Rift, Vive, and Virtual Reality

[swaaye]

It sounds pretty nice to me. The controls sound somewhat questionable, but people have also been very vocal about how intolerable WMR controls are while I find them quite acceptable lol.

The OLED vs microLED topic is also interesting. He says dark scenes look better on Bigscreen's OLED. Does this mean Bigscreen is free of OLED smearing? From what I can tell the microLED panels are hugely superior to say the Reverb G2 LCD for contast ratio so microLED seems like a great compromise. It would be quite nice to have almost-OLED, be free of pentile, and no smearing.

Overall though I wish he could say the FOV was noticeably improved over the Index, not about the same. And I also wish the PC VR gaming library appeared to have some kind of future.

 

[GhostofWar]

Sadleyitsbradley in his latest valve datamining video seems to think deckard is going to be marketed by valve as a spatial computing device similar to apple vr. He also thinks it's going to have a built in mode where you can play normal games in VR again similar to what apple have shown.

 

[xz321zx]

Big if true, >RT importance IMHO as far gaming is concerned.
Sub 100gram over 100° headset will be some holy grail and relentlessly pursued.

 

[cheapchips]

Big if true, >RT importance IMHO as far gaming is concerned.
Sub 100gram over 100° headset will be some holy grail and relentlessly pursued.

Not sure what point you're making with regards to a 3 month old deckard update?

 

[GhostofWar]

Big if true, >RT importance IMHO as far gaming is concerned.

If your referring to the eye tracking you can go look at the dfr performance in the crystal reviews or some older varjo ones where they use openxr toolkit to get dfr going in games, or redmatter 2 on quest pro. It seems to be about a 10% to 20% perf increase in scenarios where it's gpu bound, which is pretty much what Carmack was saying about it a while back.

 

[xz321zx]

If your referring to the eye tracking you can go look at the dfr performance in the crystal reviews or some older varjo ones where they use openxr toolkit to get dfr going in games, or redmatter 2 on quest pro. It seems to be about a 10% to 20% perf increase in scenarios where it's gpu bound, which is pretty much what Carmack was saying about it a while back.

I wasn't ever convinced about perf improvement by 2D resolution scaling ( or 2D coarse shading eg. VRS), I consider that a very naive/ ill-fitting approach. I'm rather interested taking 2012 pre-PBR (pre-physically based rendering) games and taking a long look at "what-if" scenarios if PBR wasn't necessarily the choice but stylish games with 3D fog,scattering etc. I'm simply not sold on post 2012 stuff not in games and if that's possible even less so tech-wise. I think lot or overwhelming amount of the scattering stuff is simply not possible in "PBR" or with "dynamic GI",or "it just works" manner.

AFAIK Carmack said it's not worth it until 4K and not much else?

 

[GhostofWar]

AFAIK Carmack said it's not worth it until 4K and not much else?

I can't find the tweet he made about it although it is posted in a thread here somewhere. He was saying the expectations on the performance uplift from dfr were way above reality, at the time 2-3 times uplift were being thrown around and he was calling BS on that. I'm not sure if this came before the tweet or after but it's him talking about it.

 

[xz321zx]

I see the tweet now,

https://twitter.com/x/status/1391869530327052291

he's not adressing the concept but the current hardware limitations because there's still a lot of scan out lag. And I saw it has to be within 10ms from eye tracking data to scan out and that's not within reach now. I think some custom fog volume can be fast lane vs usual converging stuff.

You can cut it down but you can see it.You can't cut down the number of pixels rendered nearly as aggressively as you might think, because several times a second your eyes will dart to a new position, and the latency from movement through eye tracking, through rendering and displaying a new frame shows a lot of blur.

 

[snc]

I see the tweet now,

https://twitter.com/x/status/1391869530327052291

he's not adressing the concept but the current hardware limitations because there's still a lot of scan out lag. And I saw it has to be within 10ms from eye tracking data to scan out and that's not within reach now. I think some custom fog volume can be fast lane vs usual converging stuff.

Dont understand this "hardware limitations", gt7 use full res where you looking and dramaticly lower outside of it

Essentially, areas outside of your focal point are rendered at a dramatically lower resolution, closer to 240p than 4K I'd say

You will not see it playing in psvr2

 

[swaaye]

Any of you play LONN? I stumbled upon it during the Steam sale. Solid little indie game here. It's like a combo of Alyx, Walking Dead S&S, and Deus Ex. It's hard to believe it was apparently made by 3 guys. It has some jank, especially with your full physics body, the full physics enemies, and interactions, and gripping things is somewhat tricky, but it's the most entertaining VR game I've found in the last year. Actually, I might call it one of the most engaging VR games in general. Story-based immersive sim sorts of things are rare eh. Dishonored style climbing options everywhere are included. I've put 6 hours into it so far. Some impressive missions.

 

[pjbliverpool]

Sounds like the Crystal has now implemented eye tracked foveated rendering at the driver level. Very impressive if it works well.

 

[swaaye]

Sounds like the Crystal has now implemented eye tracked foveated rendering at the driver level. Very impressive if it works well.

The Pimax subreddit is a nice place to find real users talking about it. People seem very impressed with the visuals, but the FOV is narrower than Index. There seem to be some QA issues, from lens defects, LCD bad pixels, and broken parts. Face fit sounds average. Controllers are hated and the tracking is barely serviceable. They are madly working on the software and have reps on reddit helping, which is reassuring.

Apparently it is due to hit Amazon in August at which point it would be much easier to deal with a return if you run into problems.

 

[Davros]

Steam Among us -30% £2.79
New VR map

 

[Davros]

StarWars Squadrons is now £3.49 (-90%) on steam (dont know for how long)
It supports VR

 

[eastmen]

Steam machine vr ?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1701015101841752199

 

[cheapchips]

There's an interesting evolution in ideas from the datamining. Valves next VR product was thought to be self contained unit running Deck hardware, talking to a Snapdragon XR for tracking, until this latest set of Valve updates.

The Arm chip in the HMD running tracking and wireless communicating with a separate, more powerful, base console makes a whole lot more sense. The datamining/patients shows that they'd be running a dedicated 'hotspot' for the headset, skipping a load of regular stuff WiFi stuff. Should help with latency / image quality.

Even at its cheapest, this'll be expensive. Maybe Valve will resurrect the subscription model they were considering for the Index.

 

[GhostofWar]

There's an interesting evolution in ideas from the datamining. Valves next VR product was thought to be self contained unit running Deck hardware, talking to a Snapdragon XR for tracking, until this latest set of Valve updates.

The Arm chip in the HMD running tracking and wireless communicating with a separate, more powerful, base console makes a whole lot more sense. The datamining/patients shows that they'd be running a dedicated 'hotspot' for the headset, skipping a load of regular stuff WiFi stuff. Should help with latency / image quality.

Even at its cheapest, this'll be expensive. Maybe Valve will resurrect the subscription model they were considering for the Index.

When you say expensive are you thinking quest pro expensive, apple vision pro expensive or varyo expensive?

 

[cheapchips]

When you say expensive are you thinking quest pro expensive, apple vision pro expensive or varyo expensive?

At a minimum Quest 3 unsubsidized price + an unsubsidized console price. Er, somewhere in the $1500-$2000 range, if we're lucky.

 

[Davros]

So I have a friend who would like to try out some vr porn purely for research purposes you understand. Does he need a special browser that supports vr ?

 

[Karamazov]

No, any modern browser should work, it works great on the quest browser...a Friend told me of course.