he was able to return it and pick up another brand.

These are only relatively recent experiences I've had with Sony. In my younger days I used to buy Sony nearly exclusively until their quality started to tank coinciding with their rise in prices(relative to the competition). Sony charges a premium price and their durability has been worse then Matsushita's crap GoldStar brand(which tends to cost ~1/2 to 1/3 of comparable Sony offerings). Panasonic, Toshiba, Mitsubishi, JVC, ProScan, I've not had any major problems with components from any of these companies that were three years old or less while I expect, and have been batting pretty near 100% on my expectations, Sony products to have some sort of major failure within that time frame.

With all of that said, I think SCEA has done an extremely good job with their QC. I have respect for their ability, even if I don't for their counterparts across the Pacific.

No one has done something like Xbox Live before

You mean, besides Sega's multiple consoles they had on networks?
 
You mean, besides Sega's multiple consoles they had on networks?
In what way was that like Xbox Live, aside from being online?

Funny enough, it's Sega's games that have most of the sync problems....NHL 2K3 in particular. ;)
 
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