The non-standard game interfaces discussion thread (move, voice, vitality, etc.)

[AzBat]

Did they say which 13 stores ?

Looks like 1up.com got the list...

• Macy's Herald Square
  151 West 34th Street
  New York, NY 10001
  212-494-5387
• Macy's South Coast Plaza
  33 Bristol Street
  Costa Mesa, CA 92626
  714-556-0611
• Macy's State Street
  111 North State Street
  Chicago, IL 60602
  312-781-3939
• Macy's Pleasanton
  1300 Stoneridge Mall Rd
  Pleasanton , CA, 94588
  925-463-3333
• Macy's Roosevelt Field
  630 Old Country Road
  Garden City, NY 11530
  516-746-8200
• Macy's Lenox Square Mall
  3393 Peachtree Road NorthEast
  Atlanta, GA 30326
  404-231-2845
• Macy's Valley Fair
  2801 Stevens Creek Boulevard
  Santa Clara, CA 95050
  408-248-3333
• Macy's Dadeland Mall
  7303 S.W. 88TH STREET
  Miami, FL 33156
  305-662-3566
• Macy's Tysons Corner
  8000 Tysons Corner Center
  McLean, VA 22102
  703-893-4900
• Macy's Easton Town Center
  4141 Easton Loop
  Columbus, OH 43219-6136
  614-342-2280
• Macy's SCOTTSDALE
  7014 East Camelback Rd
  Scottsdale , AZ, 85251
  480-840-0333
• Macy's Galleria Mall
  5135 West Alabama Street
  Houston, TX
  832-667-4410
• Macy's Bellevue Proper
  400 Bellevue Square
  Bellevue , WA, 98004
  425-688-6076

Too far for me.

Tommy McClain

 

[patsu]

Heh, I can go to the Valley Fair mall. They have an Apple Store, a SonyStyle shop and soon a Kinect demo.

 

[joker454]

Just visited the Microsoft store in Orange County down here in LA, and they had Kinect running in front of the store in the hall of the mall so it was impossible to miss. Two games were on, bowling and the breakout-ish game. It's open to anyone to try so if you want to try out Kinect just visit your local Microsoft store. What was most interesting to me was the throngs of people watching and the immense amount of fun the little ones were having playing the games. For the tech only people don't even bother, there were clearly glitches in the games so you won't be impressed. What was abundantly clear though was how little any tech issues mattered as the kids were having a great time as very amused parents watched on while they flailed away. Good stuff! The silly breakout game seemed particularly fun as the kids would scream and jump around, quite hilarious I'm starting to think they might have a huge hit with this thing if they can just price it right.

 

[patsu]

The same thing would apply to the original EyeToy and PSEye games. I had 8 kids over at my place, the instant they realized what the camera was doing, they swarmed towards the HDTV waving madly, pushing each other until the TV nearly toppled over. The adults at the party were amused (while I play the role of a riot police).

The battle is really in marketing and software for sustained usage. That's why some people were critical of Sony for not pushing EyeToy games years ago.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I dunno, at our local Best Buy in the States, they had a PS Eye demo setup when it launched in the states and even while the store was busy you'd have plenty of kids on the X360/PS3 (normal)/Wii/PSP/DS kiosks while the PS Eye demo area was always rather bare.

Not sure if it was the games that launched with PS Eye or other issues with the gameplay, but it just didn't strike a cord with anyone in my area. Seeing things like that, I could understand why people like Obonicus were (possibly still are) so skeptical of how Natal, now Kinect, would be received.

Regards,
SB

 

[patsu]

I dunno, at our local Best Buy in the States, they had a PS Eye demo setup when it launched in the states and even while the store was busy you'd have plenty of kids on the X360/PS3 (normal)/Wii/PSP/DS kiosks while the PS Eye demo area was always rather bare.

That's because of marketing and support issues. PS3 (PS Eye) does not run EyeToy games. In fact, the only trailer I saw was Eye of Judgment. You need a playmat and cards to demo it.

Not sure if it was the games that launched with PS Eye or other issues with the gameplay, but it just didn't strike a cord with anyone in my area.

PS3 launched at a high price. From Sony's perspective, it may not make sense to push casual games to the masses.

No software + No buzz + High price = No cord to strike.

If you have the right PS Eye games, you'd see similar enthusiasm with kids.

Now that they are in a better position, they can be more aggressive. Still not sure where Sony wants to shoot though.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I dunno, at our local Best Buy in the States, they had a PS Eye demo setup

What Joker's describing is the simple joy of bouncing around to control a character on screen, which PSEye didn't offer. Just goes to show what a huge ball Sony dropped by not marketing EyeToy in a similar way five years ago, getting passers-by to see themselves on TV and interact with the games. Although to be fair, EyeToy would have had issues with background movement, so probably wouldn't have worked so well outside of a somewhat organised presentation. That's the advantage of Kinect and its ability to ignore the background.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Aye, I can see that. And the strong use of primary colors and strong color contrasts will also appeal to the younger kids. Throw in them being able to see their movements reflected on screen, I can see why they might to go wild with the Kinect Breakout game.

