Sony VR Headset/Project Morpheus/PlayStation VR

Egmon83 said:
Carmack, who works for Oculus as a designer, and who was hired for PR purposes as well, has this to say:

https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/702561430151639040

he prefers
(2560*1440=)
3686400 RGB pixels, to (4096*2160=)8847360 pentile pixels
So John Carmack himself, prefers RGB pixels, even if the amount is 58% less than the 4K pentile alternative.

Now lets do the math for the upcoming VR devices:
PSVR (1920*1080) 2073600, Vive/Rift (2160*1200=) 2592000. In the PSVR case, the amount of pixels is only 20% less...

So while people might claim a lot of things on the internet, which is their right, i agree, ask yourself:
What would John Carmack prefer?
Click to expand...

He says he "might" prefer, not that he "does" Your math for pixels uses wider than 16:9 aspect ratio for 4k. Preferring 1440p RGB over 2160p pentile on a technical level probably isn't only because of their absolute observable quality levels, but also factoring in the render requirements.
 
Dr Evil said:
He says he "might" prefer, not that he "does" Your math for pixels uses wider than 16:9 aspect ratio for 4k. Preferring 1440p RGB over 2160p pentile on a technical level probably isn't only because of their absolute observable quality levels, but also factoring in the render requirements.
Click to expand...

The ability to see the pentile vs stripe as the pixels and space between them becomes smaller would also diminish.

a 4k 5.7 inch would give you a ppi of 772.95 vs the note 3 337.37ppi. Your getting more than double the pixels per and a dot pitch of .0753mm vs .0329mm. The note 5 which is a 5.7 inch quad hd with 2560x1440 would be 515.3ppi and a .0493mm dot pitch.

Of course your then as you say rendering much higher of a resolution of 3.68m vs 8.29m pixels that's a good reason to not want pentile.
 
You must consider each channel independently. That is the most intuitive way to compare. Pentile is clearly a good idea when it allows a resolution where all three channels are equal or superior to the available rgb alternative. You'll need twice the pixels for that, anything below becomes ambiguous. Anything similar in resolution gives a clear advantage to RGB.

The advantage of pixel pitch on each channel is ambiguous with 1080p rgb versus 1200p pentile (green+12%, red-27%, blue-27%) but the edge goes to rgb in most situations.
 
MrFox said:
You must consider each channel independently. That is the most intuitive way to compare. Pentile is clearly a good idea when it allows a resolution where all three channels are equal or superior to the available rgb alternative. You'll need twice the pixels for that, anything below becomes ambiguous. Anything similar in resolution gives a clear advantage to RGB.

The advantage of pixel pitch on each channel is ambiguous with 1080p rgb versus 1200p pentile (green+12%, red-27%, blue-27%) but the edge goes to rgb in most situations.
Click to expand...


In my post above I was comparing Pentile to pentile . The jump from the note 3 to a newer pentile would be bigger because the note 3 like the s4 screen had the larger blue pixel and the non diamond green pixel . Going forward we could see the red and blue shrink further.

But the main advantage of pentile is the higher resolution which will bring the pixels closer together. The better the pixel pitch / ppi the less of an issue you will see if the zoom stays the same.


Skip to 1:40 to see the comparison between the iPhone 6 and galaxy s5

the iPhone 6 is 1704x960 (lcd so its a stripe) vs the amoled s5 2560 x 1440 (diamond pentile)

The effect seen with the note 3 screen is diminished. That's cause that's an older pentile at 5.7inch 1080p vs the 5.3 inch 1440p with the new pentile.
 
this posted ? http://www.polygon.com/2016/3/9/11174194/the-making-of-playstation-vr

sony_vr_prototype.0.png
 
MrFox said:
If the 1.4x render target recommendation is accurate, it means we can assume the optics are also 1.4x magnification in the center. So there would be no advantages from the optics profile.

The efficiency advantages can only be optimizations exclusively possible with PSVR, excluding anything that can be done everywhere, like fixed foveation, hidden mesh area, etc..:
1. External audio processing, unified memory, and low level API would free up the CPU a bit.
2. +25% from lower resolution, but still better IQ compared to pentile 1200p.
3. +50% for most games that are 60->120 (compared to 90 native)
4. +30%??? from fixed hardware and low-level optimization advantages, no idea what this number should be.
-> some say it's 0%
-> Richard Marks reported 60% from middleware devs (context was just "don't assume it's like-for-like")
-> Phil Spencer said XB1 is as fast as a $700 GPU at the same resolution, so that would be +300% for Xbox. (he probably misspoke, bad messaging is the norm for MS)
-> if there's a consensus for some more reasonable number, I'm all ears

That would be around 2.4x for most games (with caveats), and the rest would be 1.6x if they need native 90fps.
Is this making sense?
Click to expand...

I think YantraVR is Tony Davidson of http://innervision-vr.com/

So he is unlikely to be making stuff up, but on the other hand neither do I think Sony have any "special sauce" to deal with barrel distortion.

My best guess therefore would be:

* I think Sony do have something in their SDK for Hidden Area Mesh Rendering. I think this is YantraVr's special technique.
* Sony optical warp is less extreme than OR and Vive so you can use a 1.0x render target at the developers discretion, but still less than ideal.

Damm, it would be good to know for sure instead of all this second-guessing.

This was posted at NeoGaf, seems less distortion on PSVR to my eyes BUT without them rendering the same scene its easy to fool yourself: http://i.imgur.com/sMXBeWF.jpg

P.S. I'm not disagreeing with Mr Fox's statement above, just putting this out there to see if we can make sense of it
 
Dr Evil said:
iphone 6 is 1334 x 750 and Galaxy S5 is 1920 x 1080...
Click to expand...
yes my bad. That's what happens when you post past bed time.

Still the point stands , the s5 uses the new diamond pentile and the effect is less than the older one. As dot pitch gets smaller it will be less noticiable with the same zoom as the pixels will get smaller
 
Are they putting a lot of processing power into the headunit? I really doubt the PS4 is anywhere near powerful enough to pull it off on it's own.
 
RobertR1 said:
Are they putting a lot of processing power into the headunit? I really doubt the PS4 is anywhere near powerful enough to pull it off on it's own.
Click to expand...

No the unit only separate signal to feed the TV screen and 3d audio all other things are done on PS4(rendering and reprojection)...
 
Last edited:
RobertR1 said:
Are they putting a lot of processing power into the headunit? I really doubt the PS4 is anywhere near powerful enough to pull it off on it's own.
Click to expand...
Powerful enough to pull what off, exactly? Clearly it can push games at 60fps which really is all it needs to be doing.
 
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