Ah, and so with PS Eye it was kinda what I suspected, the launch lineup just wasn't particularly compelling.

Goes to show, you could have something with tons of potential but can't get people to see the fun in it, not going to do well.

Seems part of MS's strategy is going to be to get to the parents wallets through their kids.

Other than the Eye Pet game (that's a move title now right?) does Sony have much targetting kids? I suppose I should go take a look at the Move Games listed in the moves games thread. Haven't kept track of games for it much since it doesn't look like PS3 is going to come down to my price range this holiday season.

[edit] Looks like Sony is going to go hard after the established PS3/X360 core userbase. Wow, hadn't realized just how dedicated they are to going after that. Didn't see very many family and kid oriented titles though. So looks like two different attacks. Sony going after the core crowd (probably the safer bet) while MS is going after people that they haven't really targetted before. There's a few exceptions here and there, but looking at the bulk of both companies lineups, that's how it's looking.

Oddly it doesn't look like Sony is even trying very hard for the Wii crowd.

Regards,
SB

 

[patsu]

Although to be fair, EyeToy would have had issues with background movement, so probably wouldn't have worked so well outside of a somewhat organised presentation.

If they were to demo EyePet in public, they would want to set it up such that the camera is pointing towards a real or false wall.

EDIT:

Other than the Eye Pet game (that's a move title now right?) does Sony have much targetting kids?

In terms of game selection, they seem to be keeping to the "PS3 Does Everything" tag line. So all the usual suspects are there: dancing game, singing game, flailing game, sports game, pet game, drawing game, etc.

In terms of messaging, they are sticking to tech and game magazines, plus the occasional newspaper articles. So... definitely limiting their audience to gamer/tech families.

EDIT: Interesting Kinect and Move survey:
http://www.industrygamers.com/news/xbox-360s-kinect-gaining-appeal-among-non-360-gamers-finds-study/

Following the spotlight on motion controls at this year's E3, Ipsos OTX decided to take a look at consumers' attitudes towards the PlayStation Move and Kinect. It would seem that both motion platforms gained some slight traction from E3, with Microsoft's Kinect benefiting a slight bit more.

 

[obonicus]

Obonicus were

Nothing's changed my opinion so far. People who thought it was wonderful and should sell like hotcakes to begin with confirming their opinion that it'll be wonderful and should sell like hotcakes doesn't mean much to me.

 

[chris1515]

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2010/07/walmarts-200-kinect-bundle-hardware-30-gift-card-game.ars

A 200 dollars bundle kinect at Wallmart with a game and a 30 dollars gift card.

 

[Squilliam]

I don't get it. If the price is already out why not confirm it? If the price thats out isn't the real price why not confirm that its just a place-holder?

 

[AzBat]

I think MS have done enough to tell everybody that it's not an official price. Retailers are getting impatient waiting for MS to announce the price since they are already getting buzz from customers wanting to pre-order. I suspect Microsoft is wanting to wait till there is a major a public conference to announce price. Gamescom in August makes the most sense. Not sure they will make it before it gets leaked. I don't think any price announced so far is it.

Tommy McClain

 

[eastmen]

I think MS have done enough to tell everybody that it's not an official price. Retailers are getting impatient waiting for MS to announce the price since they are already getting buzz from customers wanting to pre-order. I suspect Microsoft is wanting to wait till there is a major a public conference to announce price. Gamescom in August makes the most sense. Not sure they will make it before it gets leaked. I don't think any price announced so far is it.

Tommy McClain

Gamestop ran out of preorders that they alotted themselves already. So its been cut off. I'm was told from a few manager friends at local game stops that they had 20 slots per store. They have 4,500 stores so rough math tells me that gamestop has presold 90 thousand kinects with the price at $150 . Now of course not all of these people will pick it up and some might just have preordered2 to try and sell and make money off the thing. But close to 100k from a single retailer is a pretty good preorder number or a $150 device.

 

[tha_con]

Oddly it doesn't look like Sony is even trying very hard for the Wii crowd.

Regards,
SB

Why would they? I think Microsoft may be making a huge mistake going after that market. It'll be tough to convince people in the "Wii" market to spend the money on either Kinect, or a whole Kinect/360 package. Sony is going after people who already own a PS3. They'll make a profit on both hardware and software for Move, and developer support will be much easier.

Anything can happen, but MS is taking a considerably bigger risk with technology that hasn't previously struck a cord with casual gamers.

 

[Squilliam]

I think MS have done enough to tell everybody that it's not an official price. Retailers are getting impatient waiting for MS to announce the price since they are already getting buzz from customers wanting to pre-order. I suspect Microsoft is wanting to wait till there is a major a public conference to announce price. Gamescom in August makes the most sense. Not sure they will make it before it gets leaked. I don't think any price announced so far is it.

Tommy McClain

Retailers huh... Well Gamescom is the date its just frustrating not knowing the official price with all these speculative retail listings. I want to try to figure out how it might impact the market but thats incredibly difficult without a price point to work off.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Even with a price it would still be difficult to estimate what impact this might have in the market.

With PS Move it's a whole lot easier to gauge how well it may do as it's going after basically the same audience that already has a PS3 or X360. Safe and conservative, you're upper ceiling may be lower but your risk is also lower.

With Kinect, MS is going way out on a limb pursuing a demographic that may or may not exist. If their market research is correct and there's a lot of people that would like to game on a console but are intimidated by the controls then 150 USD really isn't going to be a barrier.

If that market doesn't exist or is much smaller than they project, they may end up with only being attractive to kids and Wii owners. If that's the case then 150 USD might be a rather large barrier.

Thinking about Kinect pricing makes me think of that link that Assen gave in the thread about DLC. MS is going to have a limited amount of Kinects at launch (1 million? 2 million? who knows). If this is as revolutionary as MS imagines, it's going to be difficult to determine how much you can price it for while still selling out. Price it too low and you end up leaving tons of cash on the floor. Price it too high and you may end up hurting adoption.

I have a feeling they may be pricing it a tad high initially with a price cut for it in the next year. Holiday 2011, Kinect now at 99...or whatever.

Problem with that is, it only works if they can sell out this Holiday season. To create the perfect storm they need at least one compelling title, and then the unit to completely sell out leaving many customers wanting it but unable to buy it. And then feed demand just enough that it's never completely met. Sound familiar? It's part of what propelled Wii's rabid demand for a while.

Regards,
SB

 

[zed]

With PS Move it's a whole lot easier to gauge how well it may do as it's going after basically the same audience that already has a PS3 or X360. Safe and conservative, you're upper ceiling may be lower but your risk is also lower.

hmmm, I believe the safe bet would to do all the stuff that has succeeded on the wii, i.e. fitness etc stuff. most (if not all) eg conduit,red steel (well a huge long list) hardcore games on the wii have failed.
the safe conservative bet is like what I said what sony should do, make a golf game, make a tennis game etc. these will be million+ sellers

 

[Silent_Buddha]

hmmm, I believe the safe bet would to do all the stuff that has succeeded on the wii, i.e. fitness etc stuff. most (if not all) eg conduit,red steel (well a huge long list) hardcore games on the wii have failed.
the safe conservative bet is like what I said what sony should do, make a golf game, make a tennis game etc. these will be million+ sellers

There's certainly logic to that way of thinking. But it's also quite a safe bet to take a pointer control and then work it into an FPS/RTS/etc. Basically go to your current customers and say, this will let you play the game better.

Especially when you're just retro-fitting into current games or games currently in developement. That's about as conservative and safe as you can get. As games that were already well along in developement were already going to be made Move or not.

Developing a Wii type game around the Move controller would require a larger monetary investment in something which may or may not catch on. Thus more risky than just tacking Move onto existing core games in development.

This isn't to say there aren't games being made tailored around the Move controller, just that the vast majority of them are games that were already in developement and were going to get released regardless of whether Move had been invented. IE - a safe conservative strategy. And hope nobody takes that as a negative as I'm sure someone might. There's nothing wrong with playing it safe. Especially from Sony's POV with the hit and miss releases of Eye Toy (at least outside of the EU) and PSEye.

Regards,
SB

 

[dumbo11]

There's certainly logic to that way of thinking. But it's also quite a safe bet to take a pointer control and then work it into an FPS/RTS/etc. Basically go to your current customers and say, this will let you play the game better.

Especially when you're just retro-fitting into current games or games currently in developement. That's about as conservative and safe as you can get. As games that were already well along in developement were already going to be made Move or not.

Developing a Wii type game around the Move controller would require a larger monetary investment in something which may or may not catch on. Thus more risky than just tacking Move onto existing core games in development.

This isn't to say there aren't games being made tailored around the Move controller, just that the vast majority of them are games that were already in developement and were going to get released regardless of whether Move had been invented. IE - a safe conservative strategy. And hope nobody takes that as a negative as I'm sure someone might. There's nothing wrong with playing it safe. Especially from Sony's POV with the hit and miss releases of Eye Toy (at least outside of the EU) and PSEye.

Regards,
SB

That's a good summary.

Thinking about the Wii rip-offs, maybe that's an area that PSN/XBLA could be exploited?
Low budget, low cost, adequate graphics, great gameplay - isn't that a summary of what those markets try to achieve?